Calling Laptop Users - Need a Laptop Briefing...

[SaturnX]

Hey everyone,

Well my friend's got a couple of old P2 laptops, and I just might be getting one off him for quite cheap. They not the latest/greatest, my sole purpose of it is to be used as a travel asset, and primarily for university when I go off in just about 1.5 years.

Anyways, what should I know about laptops? card slots, different types? RAM? HDDs?

I know my way around desktops extremely well, but I'm breaking into the world of Laptops for the first time, so any information would be grealy appreciated.

Thanks!

--Mark

 

[WilsonTung]

A Pentium II Laptop is fine for office work.

Things to consider - get at least an XGA (1024x768) screen and be aware that LCDs do not work too well outside their native resolution.

You can get a cheap PC Card NIC online - I bought one used for 10 $US. Most new laptops have integrated ones.

Laptop Hard Disks are slow - mainstream is 4200 RPM and performance is 5400 RPM.

 

[astroview]

I'm in college and I just don't think its that useful to own one unless you are commuting to school. I personally will buy one in law school but thats b/c I will not have access to a fast LAN at home.

And if you don't need it now don't buy it. In 1.5 years the technology will be much nicer than today's so there is no reason to buy a laptop now for use 2 years from now.

HD's are generally small in physical size, 2.5 inches and only about 4200 RPM nowadays. Older HD's might have been slower, I'm not sure.
RAM is 144 pin Dimms and often the bus speed of laptops is slower than that of the fastest desktops. This is starting to change though as 133 Mhz bus speed is starting to appear.
Card slots, if you have built in ethernet, usb, modem, and firewire you don't need more than one PC Card slot I think. New laptops generally have all those features and built in wireless networking too.

The most important things for a laptop are size, weight, screen size and resolution, battery time, and lastly performance. At least thats what I look at when buying one. The smaller you get the less useful it is for tasks outside of office work like using Office and Iexplorer. I like a small laptop because I can easily pop it into a book bag and go to school without having an 8 pound monster in a shoulder bag. I do tech support and I can promise you that the #1 complaint is that their laptop is too heavy. I personally like Dell and Apple laptops the most.

 

[astroview]

Oh yea, you can PM if you have anymore questions. I can go into more specifics if you want.

 

[gsaldivar]

My advice is to take the P2 only if you can get it for a song - meaning like somewhere around $100 or less. In my opinion, a P2 is simply too slow to be practical with any modern software. My advice would be to take the laptop if you want it, but expect to purchase a new one when you start in college 1-2 years from now.

It's simply impossible to find a campus today that is *not* expecting students to use some sort of internet-based information system. I use my laptop (Sony R505 "SuperSlim") extensively in my upper division classes. Homework, team collaboration, grading, registration, calendars, etc. etc. are being conducted with greater frequency on the internet. Expect to find CD-ROMs bundled with many of your textbooks. MS Office XP is included as part of the tuition on our campus - on top of that, add in any graphics, math analysis software, groupware, anything bundled with a textbook, and stuff you get from friends.

One of the most common mistakes I see people make when getting a laptop is underestimating the power that they need to get the job done. You can easily spot these people in a lab, the ones who are spending most of their time fiddling with old network drivers, software incompatibilities with obsolete hardware, insufficient RAM/HD space, not enough CPU power to run Java, etc. etc. instead of getting their work done.

Another thing is that laptops are made much lighter and thinner than they used to be. It's not uncommon to find some older models tipping the scales around 8-9 lbs. In itself not a big deal, but when you add the rest of your books and a 300-400 acre campus, it can be unbearable for more than a short walk.

The most important consideration in my opinion, should be the WEIGHT. Try to get the slimmest, lightest machine you can afford (Mine is 3.5 lbs.). Beware of cheap laptop prices - the rule of thumb is that the lower the price, the heavier the laptop. A laptop weighing between 2-3 lbs. should start at around $1500 and would be considered "lightweight". 3-5 lbs. is your "middleweight" laptop starting somewhere in the neighborhood of $1300. 5-7+ lbs. is considered a "heavyweight" and should start around $1000.

If you want to be able to play games on the road, you should look for either Mobility Radeon, or GeForce Go video chipset. Expect to find this chipset only in higher priced, and heavier laptops. If you commute a long distance to campus, you may find yourself with several hours to burn between classes from time to time - being able to fire up the latest 3D game can really make the time fly.

I hope some of this info is useful to you. Be sure to apply for Financial Aid when you make the college jump - you might be surprised to find that the cost of attending your school (including the cool technology) has been included in your aid award.

Good Luck!

 

[SaturnX]

Thanks so far, the main reason I want to get it off my friend is because I'll probably be able to get for around $50 CAD ($30 US), so even though it isn't the latest and greatest, it's got a nice price tag, and I'm not looking for performance with it, just want to be basic office tasks, and programming, (Visual Studio). I'll find more details about it later on, and I'll post them here to see what everyone has to say.

Any other information?

--Mark

 

[Dre]

$30 for a P2 laptop? I'd snatch that up quicker then a crack whore.

I'd piss away $30 on nothing and being able to get something actually usefull is a great deal!

 

[c0rv1d43]

For the price you have to buy it. There's no way that computer won't be useful enough to justify that price.

Just an observation or two, some running a bit counter to other suggestions:

1. Screen -- If you just do office stuff, even an 800x600 (SVGA) will do, though XGA (1024x768) is definitely better. But the most important thing about a notebook screen is that it be readable in all of the lighting conditions in which you need to use it. It's got to be TFT. Passive LCDs are dismal to use in anything but the best low-light circumstances.

