Canon lo jacks there carts now

[13Gigatons]

Have just refilled the CL5 CL8 cartridges on Canon iP4200 after ink low and ink out message was received and LED light on cartridges was flashing. Easy to refill, same as BCI-6 cartridges. Once reinstalled, LED ink low lights keep flashing and status monitor indicates low ink. The printer allowed three more pages to print before ink out warning came up and printer stopped. Cancelling print job and restarting brought up the low ink warning again and a further three pages of print before the ink out warning stopped the print job. After this hapened about fout times, a message came on screen saying correct ink level cannot be detected, click OK to resume printing. Then a message came up saying refilled cartridge is being used, do you want to keep printing. Click yes and then a message saying more or less that the ink count on the cartridge was being disabled and this was recorded in printers memory and Cannon would not be laiable for damage caused to printer. Click OK and print jobs resumed, LED light on cartridges extinguished.
It appears that from this stage on the printer cartridges can be refilled and the printer will print all jobs, but the low ink warning is disabled. This means the level of the inks in the cartridge will have to be carefully visually monitored as there is no means for the printer to detect a cartridge running dry ans stopping the print job before damage is caused to the printheads. It also appears to mean that Canon can detect that refilled cartridges can be used and which may void any warranty work on the printer.

So you can refill these cartridges but it means that the low ink warning is disabled and Canon will know this if any warranty work is required - so user beware. However, the CL5 CL8 cartridges seem to have less ink in them than the BCI-6 cartridges, about 6ml less for the colours and they cost an exorbitant Australian $27 each, A$135 for a replacement set for the iP4200. After two lots of reflling the cartridges as compared with buying two sets of Canon cartridges, you would be way ahead, even if you had to throw the printer away and buy a new one!!!

This could bring up some interesting legal questions, especially in the US, since the use of OEM only supplies cannot be mandated by the manufacturer. Nor can usage of third party supplies be used as the basis for denial of service unless the failure can be directly attributable to the supplies.
I'm curious about the chipped cartridge. What would happen if the cartridge is topped off prior to getting the low ink warning? Would it still detect a low ink situation based upon droplet count or is the LED/prism still used? What would happen if one of the contacts on the cartridge was damaged (or disabled by a piece of tape) - would it give an error message and not allow printing, or would printing continue on without benefit of the chip?

http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=515


1. Less ink in the carts.
2. Can refill but it does not measure the ink level of 3rd party ink.
3. Warns that you just voided your warranty.
4. No 3rd party carts yet.
5. Models: Canon Pixma iP4200, iP5200, iP6600D, Canon Pixma MP450, MP500, MP800

 

[Zepper]

That has been discussed heavily here in the AT forums. If you'd done your homework here, you would have gotten one of last year's models. I just ordered 12 quality tanks for the Pixma for under $48.

.bh.

 

[13Gigatons]

Originally posted by: Zepper
That has been discussed heavily here in the AT forums. If you'd done your homework here, you would have gotten one of last year's models. I just ordered 12 quality tanks for the Pixma for under $48.

.bh.

I'm confirming and updating information about the new carts. Since nobody here has actually tried to refill one to get an idea of what it would do. It seems the new carts are pretty high tech in that you can't just refill them like a gas tank.

I was aware of the change and don't own a new model.

 

[eplebnista]

Thanks for the information! :thumbsup:

 

[Macro2]

RE:"Click yes and then a message saying more or less that the ink count on the cartridge was being disabled and this was recorded in printers memory and Cannon would not be laiable for damage caused to printer"

Yep this opens a lot of legal questions. Canon would have to prove that the 3rd party ink damaged the printer. It's all set up for that. They disable the low inlk warning and when the print head goes from no ink they blame it on the 3rd party ink.

Will be interesting to see what happens. I suspect someone will knock off their cart or find a way of flashing the printer so it will read the chip...

 

[Macro2]

RE:"I just ordered 12 quality tanks for the Pixma for under $48."

Just ordered 18 for $41. Or 36 for $76.

 

[13Gigatons]

Originally posted by: Macro2
RE:"I just ordered 12 quality tanks for the Pixma for under $48."

Just ordered 18 for $41. Or 36 for $76.

Is the quality any good and what is the site ?

 

[Zepper]

Hey 13Gig,
. You're "Mr. Swiftink", aren't you?

.bh.

 

[13Gigatons]

Originally posted by: Zepper
Hey 13Gig,
. You're "Mr. Swiftink", aren't you?

.bh.

