carry concealed guns in Colorado without a permit passes house 40-25

[Zebo]

Crime is actually way down last 20 years you just hear about it more because of internet and mass media. You should know abut that classy when these dudes start ridiculous threads about black people are all coming to kill whitey sensationalizing shit.

Anyway that don't even matter. I personally think right to self defense is a fundamental right - to not be a victim of someone bigger stronger faster more violent. Especially for women and old people where they don't stand a chance. Cops will be there `15 min after they are raped, robbed or killed. Not good enough.

 

[Scotteq]

Crime is actually way down last 20 years you just hear about it more because of internet and mass media. You should know abut that classy when these dudes start ridiculous threads about black people are all coming to kill whitey sensationalizing shit.

Well, along those lines: I am far, far more upset that the media - {by virtue of their non~reporting on the issue} - seem to devalue the lives of the black and hispanic minorities who make up a large proportion of the criminals murdering each other for Gang and Drug related reasons.

 

[classy]

You are all arguing with classy as though he's intelligent and can understand the facts you lay out for him. Good luck with that.

woo woo
everybody clap your hands
he came up with something witty
yeah


................go blow a mule

 

[classy]

I don't know why anyone is quoting numbers, lol. Never disagreed with the numbers. I can't stop Antwan and Terrence from shooting each other over drug turf. I can't keep Nicky from from helping Angelo whack some guy over bad debt. I can't stop Billy Bob from getting drunk and shooting Mary Jane, his first cousin he just got done humping in some backwater town in Jerkwater USA. I can't keep Luis and Jorge from car jacking somebody who is trying to buy drugs in their neighborhood 2 AM on Saturday morning. I can't save any of these people and more than likely no law can stop these people either.

But maybe the right law could have prevented a the woman who had some mental issues from buying gun and killing her two teenagers. Maybe we could have saved the 31 shot at VA Tech by a man mentally unstable again who purchased a gun and went ballistic. Maybe I can prevent these. This law to me is irresponsible for many reasons.

 

[Zebo]

You can kill defenseless people a lot quicker and a lot more without guns. I wont go into it to give any ideas. But what guns do is stop that.

 

[irishScott]

I don't know why anyone is quoting numbers, lol. Never disagreed with the numbers. I can't stop Antwan and Terrence from shooting each other over drug turf. I can't keep Nicky from from helping Angelo whack some guy over bad debt. I can't stop Billy Bob from getting drunk and shooting Mary Jane, his first cousin he just got done humping in some backwater town in Jerkwater USA. I can't keep Luis and Jorge from car jacking somebody who is trying to buy drugs in their neighborhood 2 AM on Saturday morning. I can't save any of these people and more than likely no law can stop these people either.

But maybe the right law could have prevented a the woman who had some mental issues from buying gun and killing her two teenagers. Maybe we could have saved the 31 shot at VA Tech by a man mentally unstable again who purchased a gun and went ballistic. Maybe I can prevent these. This law to me is irresponsible for many reasons.

We're quoting numbers because you're arguing to punish the majority for the actions of an extreme minority. Those numbers help demonstrate that.

The laws preventing the mentally unstable from legally buying guns are already in place. The issue is reporting and identifying said people, and holding those who sell to the mentally unstable properly accountable.

Edit: Plus, as I pointed out, more people are saved by the public owning guns than are killed by psychopaths on rampages.

 

[classy]

You can kill defenseless people a lot quicker and a lot more without guns. I wont go into it to give any ideas. But what guns do is stop that.

I have never seen the fire department show up to a fire and spray gasoline on it. More guns is not the answer for guns.

 

[irishScott]

I have never seen the fire department show up to a fire and spray gasoline on it. More guns is not the answer for guns.

Your analogy is flawed. A gun is either fire or water depending on who uses it and for what reason.

 

[classy]

We're quoting numbers because you're arguing to punish the majority for the actions of an extreme minority. Those numbers help demonstrate that.

