Can someone explain why...

[JWMiddleton]

I'd like someone to explain something to me.

Last year we bought a 26" LCD TV for the bedroom. I connected it directly to the wall for cable service without a converter. We get a bunch of stations, but the station numbers are weird. We get 2, 2.1, 2.3...37.84, etc. The stations are a combination of analog and digital. The highest rez being 1080i. I have no complaint with it.

So, I bought a USB hybrid tv tuner from Fry's THINKING I would get the same reception as I got on the TV. I scanned for DIGITAL stations and it found hundreds, but I could not watch any of them. I rescanned on ANALOG and got 20, or so, stations. The unit is a Clear QAM TV tuner. I noticed on the digital scan that the stations were greyed out and a lock icon was next to each number. I assume this meant that Comcast had me locked out of it.

Why the difference with the TV? Is there a USB device that will work as the LCD TV tuner does? I know there are boxes that will take a CableCARD, but I'd like to do it without one as those devices are more expensive.

-----------------UPDATE-------------------
I ordered an AverMedia Hybrid Volar Max TV Tuner from Amazon. It works just like the TV when plugged directly into the cable outlet without a converter box. The ClearQAM tuner is the hardware ticket, but the SOFTWARE is where the magic happens. The software that came with the ATI tuner had a 2004 copyright date, which means it came out before the 2009 Digital Conversion. The AverMedia kit was sold to work with WMC and provided no software in the package. I plugged in the USB tuner, Windows acknowledged it and installed the drivers. I brought up WMC and went through configuring the tuner and scanned for channels. HDTV channels look great and a nice channel guide helps me plan out my recording/time shifting for up to 2 weeks.

 

[nickbits]

Your TV is picking up OTA signals. You bought a cable tuner. You need an ATSC tuner.

 

[JWMiddleton]

Your TV is picking up OTA signals. You bought a cable tuner. You need an ATSC tuner.

So, you are saying that OTA signals are sent via Comcast cable?

I just did a quick search and found this:

ATSC (Advanced Television Systems Committee) - Digital television format defined by Advanced Television Systems Committee which will be replacing NTSC (analog) broadcasts on June 12, 2009. The switch from analog to ATSC is also known as the Digital Transition. TVs with a built-in ATSC tuner will not require a digital converter box, and may even be capable of receiving and displaying High Definition programming. Read more about ATSC at Wikipedia.

THEN I check the device I bought and it supports ATSC. It is the Diamond TVW750USB ATI Theater HD 750 USB TV Tuner. The specs says it supports:

o ATSC, DVB-T,Clear-QAM Digital TV Support (unencrypted digital TV)
o PAL, SECAM, NTSC Analog TV Support

My original understanding was that ATSC was picked up via an antenna OTA. But, the info above indicated that the USB device should work as the TV does. So, I am still missing something. When I've gone shopping for this, I've can't find any sales people who know about it.

 

[vi edit]

What are you using for the tuner to view? Windows media center or the built in application? Lots of times the way computer tuners handle the QAM station is different than TV's. They are much more sensitive and dumb at the same time and have troubles mapping the QAM ID's to what the provider has labeled. TV's are much less sensitive and are more accurate about it. Or if the tuner application is trying to pull a channel listing that isn't up to date it will try to put the wrong channel on the wrong QAM ID.

You might have to go into your tuner program and manually map/add the QAM channel ID to the appropriate station as provided by your media company.

 

[sdifox]

you should be able to just tell your tv to just catch digital channels.

 

[JWMiddleton]

What are you using for the tuner to view? Windows media center or the built in application?

The HTPC I built has 64-bit Vista. The USB tuner manual said that you needed Win 7 MC or the included application to work properly. So, I used the included app: ArcSoft TotalMedia.
When scanning for digital channels it got to ~200+ (83% progress) and blew up. I could only get it to list the channel it found if I stopped it from scanning before 83%.

Needless to say I returned the device, but want to understand what is going on and if there is a device that will work for me.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I thought Comcast required you to use their hardware now, to decrypt the content.

 

[Aikouka]

You mention that you're seeing channels blocked, but is your TV receiving a channel that your USB adapter is blocking?

Your TV is picking up OTA signals. You bought a cable tuner. You need an ATSC tuner.

It doesn't sound like he has an antenna hooked up for it. I haven't really kept up with any sort of internal antennas, but are they good enough to pick up ATSC OTA HD broadcasts? I always had to use an external antenna, and had to be really picky about its location.

The decimal notation does really sound like OTA broadcasts though.

Ugh, this makes me really feel "out of the game" in regard to cable stuff. I never use my Comcast cable.

So, you are saying that OTA signals are sent via Comcast cable?

No. OTA means "Over the Air". He's talking about your local TV stations and their broadcasts. If you'd like to see what's available in your area (the quality is usually far better than cable/satellite), check this website: http://www.antennaweb.org

 

[JWMiddleton]

You mention that you're seeing channels blocked, but is your TV receiving a channel that your USB adapter is blocking?

It doesn't sound like he has an antenna hooked up for it. No antenna is attached.

Ugh, this makes me really feel "out of the game" in regard to cable stuff. I never use my Comcast cable.

Correct, I am using Comcast cable for both TV and Internet.

No. OTA means "Over the Air". He's talking about your local TV stations and their broadcasts. If you'd like to see what's available in your area (the quality is usually far better than cable/satellite), check this website: http://www.antennaweb.org

I assumed by OTA he meant stations that are local and could be picked up if you had an antenna. I THINK that is Federally mandated.


