Can an employer legally do this?

[sze5003]

Basically what it comes down to is this, I can give my 2 weeks notice and he can walk me out the door right then and I would be considered layed off and eligible for unemployment benefits and nothing else. He could fire me, but probably wouldn't and I could file a wrongful termination suit against the company. What I will probably do is take a weeks vacation and come back and give my notice and be walked out the door and start my new job (if I get it) at that point.

This sound more like what I mentioned earlier. Do you hate your job that much that you just want to leave without getting another one ?

 

[PenguinPower]

Basically what it comes down to is this, I can give my 2 weeks notice and he can walk me out the door right then and I would be considered layed off and eligible for unemployment benefits and nothing else.

Possibly. It could be argued that you were risk once you gave notice, so they had to cut you immediately. Ultimately up to the state to decide.

He could fire me, but probably wouldn't and I could file a wrongful termination suit against the company.

Wrongful termination based on what?

What I will probably do is take a weeks vacation and come back and give my notice and be walked out the door and start my new job (if I get it) at that point.

Probably your wisest move.

 

[PenguinPower]

nope. companies don't have to do shit with your vacation if they don't want to. its a benefit to working there its not a right.

Again, depends on the state. Some state require companies payout accrued vacation if they offer it as a benefit.

 

[TheSiege]

This sound more like what I mentioned earlier. Do you hate your job that much that you just want to leave without getting another one ?

I have interviewed, I am just waiting to hear back, I am pretty sure I got the job, I just like to be prepared for any and everything.

 

[sze5003]

Yeah I would wait until they give you a close decision and then take your vacation and come back then do what you want.

 

[Wreckem]

Pretty sure they legally have to pay you for that. :hmm:

KT

Depends on state law. Not all states require unpaid vacation to be paid out.

 

[spacelord]

In many situations I think the company is better off to pay the vacation to the employee leaving...especially for positions difficult to fill.. otherwise I'd be tempted to take my 4 weeks.. then come back and say buh'bye.

 

[Peter Nixeus]

In California, if you give your two weeks notice and they let you go the same day = they have to pay you for those two weeks AND cashing out your unused vacation (given you never gave them a reason to let you go in the first place). A company that has sensitive information or IP stuff would do that to prevent you collecting useful information/contacts to take to your new company - which is pretty normal and they suppose to still pay for your last two weeks...

 

[TheSiege]

yep, I work at a pretty big Data center for a pretty big company

 

[Corporate Thug]

nope. companies don't have to do shit with your vacation if they don't want to. its a benefit to working there its not a right.

O'rly?


http://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/faq_vacation.htm

Q.


What happens to my earned and accrued but unused vacation if I am discharged or quit my job?



A.


Under California law, unless otherwise stipulated by a collective bargaining agreement, whenever the employment relationship ends, for any reason whatsoever, and the employee has not used all of his or her earned and accrued vacation, the employer must pay the employee at his or her final rate of pay for all of his or her earned and accrued and unused vacation days. Labor Code Section 227.3. Because paid vacation benefits are considered wages, such pay must be included in the employee's final paycheck.

Usually, the correct answer to legal questions is "it depends on the state"

 

[PenguinPower]

In California, if you give your two weeks notice and they let you go the same day = they have to pay you for those two weeks AND cashing out your unused vacation (given you never gave them a reason to let you go in the first place). A company that has sensitive information or IP stuff would do that to prevent you collecting useful information/contacts to take to your new company - which is pretty normal and they suppose to still pay for your last two weeks...

Not unless you have a contract stating such. They have to pay you out immediately, but only for hours worked. And, it's only accrued, unused vacation.

 

[Corporate Thug]

In California, if you give your two weeks notice and they let you go the same day = they have to pay you for those two weeks AND cashing out your unused vacation (given you never gave them a reason to let you go in the first place). A company that has sensitive information or IP stuff would do that to prevent you collecting useful information/contacts to take to your new company - which is pretty normal and they suppose to still pay for your last two weeks...

I don't think there is a law that requires the two weeks of pay...they just do it because less of a liability to pay out than give access to confidential info to an employee on his way out for another two weeks.

 

[WackyDan]

I wonder if the employer's action now makes the employee eligible for unemployment benefits?

Nope. You give notice, it is within the employer's right to ask you to leave right there and then... no pay, no unemployment.

The notice you gave them was a professional courtesy on your part, not theirs.

I can't think of any states in the U.S. where this isn't acceptable on the part of the employer.

 

[aaronlove]

Some states like MD prohibit employers from withholding vacation after termination of an employee. You should look up state laws regarding this.

But IMO, 2 weeks notice is an outdated concept anyway.

Every situation is different and you really have to consider how your employer has treated people in the past when they have departed with sufficient notice. Some places will escort you off of the premises immediately and this is often done to protect company secrets etc. If you are going to work for a competitor you become a liability at that moment. Every situation like this that I know of, the employee was compensated for the 2 weeks and was received the vacation time that they were entitled to was also paid out. My guess is that this is done to avoid any potential legal battles that may arise from poor conduct.
However there are alot of employers who will throw people under the bus quick as shit and will often look for reasons to terminate an employe before his final two weeks end. These are the people you should watch out for and I would advise keeping your new job a secret until your last day when dealing with companies like this.

My best advice it to get in touch with people who have left with notice and see how their experience went. Or you can ask co workers that you can trust. Letting the wrong person know that you intend to quit in the near future can also have bad consequences.

