Can R420 beat NV40? More speculation with some historical data...

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: otispunkmeyer
i dont much care for who is better....what i care for is that the competition between these two has raised the graphics bar immensly bringing us the very latest in technology. also it has given us two companies that both produce fantastic products..where as before if u wanted to game then nvidia was your only option............now if Nvidia and ATI joined forces..........oh yes......🙂

If NV and ATi merged, we would have a card 10% faster than the 6800U next year, for only $999.

 

[Insomniak]

Originally posted by: chsh1ca

Originally posted by: Insomniak

Try ArtX The only reason ATi is alive today is that acquisition

In the business acquisitions decisions, ATI is one up on NV. ATI bought Artx, NV bought most of 3dfx's IP/patents, and hired away loads of their engineers. I'd say that ATI got the better deal between the two. 😀

Uh, cause they won one round?

Let's wait and see. If ATi keeps the crown for 2 years, then I'll agree with you there, but flukes are always possible.

When the new ATi cards launch, we'll see how things look. Until then I say all bets are off.

 

[chsh1ca]

Originally posted by: InsomniakUh, cause they won one round?
Let's wait and see. If ATi keeps the crown for 2 years, then I'll agree with you there, but flukes are always possible.
When the new ATi cards launch, we'll see how things look. Until then I say all bets are off.

Well actually, I was making comments with an eye more towards the direction the two respective companies were headed. As far as I am aware Artx wasn't plunging headlong into folding, whereas NV's acquisitions are pretty much how 3dfx paid off some of its debts (IIRC).

In addition to that, if rumours and speculation are true, R300 vs NV30 was ATI's Artx acquisition vs NV's 3dfx acquisitions. It may have been and continue to be the only time we have seen post-3dfx tech. pitted against Artx tech -- if the rumours regarding the FX line's origins/influence are to be believed.

 

[Insomniak]

Actually IIRC Jen Hsun said the FX line incorporated 3Dfx tech. However, NV30 was really crippled to begin with...once they put a 256 bit memory bus on there (in other words, the 5900U) it became what it really should've been, and as we all know that's not much worse than ATi's offerings.

You're right though that 3Dfx was folding...primarily due to NV beating them at their own game 🙂 Artx, I believe, was still just starting up when ATi bought them - otherwise we'd have all bought some kickass ArtX based add in boards at some point 🙂

 

[SneakyStuff]

I think the really interesting thing here is the company XGI, who has already said they will be the market leader in 2007, what if they release a card that beats both nvidia AND ati? :Q The prospect of new competitors is interesting, because i'm becomming bored with these ati and nvidia clashes. But no, I don't think ati is going to beat nvidia this time, because in actuality, the core of the nv40 is NOT 400 Mhz, the shipping boards will come with a core that is almost 100 MHz higher, or more! 🙂

 

[Insomniak]

XGI beating NV and ATi huh?

<--- Believes it when he sees it.

I don't see it happening any time soon, unless they buy ArtX.

 

[SneakyStuff]

They have SiS and Trident 3d backing them now, but from what I hear, they've got cash out the ying yang. So a little research and development might yeild some suprising results eh? 😛 I'd be happy to see 3 competitors in the ring, more competition would = lower prices! 🙂

 

[nitromullet]

Yeah, XGI would be interesting as a third player. However, with the results of the Volari V8 Duo, it will be while before that happens.

 

[FluxCap]

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

nvidias geforce ti line was killing ATI's line until the 9700pro rolled around and ATi would not relinqish the lead for the whole generation of cards

eh? nvidia is still killing ati. they dominate the desktop market....

ati's integrated puts em like 1-2% more overall, but intel is #1 (since integrated is where the volume is)

edit: err.. but i guess you were talking performance, eh? you're spot on there 🙂

ATI controls the market share over Nvidia. Make sure you do your research first. 🙂

 

[Insomniak]

Originally posted by: FluxCap

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

nvidias geforce ti line was killing ATI's line until the 9700pro rolled around and ATi would not relinqish the lead for the whole generation of cards

eh? nvidia is still killing ati. they dominate the desktop market....

ati's integrated puts em like 1-2% more overall, but intel is #1 (since integrated is where the volume is)

edit: err.. but i guess you were talking performance, eh? you're spot on there 🙂

ATI controls the market share over Nvidia. Make sure you do your research first. 🙂

You're confused. It's true that Nvidia has most of the desktop market - the only reason ATi has a slight market share lead is because they have huge integrated chipset volume - which means basically dildo.

 

[FluxCap]

I am not confused, just stating fact. 🙂

 

[zephyrprime]

The NV40 and 800xt have the same number of functional units but the nv40 has got some interesting architechtural improvements which give it a speed edge including an additional shader math unit per pipe and 32x0 z values per clock. Does the R420 also have keen new architechtural features? Who knows. But it does have a much higher clock which can't be underestimated. However, it seems like both the NV40 and 800XT will be more memory limited compared to the nv35 & r300 which may hold either of them back until faster memory comes along.

 

[Blastman]

The latest I?ve heard is that the R420 will have 8xFSAA and a new AF scheme (technology).