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Car continues to roll back after putting it in park

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Just to note, my comments from that old post are specifically related to jacking up one side of the car in the air with the auto in P and no parking brake or wheel chocks, it CAN roll off the jack in that condition with an open diff.

Parked on the side of the road with both drive wheels on the ground? Highly unlikely. Even in the theoretical event of a patch of frictionless ice under one tire and on a steep incline it would only roll a short distance before it locked up again as soon as it was clear of this magical ice.

Relying on P to park a car with all 4 wheels on the ground (is perfectly fine), vs. jacking a side of a car in the air with an open differential are two completely unrelated things.

That park pawl and ring are considered a safety device and are among the strongest and most rigourously tourtured and tested parts on a car.
 
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coxmaster said:
In general most people with an automatic simply don't use the parking brake (i do use it)
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This hasn't been my experience - maybe it's the way we're taught here, but everyone I've ever been in a car with uses the handbrake. It would be considered pretty unusual to not use it.
 
Mike Gayner said:
This hasn't been my experience - maybe it's the way we're taught here, but everyone I've ever been in a car with uses the handbrake. It would be considered pretty unusual to not use it.
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It's a jersey north america thing. My parents never use the p-brake, none of my friends use it, and most random people I've met don't use it.
In cars made 20 years ago, the parking brake was a significant pain in the ass to operate. Instead of being a hand device that you pull or release, it was a foot pedal with a release located next to the latch for popping the hood. For anyone who is old or obese, leaning over to release the brake was worse than pulling teeth.
 
In many GM cars, the foot pedal PB releases with a second push, there's no handle to pull. Push on, push off. Easy for even grandpa to do.
 
ShawnD1 said:
It's a jersey north america thing. My parents never use the p-brake, none of my friends use it, and most random people I've met don't use it.
In cars made 20 years ago, the parking brake was a significant pain in the ass to operate. Instead of being a hand device that you pull or release, it was a foot pedal with a release located next to the latch for popping the hood. For anyone who is old or obese, leaning over to release the brake was worse than pulling teeth.
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Don't lump NA in with your parents and friends. Back in Colorado every single person I know uses the parking brake any time they're shutting the car off. It's part of driver's ed, and was part of my driving test (you got points marked off your park job if you forgot the brake). Just because you know a bunch of idiots doesn't mean the entire area is that way. I'm actually shocked an appalled to hear there are people that don't use it. Even more shocked to hear somebody think that's normal in this country.

Gayner, don't listen to this guy. He's surrounded by a special kind of stupid apparently and doesn't speak for this country. It's quite unusual not to use it here.
 
gorcorps said:
Don't lump NA in with your parents and friends. Back in Colorado every single person I know uses the parking brake any time they're shutting the car off. It's part of driver's ed, and was part of my driving test (you got points marked off your park job if you forgot the brake). Just because you know a bunch of idiots doesn't mean the entire area is that way. I'm actually shocked an appalled to hear there are people that don't use it. Even more shocked to hear somebody think that's normal in this country.

Gayner, don't listen to this guy. He's surrounded by a special kind of stupid apparently and doesn't speak for this country. It's quite unusual not to use it here.
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Indeed. Moreover, he's flat-out wrong about parking brake controls. My parents had a 97 Dodge Caravan where the parking brake was a foot pedal with a pull-release. Last summer I rented a Volkswagen Routan where the parking brake was a foot pedal which you stepped on to engage and again to release.

Many SUVs and vans still use pedals for parking brakes rather than a lever in the center console.
 
Apex said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by System_Mechanic
i know people who wont use the Pbrake with a Manual. they just put in gear and expect it to be there when they get back. lol
I do that at the track.
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Yes, I do too, unless the paddock isn't flat... then I have to use a chock.
 
Zenmervolt said:
"Can" happen and "has even a remote possibility of happening in the real world" are very different things.

While it's definitely possible if one drivewheel is on glare ice and the other has grip and the incline is steep, the chances of those factors coming together are incredibly slim. Better than 99% of the time (hell, probably better than 99.9999% of the time) just putting the automatic in "Park" is perfectly fine.

And this is coming from someone who always uses his parking brake.

ZV
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Someone in this thread has experienced it. That's good enough for me to recommend that people always use the damn parking brake.

And of course you keep the parking pawl from being damaged.
 
Throckmorton said:
Someone in this thread has experienced it. That's good enough for me to recommend that people always use the damn parking brake.
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Fair enough. I recommend using the parking brake too. I just don't see it as some sort of immanent safety risk (I don't even see it as negligence) to rely on the "park" function of an automatic.

Throckmorton said:
And of course you keep the parking pawl from being damaged.
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Eh, the parking pawl is designed to take the stresses that it takes. IMO this line of reasoning is like saying not to ever go around corners because steering causes wear in the tie rod end joints. Yes, wear technically occurs, but the parts are designed to take it.

ZV
 
Zenmervolt said:
Eh, the parking pawl is designed to take the stresses that it takes.
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The park pawl is supposed to be engaged after you have come to a full stop. What I've seen happen quite a few times is people try stopping the car in a hurry and they end up putting it in park before it has completely stopped. That's generally a bad thing because you're not supposed to do that. If you get into the habit of engaging the park brake before you put the car in park, applying the brake before coming to a full stop just puts a little wear on the brake rather than putting a bunch of stress on the pawl and making the car lurch back and forth for a second.