The laws preventing the mentally unstable from legally buying guns are already in place. The issue is reporting and identifying said people, and holding those who sell to the mentally unstable properly accountable.

How does this law allowing to carry concealed with no permit or anything validating why they are carrying concealed make anyone safer? And the very people who you so graciously want to allow them to carry concealed without validation, are the very ones who are shooting each other. They aren't killing the bad guys. Instead they are losing it, sometimes under the influence and shooting each other over the lawn.

 

[irishScott]

How does this law allowing to carry concealed with no permit or anything validating why they are carrying concealed make anyone safer? And the very people who you so graciously want to allow them to carry concealed without validation, are the very ones who are shooting each other. They aren't killing the bad guys. Instead they are losing it, sometimes under the influence and shooting each other over the lawn.

You just condemned 1200 people as murderous psychopaths who will kill the moment they are allowed to carry (note many probably already own guns). Any proof of that? Do you even know any of their names? Nope.

A psychopath with a gun is going to do what they will with it whether the law says so or not. The issue is psychopaths possessing guns, carry laws that would be ignored anyway are irrelevant.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

No. Have you looked at places like the UK, France, Germany and Japan lately?

Your point is a flawed.

One can easily counter this point by pointing to European nations with a strong tradition of lax gun laws or mandatory gun ownership laws such as Switzerland, Finland, etc

There is also the issue of societal, cultural, racial, governmental, historical and economic differences between those nations you've listed and the US which skews any comparison to be made.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

What states?

Vermont has never had a requirement for a permit, and it's neighbor NY who has about the most ridiculous gun laws (based BTW on political favoritism to give out permits to those who played ball, go figure) has a higher per capita crime rate. We here in the western part of the state tend to not shoot each other because it's considered wrong. Of course in the cities people kill each other with whatever they have. It's more civilized there.

 

[Fern]

Show me one drug dealer that went into a place and shot 20 people? Find me a pimp who lost his mind and decided to shoot people at a school board meeting? How many crime lords do you know of who just went nutts and decided to put a bullet in a congress womans head? You deny reality to try and defend your opinion. You argue criminals, but these tragedys aren't being committed by criminals.

Classy,

I don't see how any of this has to do with allowing CC.

Those troubled people who went crazy and shot at school board members or the incident AZ etc weren't the least bothered about following the laws for CC, or any law for that matter.

Unless someone can show us that relaxing CC laws actually makes some people go crazy there will never be a link between the two.

With or without CC, with or without gun permits, these deranged people were going to carry out their mission. Relaxing or tightening CC laws has no effect on the type of situations you seem concerned with.
-------------------------

I understand the absurdity in allowing people to openly carry, but by putting on a coat you're now in violation of a CC law.

OTOH, having taken the course here in NC to get the CC permit, I found a lot of benefit in the course. I'm speaking specifically of that part of the course where the state laws are discussed. The laws about when, and when not to use your gun. There are situations were a person might think use is justified, but state law says otherwise. Not many laws are 'common sense'.

I'm afraid without the course there will be people pulling their weapon under what they think are totally justifiable situations only to find themselves in big trouble.

Fern

 

[spidey07]

Fern,

I also got more out of the class from the legal aspect and explaining scenarios when you can and can't. Also liked the nice booklet the state provided explaining everything clearly and concisely from a a law perspective.

I think anybody that wants to carry should absolutely take the class, for their own benefit. A big part of me agrees with requiring it, especially from a gun safety side, then the shall not be infringed side takes over and says no. Even at a gun range you see people do stupid shit.

If you have a lick of sense then you would take the class regardless to understand the law and make sure you understand and are proficient with your weapon.

 

[xj0hnx]

But maybe the right law could have prevented a the woman who had some mental issues from buying gun and killing her two teenagers. Maybe we could have saved the 31 shot at VA Tech by a man mentally unstable again who purchased a gun and went ballistic. Maybe I can prevent these. This law to me is irresponsible for many reasons.