Good post. What you say is very reasonable.
We should maintain our rights and interests.

 

[Chapbass]

Haven't read the whole thread, but when I put my two weeks in with my old employer, they termed me immediately becuase they said I was going to a competitor....its a VERY loose competitor, but they did have a point, so I said see ya and walked out.

A very anti-climactic end to my 5 years there 😀

 

[TheSiege]

I am going from a data center to a semi conductor company, not even close to competitors.

 

[JoeMcJoe]

Pretty sure they legally have to pay you for that. :hmm:

KT

Depends on the state.
WA doesn't have, CA has to.

 

[smitbret]

Only an idiot gives 2 weeks notice. When was the last time an employer gave an employee 2 weeks notice before firing them? If you have to ask yourself whether it would be a good idea to put in 2 weeks notice then it probably isn't.

 

[TallBill]

Only an idiot gives 2 weeks notice. When was the last time an employer gave an employee 2 weeks notice before firing them? If you have to ask yourself whether it would be a good idea to put in 2 weeks notice then it probably isn't.

I've given notice everywhere that I worked and never been fired.

 

[Sonikku]

Don't even bother putting in two weeks notice when leaving a job. They sure as hell won't give you two weeks notice to look for another job when they're preparing mass lay offs, on the contrary. They will keep it a secret right up to the hour it is announced. They don't give a shit about you and will discard you like trash at their earliest convenience.

If anything, showing them a courtesy in the form of letting them find a replacement will only be used against you, like in OP's case. There is no "social contract" anymore between one American to another. So long as you are being used and treated as disposable, you must respond in kind unless they have given you cause to do otherwise.

 

[lxskllr]

Don't even bother putting in two weeks notice when leaving a job. They sure as hell won't give you two weeks notice to look for another job when they're preparing mass lay offs, on the contrary. They will keep it a secret right up to the hour it is announced. They don't give a shit about you and will discard you like trash at their earliest convenience.

If anything, showing them a courtesy in the form of letting them find a replacement will only be used against you, like in OP's case. There is no "social contract" anymore between one American to another. So long as you are being using and treated as disposable, you must respond in kind unless they have given you cause to do otherwise.

This goes against the way I've ever conducted myself, but it's sadly true. By giving notice, you''re taking all the risk, for only small intangible gain. If I had the smallest inkling the company would try to screw me, I'd use up my leave, and tell them I wasn't coming back the day before I started the new job.

 

[Sonikku]

Like I said, if they give you reason to do differently and have done right by you by all means give them two weeks notice. But those kinds of businesses are a dying breed. It's a very different America from what it was half a century ago. Gone are the days when a small business, tasting greater success at the heels of your hard work lead to more profit, most of which went to the leadership but still a part of it found it's way back to the other employees that helped to make them so successful.

Small businesses have been crushed to make way for Corporations. The boss that knew you and worked on the third floor in a small business has given way to the boss in the penthouse at the corporate headquarters half a world away that does not know you or your face and regards your existence as nothing more than a number in a large equation for profit. He doesn't see your livelihood at stake or the adverse effect laying you off will have on you and your family, he sees the bottom line and nothing else. And after all your heart work, when you have been used up and milked dry, you will be discarded without warning and your departure will be heralded as a need to "trim the fat" when asked for commentary by the media.

Turn about is fair play. If the company wants you to really care about the over all health of the business and it's continued success, they have to respect your ownership in making the business' success a reality in kind. If they want to just work you to the bone and funnel any difference in success or profit in lieu of your hard work to the top executives, they can do that too. Just spare us rhetoric on why we should be killing ourselves or busting our butts and working towards a heartattack for them.

 

[1sikbITCH]

Only an idiot gives 2 weeks notice. When was the last time an employer gave an employee 2 weeks notice before firing them? If you have to ask yourself whether it would be a good idea to put in 2 weeks notice then it probably isn't.

Only an idiot employer hires someone who is willing to abandon the current job with no notice.

 

[jaedaliu]

Basically what it comes down to is this, I can give my 2 weeks notice and he can walk me out the door right then and I would be considered layed off and eligible for unemployment benefits and nothing else. He could fire me, but probably wouldn't and I could file a wrongful termination suit against the company. What I will probably do is take a weeks vacation and come back and give my notice and be walked out the door and start my new job (if I get it) at that point.

Make sure it's 3 weeks accrued PTO, not available PTO. If you haven't accrued it yet, you'll have to pay them back.

 

[Sho'Nuff]

You've been hosed. They're supposed to pay you for that.

Yup - from 2. http://jobsearch.about.com/od/employeerights/a/workplaceviolations.htm

"Unpaid Vacation Time
The FLSA (Fair Labor Standards Act) does not require employers to pay employees for vacation time. However, if the employer does provide paid vacation, the time accrued (collected) becomes part of the employee's compensation. If you were fired or quit, you are entitled to payment for vacation time accrued as per company policy."

That said, an employer can let an at will employee go for pretty much any reason, as long as its not an impermissible reason. Letting you go because you gave your notice is not an impermissible reason. It might raise a question as to whether you were fired (in which case you could collect unemployment) or whether you quit (in which you likely would not be eligible for unemployment). Many employers tend to let employees that give notice "expire" naturally for this reason - the employer is the one paying the unemployment, after all.