I've never actually seen a park pawl failure but that lurching thing is still annoying.
 
Zenmervolt said:
Fair enough. I recommend using the parking brake too. I just don't see it as some sort of immanent safety risk (I don't even see it as negligence) to rely on the "park" function of an automatic.



Eh, the parking pawl is designed to take the stresses that it takes. IMO this line of reasoning is like saying not to ever go around corners because steering causes wear in the tie rod end joints. Yes, wear technically occurs, but the parts are designed to take it.

ZV
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But it takes some movement before it stops motion. That is what puts stress on it. My Jeep moves back at least 3" before it locks.

What the OP is describing is because of damage to the pawl. So that's the whole point of this thread.
 
Everyone in my family uses the brake. The old man used the brake, so all the kids do too. It became a habit early on.
 
Throckmorton said:
But it takes some movement before it stops motion. That is what puts stress on it. My Jeep moves back at least 3" before it locks.

What the OP is describing is because of damage to the pawl. So that's the whole point of this thread.
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And sometimes the steering knuckles fail too. That has more to do with the variances in manufacturing than with damage from relying on the parking pawl.

The pawl is designed to handle those forces, do you really think the engineers are so monumentally stupid that they can't foresee the amount of backlash that they themselves have designed into the parking pawl system? Sure, sometimes a weaker-than-normal pawl will get through quality control, but I've seen far more failed parking brakes (cable stretch, broken ratchet mechanism, rusted cable, etc) than I've seen failed parking pawls. On the balance it's far more likely that the parking brake will fail than the pawl.

ZV
 
there should be no debates.

Automotive safety experts recommend the use of both systems to immobilize a parked car, and the use of both systems is required by law in some jurisdictions, yet many individuals use only the "Park" position on the automatic transmission and not the parking brake. It’s similar with manual transmission cars: They are recommended always to be left with the handbrake engaged, in concert with their lowest gear (usually either first or reverse). The use of both systems is also required by law in some jurisdictions. However, when parking on level ground, many people either only engage the handbrake (gear lever in neutral), or only select a gear (handbrake released).
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Also, i should point out to those calling others morons that your wheels should be always be turned towards the curb when parked and you should inspect your vehicles each time before you get in to drive...assuming your Mr. Perfect. Since no one is, most all of us perform safety violations all the time, from running through lights, pulling out in front of others to not properly park your car. there is more to safety than just using the P brake.
 
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System_Mechanic said:
there should be no debates.
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I don't believe there's any debate about whether one should use both, rather the debate is largely about the amount of legitimate risk involved in only using the "Park" function of the automatic. While using both is obviously preferred and recommended, the simple reality is that the likelihood of any sort of dire consequence from using only the "Park" function is incredibly small.

ZV
 
I've tried reading all the posts about other people's car doesn't stop moving after putting the car in park. Everyone says to use the parking brake. Well, I just bought a 2003 Mercury Mountaineer and parked it at home behind my other vehicle and I did have the parking brake on. When I went outside about an hour later, it was up against my other car. Thinking I was crazy, I didn't really think to much of it, especially since it did no damage what so ever. Well same thing happened tonight. Went out to get dinner and my car was up against my son's car, but again, there was no damage. The car is very much in park and have the parking brake on. I'm thinking it moves so slowly and that's why there is no damage to the vehicles. I want to know what this is because I don't want it to finally hit another car and do damage. Can someone PLEASE help??
 
caskcs1 said:
I've tried reading all the posts about other people's car doesn't stop moving after putting the car in park. Everyone says to use the parking brake. Well, I just bought a 2003 Mercury Mountaineer and parked it at home behind my other vehicle and I did have the parking brake on. When I went outside about an hour later, it was up against my other car. Thinking I was crazy, I didn't really think to much of it, especially since it did no damage what so ever. Well same thing happened tonight. Went out to get dinner and my car was up against my son's car, but again, there was no damage. The car is very much in park and have the parking brake on. I'm thinking it moves so slowly and that's why there is no damage to the vehicles. I want to know what this is because I don't want it to finally hit another car and do damage. Can someone PLEASE help??
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Your park pawl is damaged and your e-brake needs an adjustment.
 
lisamaza said:
I'm having a problem with the parking on my car. This started happening recently. I'm not on an incline, but when i put the car in park, it continues to roll back anywhere from 6 to 12 inches. Sometimes it happens. Sometimes it doesn't.

Last night I had to use the emergency brake to stop it from rolling. Is this expensive to fix? I know nothing about cars and have an appt with the toyota dealership on monday and want to know how expensive it will be, or whether it requires fixing at all.

Thanks to anyone who can help.
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God damn! It's not an "emergency brake" it's a PARKING BRAKE YOU DOLT! Obviously you don't use this newfangled device which is why you've destroyed your parking pawl in your transmission!
 
lisamaza said:
thanks for responding. Do you think this is a problem that needs to get fixed? Is it safe to leave it as is?
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Fix it. If the pawl is damaged, it very well might completely fail later.

The parking brake is also known as the Emergency brake for a reason.....it's not designed to be the primary thing holding the car in place.

In an automatic, that job falls to the parking pawl. In a stick, it's supposed to be left in 1st or reverse.

The brake is a fail-safe, so you don't want it to be the only thing keeping the car in place.

And while it's messed up, do this: Put it in park, then slowly (with the brakes) allow it to move however far it needs to engage the pawl. THEN apply the emergency brake.
 
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