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Bush

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Originally posted by: destrekor
if i had been of age, I would have voted for him.

im not republican, not democrat, not independent. niether stand by the values I do. And yet they all stand by the values I do.
Bush definitly reminds of of Woodrow Wilson right about now, and that's a good thing. The general of the army has always wanted more troops over there, but bush and him dont think it would go over well with the public. and it wouldn't. everyone cries about war. Why is that? Why does everyone cry and say war is preventable? WAKE THE FVCK UP! War cannot be prevented, for as long as we are the species we are, and especially as long as we have the technology. If something happens and we go back to caveman-age, then we'll just pound fists. Not so bad. But that won't happen. Peace is only something that exists inbetween war, and is the goal of every war. Peace cannot be attained without a war to fight for it. Look at history, and you will see this to be proven true.

sorry, lil P&N rant... but this does belong in the P&N forum though. 😉

i would have voted for Bush though had I been of age at the time. He definitly was the best choice, both in 2000 and 2004. None of here could handle the things he has to handle.
'sides, we all know (I hope) that a president is simply a tool and puppet of the government. He truely does not as much power as most of you liberal crybabies think he does. Read up on how the U.S. government works. (NOT on Democracy alone, maybe research Socialism and Federalism too... our government kind of mixes the better parts of the three.. maybe look up what a Republic is too, for that is what we are)
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someone just took a high school US History class and viewed every lesson through red-tinted glasses.

for every circumstance in history that seems to indicate that war is inevitable and necessary, there is another circumstance that shows the opposite. human history is not a collection of data points from a tightly controlled experiment. we can learn from similar situations in the past (vietnam -> now), but we cannot predict ANYTHING. to claim that wars, or other events, are inescapable because they've occured in the past is absurd.

if you took a history class or two, you should remember the severe stock market crashes that would occur every 20 years or so in the 1800's and early 1900's. by your logic, we should have experienced another "Great Depression". however, the Fed has learned how to intervene and prevent catastrophic economic downturns like those in the past.
 
Originally posted by: maddogchen
Originally posted by: Acanthus
This forum is severely liberal, youre gonna get liberal results...
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No, P&N is severely liberal, offtopic is about even from what I remember from the election result responses.
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That very well could be, its so bad in P&N that i cant even venture in there, and im an independant voter 😱
 
voted for him and stand by my choice.

I would support a constitutional ammendment to allow him to serve 2-3 more terms.
 
First one, I voted for Bush 😱, but Al Gore seemed like a tool, and he didn't have many huge policies to side on.

I voted for Kerry, no way would I vote for Bush on his 2nd term. Although Kerry's push against Alito, which failed, 🙁 showed his power as a leader. He was a better choice though.

Anyways...

Originally posted by: uhohs
p&n is that way -->
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Originally posted by: davestar
Originally posted by: destrekor
if i had been of age, I would have voted for him.

im not republican, not democrat, not independent. niether stand by the values I do. And yet they all stand by the values I do.
Bush definitly reminds of of Woodrow Wilson right about now, and that's a good thing. The general of the army has always wanted more troops over there, but bush and him dont think it would go over well with the public. and it wouldn't. everyone cries about war. Why is that? Why does everyone cry and say war is preventable? WAKE THE FVCK UP! War cannot be prevented, for as long as we are the species we are, and especially as long as we have the technology. If something happens and we go back to caveman-age, then we'll just pound fists. Not so bad. But that won't happen. Peace is only something that exists inbetween war, and is the goal of every war. Peace cannot be attained without a war to fight for it. Look at history, and you will see this to be proven true.

sorry, lil P&N rant... but this does belong in the P&N forum though. 😉

i would have voted for Bush though had I been of age at the time. He definitly was the best choice, both in 2000 and 2004. None of here could handle the things he has to handle.
'sides, we all know (I hope) that a president is simply a tool and puppet of the government. He truely does not as much power as most of you liberal crybabies think he does. Read up on how the U.S. government works. (NOT on Democracy alone, maybe research Socialism and Federalism too... our government kind of mixes the better parts of the three.. maybe look up what a Republic is too, for that is what we are)
Click to expand...

someone just took a high school US History class and viewed every lesson through red-tinted glasses.

for every circumstance in history that seems to indicate that war is inevitable and necessary, there is another circumstance that shows the opposite. human history is not a collection of data points from a tightly controlled experiment. we can learn from similar situations in the past (vietnam -> now), but we cannot predict ANYTHING. to claim that wars, or other events, are inescapable because they've occured in the past is absurd.

if you took a history class or two, you should remember the severe stock market crashes that would occur every 20 years or so in the 1800's and early 1900's. by your logic, we should have experienced another "Great Depression". however, the Fed has learned how to intervene and prevent catastrophic economic downturns like those in the past.
Click to expand...

i never said war is guaranteed simply because it has happened so many times before.. i merely stated it is human nature. we are too diversified and too ignorant, as a race, to fend off wars. there is a point in time where we will reach ultimate uniformity when it comes to meshing with eachother and learn to control ourselves before we cause damage, but I don't know if we will even exist long enough as s species to reach that point.
point being, if you research, not the history of man, but the hisotry of how man thinks, you will see that truely 'thinking' hasn't changed as we have. the way we solve problems is still the same, just technology has helped make it easier.
to not write a book about this is hard, but not doing so doesn't make it any easier for others to understand. but essentially, its human nature to be curious, to wonder, to show fear, to show strength... combine that, and across different cultures, and add technology, and arms races, power struggles, different beliefs/ideals, etc etc... and you will have a clash that will likely lead to a battle/war. explain to me how you see this to be false, and I will intently read what you write. but truely understanding human nature is the key to fight the urge to, well.. fight. from the playgrounds to the battlefields, power struggles are, at this point, inevitable. i wish it weren't so. but i dont see there ever being a point in time where we will not have wars, at least not in the anywhere near future. guaranteed.
 
