California man using "corporations are people" argument to challenge HOV lane ticket

[Dari]

What are the ramifications for this case?

link

A driver in San Rafael, California is attempting to appeal a traffic citation for driving alone in a High Occupancy Vehicle lane. Jonathan Frieman and his attorney, Ford Greene, argue that since Frieman had corporate incorporation papers in his car when he was stopped by an officer, he was actually carpooling at the time. Technically, the state of California's definition of personhood includes both "natural persons and corporations." But Frieman's out to do more than just skirt a $478 traffic ticket with a little fancy legal footwork.

He's sworn to chase the case all the way to the Supreme Court should the first trial not go his way in an attempt to "expose the impracticality of corporate personhood." If Frieman eventually wins his case, the victory could have serious implications on the US Supreme Court's Citizens United decision.

While the US legal system has weighed the benefits and drawbacks of corporate personhood for years, the issue became more clear in 2010 when the Supreme Court ruled that restricting corporate political spending violated the First Amendment. Granting corporations constitutional rights implies the entities themselves have personhood.

 

[Michael]

This case will be laughed at and tossed out of court and appeal will be denied.

Michael

 

[Kadarin]

The idea that "corporations are people" is something that should be laughed at and tossed out of court without appeal.

 

[glenn1]

"Personhood" means corporations have the legal and constitutional rights of natural persons (e.g. rights of contract, protection against unreasonable search and seizure, etc). It doesn't mean corporations are actually physical human beings.

 

[Cogman]

You are backwards. He is trying to attack the corporations as people legal ruling using the HOV law.

He likely won't get far.

 

[lotus503]

"Personhood" means corporations have the legal and constitutional rights of natural persons (e.g. rights of contract, protection against unreasonable search and seizure, etc). It doesn't mean corporations are actually physical human beings.

Sounds good until they have to be held accountable, then they aren't people.

 

[nehalem256]

"Personhood" means corporations have the legal and constitutional rights of natural persons (e.g. rights of contract, protection against unreasonable search and seizure, etc). It doesn't mean corporations are actually physical human beings.

Can I marry a corporation?

 

[wirednuts]

this guy is a hero! i hope he has enough money to go all the way to the supreme court. i was waiting for someone to do something like this- i didnt think about carpooling but i figured someone would find a clever way to show how stupid citizen united laws are.

 

[SheHateMe]

Don't drive in the HOV lane if there aren't enough people in the car, asshole.

People do this in Virginia all the time...and all the time, they get a ticket. The signs are clearly marked. Also, don't drive in the fucking express lane if you don't have an EasyPass, assholes!

 

[MovingTarget]

This case is just as much of a farce as the idea of corporate personhood.

 

[Michael]

"Personhood" means corporations have the legal and constitutional rights of natural persons (e.g. rights of contract, protection against unreasonable search and seizure, etc). It doesn't mean corporations are actually physical human beings.

This is why this case will be thrown out. It is a stupid case that completely misses the definitin of corporate "personhood" is. Even if you accepted the stupid basis for the case, he was carrying papers around and papers are not a corporation.

Corporaions have been "people" under law for pretty much since they were invented. For all the outcry about spending on the elections, there is no evidence that it made a difference last election and there are plenty of countries that do not limit corporate spending on elections and they also have no problems.

Michael

 

[Smoblikat]

Can I marry a corporation?

You cant marry a guy either, are guys not people?

 

[wirednuts]

Don't drive in the HOV lane if there aren't enough people in the car, asshole.

People do this in Virginia all the time...and all the time, they get a ticket. The signs are clearly marked. Also, don't drive in the fucking express lane if you don't have an EasyPass, assholes!

People do this in the internets all the time... and all the time, they get chastised. The op is cleanly linked. Also, don't bitch in the fucking period lane if you dont have your tampons, dick head!

 

[wirednuts]

You cant marry a guy either, are guys not people?

marriage is not a federal decision and in some states dudes are bonin ring fingers all the time

 

[DucatiMonster696]

The idea that "corporations are people" is something that should be laughed at and tossed out of court without appeal.

Unions aren't people either but they also get to influence elections.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

WHats that got to do with this case?

Oh right, nothing.

 

[SheHateMe]

People do this in the internets all the time... and all the time, they get chastised. The op is cleanly linked. Also, don't bitch in the fucking period lane if you dont have your tampons, dick head!

Hey, you stupid fuck. I was actually commenting about the shit people do in real life.

Please die.

 

[lopri]

Sounds good until they have to be held accountable, then they aren't people.

Let alone that they're creatures of the government. It's amazing how people so easily forget the "birth" of corporations.

Capitalism ≠ Corporatism

 

[dmcowen674]

this guy is a hero! i hope he has enough money to go all the way to the supreme court. i was waiting for someone to do something like this- i didnt think about carpooling but i figured someone would find a clever way to show how stupid citizen united laws are.

This

I hope he wins :thumbsup:

 

[Arkaign]

Unions aren't people either but they also get to influence elections.

Yep, it's quite literally insane that we allow unions OR corporations 'political speech', in other words the ability to pour millions upon millions into elections to drown out the voices of the individual. One man, one vote, contributions should never be allowed from anyone but individuals, and to hedge against corruption and undue influence, total political contributions annually should be very small, something like $100 per person max.

It'll never happen though, both the Republicans and Democrats are equally corrupt when it comes to knowing how to game the system. Citizens United, PAC money, what bullshit. I'd like to see a day when it's a capital federal offense to offer money/favors to a politician, or for a politician to accept them.

Why do we get such a shitty government? Probably because we sell it to the highest bidder. It's why our regulatory agencies get stuffed full of industry insiders who do nothing but protect the elites inside the industries they're supposed to be policing. It's the analogue to having the DEA run by the cartels (hahah, not like they don't have mutual goals, the last thing either would want to see is a change from the status quo).

 

[Dari]

This

I hope he wins :thumbsup:

No, you want him to lose. He wants to lose too.

 

[soulcougher73]

Lets see...he probably has little money compared to corporation who own the world and government. Im going to say he gets assassinated

 

[Abraxas]

As much as I agree with his cause, this is inane. Articles of incorporation are not themselves the corporation and so them being present in the car does just about as much as having a birth certificate of another person in the car would, jack shit.

 

[DCal430]

Unions aren't people either, it is time to end people hood for non-people. People are individuals not groups and and not corporations.

 

[gevorg]