Thanks for the link to antennaweb...Great site! One of my big problems is making my toys "Wife Acceptable." /sigh So, I still want to use my cable connection.

 

[JWMiddleton]

I thought Comcast required you to use their hardware now, to decrypt the content.

The TV works fine without a converter box and it is a small, cheap set. That is why I'm asking the questions.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

The TV works fine without a converter box and it is a small, cheap set. That is why I'm asking the questions.

I found the answer for you in their forums. -

Except for 2 models of Panasonic Plasma's that have tru2way available in certain markets, all new digital TV's only tune clear QAM with a direct cable connection. Comcast's business model is moving to encrypting all channels other than the lowest limited basic tier which will give you the lowest analog channels lineup ususally up to analong ch 23 or so depending on the system In addition, you will receive clear QAM local television stations in both SD and HD if available and a few more like QVC.

Tru2way was supposed to replace the set top box, but has had such a slow startup, that it might die off before it ever got started. If it even looked like tru2way was taking off, I'd say wait for a while, but it isn't going as hoped 2 years ago.

If you want more than just the locals in HD, you will need a HD STB. You will not be able to tune an any other channels in your current cable package directly as they are or will be encrypted.

 

[JWMiddleton]

OK, we know why the TV works, but why doesn't the USB Tuner work on the same channels?

 

[Aikouka]

If you want more than just the locals in HD, you will need a HD STB.

Wouldn't you need a HD STB to get the locals in HD anyway? I have a basic Comcast digital box (that I pretty much never use ), and the only local channels that I get are in EDTV (480p). I'm pretty sure I asked them one time if it was possible to just get the local channels in HD (without some crazy HD super bundle), and I don't think it was.

 

[JWMiddleton]

Wouldn't you need a HD STB to get the locals in HD anyway? I have a basic Comcast digital box (that I pretty much never use ), and the only local channels that I get are in EDTV (480p). I'm pretty sure I asked them one time if it was possible to just get the local channels in HD (without some crazy HD super bundle), and I don't think it was.

A TV that accepts a digital signal from cable, will pick up HD local channels in HD. With the Dynex (Best Buy) I bought last year, I get both analog and HD versions of all local stations, such as ABC, CBS, NBC and Fox. Some are in 720P format while some are 1080i, both of which qualify as HD quality. On my system "virtual" channel 2.1 is WSB HD. Atlanta's ABC affiliate. I do NOT use a coverter box.

I have an older non-HD 32" analog TV, that uses the "free" digital converter from Comcast. It picks up a lot more stations than the Dynex and use the regular channal numbers on the Comcast line-up. Since the TV is non-HD, I have no idea how this box would work with the Dynex, but I suspect the results would be what you are seeing: 480i or 480p.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

OK, we know why the TV works, but why doesn't the USB Tuner work on the same channels?

I don't know. Maybe the direct coax hookup lets it get around some of the HDCP?

 

[JWMiddleton]

I don't know. Maybe the direct coax hookup lets it get around some of the HDCP?

The USB tuner was directly connected as well.

Does anyone have a USB TV tuner working with a direct cable connection?

 

[Gintaras]

I'd like someone to explain something to me.

Last year we bought a 26" LCD TV for the bedroom. I connected it directly to the wall for cable service without a converter. We get a bunch of stations, but the station numbers are weird. We get 2, 2.1, 2.3...37.84, etc. The stations are a combination of analog and digital. The highest rez being 1080i. I have no complaint with it.

If you do a scan for TV channels, you'll get same channel x2 or x3 times. Just delete channels you don't watch- lower resolution, etc/you don't need. Leave those 1080 or you want to watch.

You might need to rescan TV channels once or twice a year.

 

[JWMiddleton]

If you do a scan for TV channels, you'll get same channel x2 or x3 times. Just delete channels you don't watch- lower resolution, etc/you don't need. Leave those 1080 or you want to watch.

You might need to rescan TV channels once or twice a year.

The TV is fine, it is the USB TV tuner I'm asking about. I used the TV to explain what I was expecting to see with the USB tuner.

 

[lamedude]

USB tuner is showing encrypted channels and probably crapped out when it saw to many. My guess was it was only tested with OTA.

 

[Gintaras]

I do have TV USB stick, Pinnacle that I've purchased about 2 years ago...don't use that much.
I can connect TV Antenna that came with USB Tuner, or....I've tried cable.
Cable did scan way more channels than TV antenna that came with TV tuner.
Do I care, how TV channel numbers are displayed on? NO.
On my TV, NY1 channel is 53-2, dunno, how it would be on that USB Tuner...And I would care less, if it would be different.
I do focus on CONTENT of TV channel, not, how they're "marked" in numbers on tuners....

What I like about this Pinnacle TV Tuner USB, I could be able to watch some TV channels if let's say I'm somewhere in the woods and all I have - a laptop(with charged batteries) and that USB TV tuner.

 

[JWMiddleton]

-----------------UPDATE-------------------
I ordered an AverMedia Hybrid Volar Max TV Tuner from Amazon. It works just like the TV when plugged directly into the cable outlet without a converter box. The ClearQAM tuner is the hardware ticket, but the SOFTWARE is where the magic happens. The software that came with the ATI tuner had a 2004 copyright date, which means it came out before the 2009 Digital Conversion. The AverMedia kit was sold to work with WMC and provided no software in the package. I plugged in the USB tuner, Windows acknowledged it and installed the drivers. I brought up WMC and went through configuring the tuner and scanned for channels. HDTV channels look great and a nice channel guide helps me plan out my recording/time shifting for up to 2 weeks.