Originally posted by: destrekor
i never said war is guaranteed simply because it has happened so many times before.. i merely stated it is human nature. we are too diversified and too ignorant, as a race, to fend off wars. there is a point in time where we will reach ultimate uniformity when it comes to meshing with eachother and learn to control ourselves before we cause damage, but I don't know if we will even exist long enough as s species to reach that point.
point being, if you research, not the history of man, but the hisotry of how man thinks, you will see that truely 'thinking' hasn't changed as we have. the way we solve problems is still the same, just technology has helped make it easier.
to not write a book about this is hard, but not doing so doesn't make it any easier for others to understand. but essentially, its human nature to be curious, to wonder, to show fear, to show strength... combine that, and across different cultures, and add technology, and arms races, power struggles, different beliefs/ideals, etc etc... and you will have a clash that will likely lead to a battle/war. explain to me how you see this to be false, and I will intently read what you write. but truely understanding human nature is the key to fight the urge to, well.. fight. from the playgrounds to the battlefields, power struggles are, at this point, inevitable. i wish it weren't so. but i dont see there ever being a point in time where we will not have wars, at least not in the anywhere near future. guaranteed.
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actually, your original position was that "history proves" that war is inevitable. now you bring in an unsubstantiated, and unprovable, description of the human psyche as the genesis of all war. i can't refute your position because you haven't demonstrated any truth to your argument. the burden of proof is on you.
 
Originally posted by: davestar
Originally posted by: destrekor
i never said war is guaranteed simply because it has happened so many times before.. i merely stated it is human nature. we are too diversified and too ignorant, as a race, to fend off wars. there is a point in time where we will reach ultimate uniformity when it comes to meshing with eachother and learn to control ourselves before we cause damage, but I don't know if we will even exist long enough as s species to reach that point.
point being, if you research, not the history of man, but the hisotry of how man thinks, you will see that truely 'thinking' hasn't changed as we have. the way we solve problems is still the same, just technology has helped make it easier.
to not write a book about this is hard, but not doing so doesn't make it any easier for others to understand. but essentially, its human nature to be curious, to wonder, to show fear, to show strength... combine that, and across different cultures, and add technology, and arms races, power struggles, different beliefs/ideals, etc etc... and you will have a clash that will likely lead to a battle/war. explain to me how you see this to be false, and I will intently read what you write. but truely understanding human nature is the key to fight the urge to, well.. fight. from the playgrounds to the battlefields, power struggles are, at this point, inevitable. i wish it weren't so. but i dont see there ever being a point in time where we will not have wars, at least not in the anywhere near future. guaranteed.
Click to expand...

actually, your original position was that "history proves" that war is inevitable. now you bring in an unsubstantiated, and unprovable, description of the human psyche as the genesis of all war. i can't refute your position because you haven't demonstrated any truth to your argument. the burden of proof is on you.
Click to expand...

i made the 'history proves' argument, 1) as a quick argument because I was tired, and 2) as an attempt to not have to bring up the more recent argument. they kind of go hand in hand though.
sure, it cannot be proved.. maybe I should become a philosopher or something? 😉
its up to you to either think deep about who we really are as a species, or continue to live the life you live. personally, i feel mankind is a pitiful species and the way behave as a species truely demonstrates our lack of appreciation for what we have, intelligence.
I mean, come on, we are destroying our very home. Have you ever heard of a creature that has ever done that? The dinosaurs, as a collective group of animals, survived for millions and millions of years. If that comet would have missed Earth, we probably wouldn't be here, and that would probably be for the better. As much as I enjoy life, I wouldn't mind an asteroid or comet striking the planet again and wiping out most of us humans, as long as I was one to survive. Hell, that ice age thing looks like it will happen first. Mother natures balance of equations.. humans start taking from and destroying the earth without replenishing it = mother nature removing the variable from the equation that is causing the problems. Maybe we dont go extinct in an ice age, thats highly unlikely. We are a smart and adaptive species. Thats our strong point. We will live. Likely a large portion will not. Hopefully when that time comes we can learn from it.
All that goes hand in hand with the idea that we need to dump all religion. Why? The quicker we move on as a species, the faster we can likely progress towards a more peaceful period. Face up to the fact there is no purpose to life, and no afterlife in a some place called 'heaven'. 'Heaven' is now, live it up for you only get one life. Again, the faster we can move toward that collective intelligence, the better life will get. But I don't think our mind is capable of comprehending something so simple, there must always be some illogical answer because we can't stand the idea that we don't have an answer to a nagging question. Its human nature.
There, again, by the time this thread dies, I will have written a book. I should copyright it now. 😉
seriously though, there is no 'proof' I can provide to you. Its called believe what you want. It all boils down to life. Philosophy at its best.
 
Originally posted by: spidey07
voted for him and stand by my choice.

I would support a constitutional ammendment to allow him to serve 2-3 more terms.
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Me too

3-10 for the first term and 10-20 on the second.
 
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