2. Weight / Size -- I'd rather have a sore shoulder than buy a notebook that can't hack the work I need to do with it. Owning a computer is all about it providing the performance you need. Ten pounds is nothing. I can carry fifty pounds of books and computer from one end of O'Hare to the other when I need to, and I'm a decrepit old man. Anyone who lets a coupla pounds stand between him and the notebook computer that will do the job should eat some Wheaties and work out a little. <here endeth the sermon and "He ain't heavy, he's my brother" mode>



- Collin

 

[ObiDon]

<< I'd snatch that up quicker then a crack whore. >>


How quickly would you snatch up a crack whore???


For $30 how can you go wrong? The only thing about older laptops is that those hard drives seem ungodly SLOW to the point that it seems like the processor speed doesn't even matter. I have a laptop with 40MB memory and a P150, and my 16MB P90 system with a SCSI hard drive kicks th crap out of it! Opening programs seems to take forever compared to what I'm used to these days. At least it has a nice TFT screen. I can look at that thing all day and then when I switch back to my CRT it's like watching one of those blurry dream sequences on TV :|

But, then again, for $30 (or even $200) I'd take it and like it!

 

[hans007]

some laptop CPUs are upgradeable. most new ones are, and older p2s maybe with mmc-1 / 2 cartridges. batteries, wear down after a while.


i use a laptop at school, and well its just convenient to be able to take on campus, doesnt take up much space, and is quiet. they arent that expensive anymore. Especially since most laptops out there are at least 800mhz which is fast enough for almost anything, its not as hard to justify spending $1000 on a laptop even though its 700-1000mhz slower than top of the line desktops, since you dont really need that 700 -1000mhz more.

 

[SaturnX]

Exactly, since the price is right I feel that I HAVE to grab it, since I'll need one later, and nothing too expensive, i mean it's worth the price, I booted it up a couple days ago, runs like a champ, didn't catch the exact details since I was there only for a little while.

But actually.. I lied it'll actually cost me $30 US and an old P133 Desktop that my friend needs for one of his family friends

Personally I felt this was a great deal.

Anyways, one question is there only one type of expansion slot of laptops? Like I've seen some labelled as PC Cards, and other as PCMIA. Any difference at all?

--Mark

 

[HalfCrazy]

You are getting a very nice deal there. I bought a laptop off my brother for $50 bucks but the hdd was bad at that time. Then I went on-line and ordered another hdd for it. After I bought the new drive and installed it in the laptop. I had a total of $110 bucks into the laptop which is not too bad. Since it did all ready came with a Linksys PCMCIA ethernet-card.

It's not a power house or anything. It really comes in handy when the power goes out. Since I can all ways drag out my good 'old' laptop and surf the net. Which I had done many times when they was working on the power lines in my town.

 

[c0rv1d43]

As a practical matter the terms PC Card slot and PCMCIA are used more-or-less interchangeably. The original PCMCIA slots were 16 bit. Most of the time "PC Card" is used these days to indicate the later 32-bit specification, also called CardBUS. CardBUS slots will support 16 bit cards as well as the more recent 32 bit CardBUS cards. But, if you happen to get ahold of an older notebook with the 16 bit slots, it won't support a CardBUS card. I don't really remember just when the general switch from the 16 bit spec to the 32 bit spec occurred, but I think this P2 your talking about probably has the 32 bit slots. If there's a manual for the system, I'd check that. The Device Manager should also tell you the device name for the card slots, and you can look that up to make a determination. But, as I said, I'm almost certain that this P2 notebook will have the 32 bit slots.

Have fun with the new toy!

- Collin

Edited for a bit of clarification.

 

[astroview]

c0rv1d43 apparently knows more than me

 

[hans007]

actually. cardbus is a 32bit slot. its an extension of the older 16bit slots. there is no difference between pcmcia and pc card.


the consortium or whatever that designed pcmcia , changed the name to pc card, since its hard to say pcmcia since its an acronym. 16bit cards run at 5 volts, cardbus 32bit slots run at 3 volts. thats about the only difference. but the naming is purely cosmetic they were never different standards

 

[SaturnX]

What about RAM, I'm guessing Laptops don't use 168 pin SDRAM.. which is shame since I have so much left over..

--Mark

 

[c0rv1d43]

<< actually. cardbus is a 32bit slot. its an extension of the older 16bit slots. there is no difference between pcmcia and pc card.


the consortium or whatever that designed pcmcia , changed the name to pc card, since its hard to say pcmcia since its an acronym. 16bit cards run at 5 volts, cardbus 32bit slots run at 3 volts. thats about the only difference. but the naming is purely cosmetic they were never different standards >>



Yes, the CardBUS card standard is an extension of the original PCMCIA standard, but that really does make it a different standard, doesn't it? Just as html 4.0 is a different standard than html 3.0? CardBUS (32-bit) slots and the original 16-bit slots work off of a different bus connection specification and run at different voltages. It's confusing to end users because the change to calling the cards "PC Card" occurred just about the time that the 32 bit cards started coming out. I stressed the difference because I wanted to be sure that no one thought they could safely stick a CardBUS card into one of the original 16 bit PCMCIA slots. AFAIK you can't. I had an argument with a tech about this once, and he proved he was "right" by destroying two 32-bit cards by forcing them into an old 16 bit slot machine -- energized, naturally. I suppose they could have been destroyed due to a fault in the notebook system (or even a connector problem?), but we thought at the time that it might have had more to do with the voltage supplied by the old-style slot. At any rate, the tech conceded the argument. As for me, I'm just a dumb old physicist who does some sysadmin stuff to support his labs. I know the old 16-bit cards will work fine in the newer-style slots, but I wouldn't stick a 32-bit card into an old machine. I'll stick with that assessment until someone can show me some pretty good evidence to indicate that it would be safe.

- Collin