Originally posted by: InflatableBuddha
Originally posted by: InflatableBuddha
Originally posted by: eleison
I agree with you. However, I think the government should not excessive tax or regulate the gas prices. I would let market forces decide how much gas should be worth. Having a government decide something is always rife with inefficiencies. As gas gets increasingly rare, it will naturally become more expensive.
Fixed.
It is the demand for oil, more than the supply shortfall, that will affect gas prices in the future. As China and India modernize and their citizens purchase vehicles, this will put a tremendous strain on world oil production (together, these two countries account for almost half of the world's population).
Would you rather the government slowly increase gas taxes over time to wean us off our addiction, or leave market forces as is and suffer a dramatic, huge price increase in the near future?
Originally posted by: eleison
The USA has already felt a dramatic, huge price increase before... It was called the energy crisis of the 70's. To increase the price of gas artificially by putting an emphasis on taxes is to introduce inefficiencies that can hurt the economy. Even without being taxed to death with respect to gasoline prices, the American public has already started to use more efficient cars on their own.
Canadian consumers certainly have - the top 7 selling models are all compact or subcompact cars
Link. As for Americans, I don't agree that they're driving the most efficient vehicles
Link. The Civic is the only compact on the list. Apart from the Accord and Camry, the list is dominated by large pickup trucks.
Originally posted by: InflatableBuddha
Originally posted by: eleison
Having the government dictate prices.. especially artificially higher prices via taxes... that just hurts the economy as a whole. Lower oil prices have always helped the US economy. After all, we are the biggest and one of the
most efficient in the world
Umm...actually, the U.S. has 5% of the world's population and consumes 25% of the world's oil. (I'm not taking a holier than thou attitude; Canadians are nearly as bad on a per capita basis.) How is that efficient?
Originally posted by: eleison
Why is this so bad? Just because the USA consumes more oil doesn't mean it is less efficient. As the largest economy, the US SHOULD consume the most oil. For the amount of oil that the US consumes, the benefits outweigh the negatives. Not only has the USA been able to create the best university, it has also been able to become one of the largest exporters of food to the rest of the world. The average USA worker is also one of the most productive. Their researchers, one of the worlds best. Guess who created the internet? It wasn't the Europeans with their "I'm holier than thou because I drive a small econbox car" attitude.
You're side-skirting the issue. I agree that the US has created some incredible inventions and has world-class universities, but that has nothing to do with efficient use of oil. Plenty of other developed countries (including European ones) are also world-class in these respects and they use a hell of a lot less oil.
Originally posted by: InflatableBuddha
Originally posted by: eleison
..........Regardless if your dad drives an expedition.. heck, maybe because he drives an expedition, he is more efficient than his contemparies in europe, or asia where the economy is not as good.
This is not the reality. Gas is $6/litre in many European countries - no surprise that they drive more subcompact vehicles that get over double the fuel economy of an Expedition.
Originally posted by: eleison
Whatever floats their boat. If the average American worker needs to drive his Expedition to be one of the most productive workers in the world, so be it. With most European countries having issues with high unemployment, having econo boxes that sip gasoline should not be a concern to those governments. Their priorities should be about getting Europeans employed instead of trying to see what new regulation they can think up that will force people to drive wimp mobiles - what new gasoline taxes that they can intro, etc..
So far the USA government has been smart enough to understand its about getting Americans hired and working and not about raising taxes on gasoline to make the hippies happy.
Reducing unemployment is a laudable goal. Regardless of whether many Europeans are unemployed, they have a tremendous social safety net that will support them through rough times. The same can't be said in many areas of Canada or the US.
Again, you're missing the point about the Expedition (or any vehicle). In fact, when large numbers of people are in single-occupancy vehicles, they occupy a disproportionate amount of road space, increasing congestion and thus commuting times, and taking away from time people could be spending working (so much for increasing productivity
). Imagine a city bus with 50 people on it. Now imagine those same 50 people each in their own vehicle on the same road. Which do you think is a more efficient use of the road network?
Originally posted by: InflatableBuddha
Originally posted by: eleison
Maybe your dad functions well (I'm assuming
because he knows that when he's done with his job, he can get in his big car and
run over logs as if it was nothing..
Yep...because people have to do this everyday on the freeways and city streets :roll:
Originally posted by: eleison
Whatever it takes to make the average USA worker one of the most efficient. Its a world economy. If the USA worker doesn't have to worry about all the gasoline taxes that his European, Asian, African competitor have to, the more the American can focus on doing a better job.
See my point above.
Originally posted by: InflatableBuddha
Originally posted by: eleison
verses some wimppy guy in europe who has to drive
a small hatch back home every day.. kinda depressing
And there you've pretty much summarized one of the biggest problems with North American consumerism..."OMFG, I must have the biggest, most powerful vehicle ever." How does that help you get from point A to point B any faster?
Pull your head out of your tailpipe.
Originally posted by: eleison
If Americans had the biggest, most powerful vehicle in world.. who cares??? Its a world economy, if the Americans can afford these gas guzzlers. Who cares? At the end of the day, the Americans work harder and smarter than almost everyone else. They can afford their toys... Remember it is sometimes not just about getting to point A to point B faster, its about how you get there
OIL is going to be used up.... the question is who's going to use it all up. Saving oil and delaying the inevitable does nothing. It has been noted that necessity is the mother of all inventions.
When there is no oil, there will be alternative energy sources.
I agree with you here. If people want to pay to drive a guzzler, and to drive more, that is their choice. But they will spend more hours at work to pay for that privilege. Americans work some of the longest hours in the developed world...and are very stressed. Why not make smarter transportation choices, work less and spend more time enjoying life?
Indeed oil will be depleted eventually. The longer that prices are kept artificially low (as they are now), the longer people will procrastinate about finding alternatives. If we instead turn up the heat gradually, this will give us the right balance of time and incentive to find alternative energy sources.