The law isn't irresponsible you idiot, the people that commit the crimes are. What part of that can't you get through your imbecilic skull? How twisted does your mind have to be to think that because people can carry legally without a license that somehow someone that wouldn't have committed a crime is going to magically start shooting people because it's legal to carry? You need some serious mental counseling.

 

[spidey07]

The law isn't irresponsible you idiot, the people that commit the crimes are. What part of that can't you get through your imbecilic skull? How twisted does your mind have to be to think that because people can carry legally without a license that somehow someone that wouldn't have committed a crime is going to magically start shooting people because it's legal to carry? You need some serious mental counseling.

Just to test his theory out I put a loaded gun in my hand just now. Nope, no sudden urge to commit crimes or kill people. Mythbusted.

 

[CallMeJoe]

Just to test his theory out I put a loaded gun in my hand just now. Nope, no sudden urge to commit crimes or kill people. Mythbusted.

Must be the wrong gun. Try one of those super-scary "Assault Rifles" or a Glock with an extended magazine...

 

[spidey07]

Must be the wrong gun. Try one of those super-scary "Assault Rifles" or a Glock with an extended magazine...

Lulz, do I need to post pics?

 

[adairusmc]

Must be the wrong gun. Try one of those super-scary "Assault Rifles" or a Glock with an extended magazine...

No urge found here.

 

[Veliko]

Your point is a flawed.

One can easily counter this point by pointing to European nations with a strong tradition of lax gun laws or mandatory gun ownership laws such as Switzerland, Finland, etc

There is also the issue of societal, cultural, racial, governmental, historical and economic differences between those nations you've listed and the US which skews any comparison to be made.

If my point was flawed then it means the post I was replying to had a flawed argument in the first place. The poster was saying that the states with stricter gun controls were 'worse' than those with more lax gun controls but didn't expand the argument beyond that.

 

[highland145]

No urge found here.

That's because of the calming effect of ATP&N has on everyone. Just don't close your browser or you might go psycho.

 

[ConstipatedVigilante]

Its all fine and dandy until people start shooting each other over all kinds of little things.

Scenario

Everyone has a gun.

Man A sees someone shooting someone from a building corner. He does his civic duty and puts this miscreant down (man B) with his own firearm. There by eliminating the threat to the local civilians.

Until it is revealed seconds later man B was defending himself from man C (who was getting dangerously close to man B's gas tank). Man D inside the gas station witnesses the entire thing and guns down man A -to defend the people.

We dont live in the wild west people.

That's quite a scenario you got there. Ever think about the university shootings where if someone, somewhere on campus had had a gun, then many lives would have been saved?

 

[OutHouse]

^ for update.

 

[Zebo]

Fern,

I also got more out of the class from the legal aspect and explaining scenarios when you can and can't. Also liked the nice booklet the state provided explaining everything clearly and concisely from a a law perspective.

I think anybody that wants to carry should absolutely take the class, for their own benefit. A big part of me agrees with requiring it, especially from a gun safety side, then the shall not be infringed side takes over and says no. Even at a gun range you see people do stupid shit.

If you have a lick of sense then you would take the class regardless to understand the law and make sure you understand and are proficient with your weapon.

Nothing wrong with a class spidey remember Well Regulated

REGULATE
(Oxford English Dictionary, 2nd Edition, 1989)

1) To control or direct by a rule, principle, method, etc.

2) To adjust to some standard or requirement as for amount, degree, etc.

3) To adjust so as to ensure accuracy of operation.

4) To put in good order.


In fact I think class should be paid for by gov in HS for every kid as " necessary to the security of a free State"

 

[spidey07]

Nothing wrong with a class spidey remember Well Regulated

REGULATE
(Oxford English Dictionary, 2nd Edition, 1989)

1) To control or direct by a rule, principle, method, etc.

2) To adjust to some standard or requirement as for amount, degree, etc.

3) To adjust so as to ensure accuracy of operation.

4) To put in good order.


In fact I think class should be paid for by gov in HS for every kid as " necessary to the security of a free State"

Totally agree. Firearm safety and training should be mandatory in high school.