Pretty much, had bad experience with other cheap ink and then took a chance and ordered some swiftink and it was good. But I still look at what others are buying and what they think.

 

[episodic]

IP 1600 has changed too. . .

So are there any 'good' printer manufacturer's left? Or is it all over now (the cheap printing ability). . .?

 

[13Gigatons]

Originally posted by: episodic
IP 1600 has changed too. . .

So are there any 'good' printer manufacturer's left? Or is it all over now (the cheap printing ability). . .?

Plenty of IP3000, IP4000, IP5000 and IP8500 left on the market if you want to buy still. Also don't count out the 3rd party guys just yet I bet they figure a way around the new carts.

 

[Monika777x]

Can you use the Ink Refill kits on a Canon IP 1600 printer?

 

[13Gigatons]

Originally posted by: Monika777x
Can you use the Ink Refill kits on a Canon IP 1600 printer?

Yes but they need to be the new kind of ink made for the 1600, 4200, 5200.

 

[Diasper]

This is why I got one of the few remaining Pixma IP5000 in the UK having heard about all this and then having found out supplies of the older models were drying up.

I nearly had to pay an exorbitant sum for the printer but luckily a few semi-cheap (UK pricing that is) were left

 

[Monika777x]

Where can I buy this new kind of ink made for the 1600, 4200, 5200, which will enable my Canon IP 1600 to be compatible for ink refills? If there is a website I can but it from, I would really appreciate the link.
Thanks for the reply

 

[Diasper]

In a way i suspect the way forward with the newer printers will be to use a continuous ink flow system:
- not using smaller cartriges
- bulk this way saves even more money over any compatible cartidge anyway
- no need for compatible chipped cartidges which might never see the light of day or else be rather expensive - small companies don't have the R&D & manufacturing scales to produces these chips easily and cheaply - for this reason alone it was an excellent move by Canon

 

[13Gigatons]

Originally posted by: Monika777x
Where can I buy this new kind of ink made for the 1600, 4200, 5200, which will enable my Canon IP 1600 to be compatible for ink refills? If there is a website I can but it from, I would really appreciate the link.
Thanks for the reply

http://www.inksupply.com/ and http://www.alotofthings.com are the two places I recommend.

They don't have the newer ink yet though for the 1600, 4200, 5200, etc.

Also: http://www.inkgrabber.com/canonlist.htm

 

[eplebnista]

Originally posted by: 13Gigatons

Originally posted by: Monika777x
Where can I buy this new kind of ink made for the 1600, 4200, 5200, which will enable my Canon IP 1600 to be compatible for ink refills? If there is a website I can but it from, I would really appreciate the link.
Thanks for the reply

http://www.inksupply.com/ and http://www.alotofthings.com are the two places I recommend.

They don't have the newer ink yet though for the 1600, 4200, 5200, etc.

Also: http://www.inkgrabber.com/canonlist.htm

Thanks for the links! :thumbsup:

 

[Lemon law]

That is the bottom line for refilling the new chipped Canons.--negotiate some nag screens and lose ink monotoring---the warranty question is iffy---Canon might not honor cartridge related problesm but must still warrant the rest of the printer.-----but cheap prefilled cartridges are not an option for the new chipped Canons.----at least until the chip problem is solved---some say by June/06.

In terms of ink---its only one or two ml's less than in the previous generations---but the chip seems to cost $2.25 extra per cartridge.------But the chromalife 100 inks are very close in color balance with the previous generation and those refilling are using the same inks they used in refilling the previous Canon printers with very good results.

I certainly refuse to buy these new rip off chips-----but Canon is sending the message that they want to eliminate competition---and its going to be the future of Canon inkjets-----when they break these chips its gonna be time to bring out a new Canon printer line up.

But for the refiller the chipped Canons using the CLI_8 cartridges are not all that bad except you must monitor ink levels-----unless you have a printer using the super small BCI-24 ---and there you can't see ink levels and refilling will be so often it could get to be a giant pain. So forget buying anything based on the ip1600 printer engine.

 

[Peter]

On the positive end of things, ink level detection might be more precise on the chipped cartridges, saving you money on ink (and possibly wasted photo paper).

 

[Pepsei]

in theory, couldn't they make a "chip reseter" that you can use to reset the counter on them and then refill the ink?

 

[Lemon law]

To Pepsei,

In theorty they could make a chip resetter---------exactly what they have been working on for six months now------Canon seems to have learned the Epson lesson and made that option very difficult.

That a company that did (past tence) offer value now retreats and gets greedy is sad---very sad.