Bush Comments on Kerry's Tax Cut Rollbacks

Painman

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Feb 27, 2000
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(Hat-tip to Kos)

ANNANDALE, Va. -- President Bush stumped for votes and touted tax cuts Monday in northern Virginia, drawing more than 600 supporters and a few dozen Democratic protesters who said his presence in traditionally Republican Virginia is a sign his campaign is in trouble.

In between were Chris Ostendorff of Oakton and her son Chuck, two undecided voters who wanted to hear the president speak but were unsure if they would vote for him.

"I'm still making up my mind," said Chuck, who will be voting for the first time in November and wants to pursue a career in the military. "I was impressed with his speech, but I suspect I would also be impressed with a speech by (Democrat John) Kerry. It's going to be tough to decide."

At several points during Monday's rally, Bush touted the No Child Left Behind Act, which is designed to impose accountability standards on local school systems.

But Chris Ostendorff, a special education teacher, said the law has caused problems, particularly in special education, where students can't always meet a fixed federal standard.

"And I'm not sure how I feel about federal regulation" of local education, she said, still undecided about her vote.

Bush's rally was designed to show how his policies have enabled individual Americans to take "ownership" of the economy and to highlight entrepreneurial success.

Sharon Rainey of Great Falls was one of the entrepreneurs on stage with Bush. She talked about her business, FYI Network, an Internet-based referral and bulletin-board service. The Bush campaign said the tax cuts he supported saved her $1,200 last year.

Rainey, a Bush supporter, said she doesn't know exactly why the Bush campaign contacted her, except that they wanted a small business owner on the panel. She guessed that "a friend of a friend" told the campaign about her business.

Nobody reviewed or scripted her remarks, she said. "They just said, 'Tell your story,' so that's what we did."

She and her family met Bush briefly a few minutes before the rally at Northern Virginia Community College.

"He basically just told us to relax and that we were going to try and have some fun," she said. "He spent most of the time trying to make us feel comfortable."

Bush criticized Kerry's plan to eliminate the tax cuts for those making more than $200,000 a year, saying that the "the rich in America happen to be the small business owners" who put people to work.

Bush also said high taxes on the rich are a failed strategy because "the really rich people figure out how to dodge taxes anyway."

Asked about that comment, Jonathan Beeton, spokesman for Kerry's campaign in Virginia, said "George Bush can speak with authority about really rich people. ... That's his base, so I'm sure he knows what he's talking about. But that doesn't make it right."

In general, Democrats said, the fact that the Bush campaign stopped in Virginia during a recent campaign swing that has also covered the traditional battleground states of Ohio, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin shows weakness in Virginia.

"It seems he wouldn't come to Virginia unless he had a reason," said Virginia Democratic Party Chairman Kerry Donley. "He's seeing his support slip away, and he wants to stop the bleeding early."

Several dozen Kerry supporters demonstrated outside the rally, some wearing costumes dressed as "Miss Leader" and "Hallie Burton." Bush and Kerry supporters engaged in heated but respectful discussions after the rally.

Lois Garrett of Gordonsville, a Bush supporter, said the only problem she had with the Kerry supporters was that they were receiving some media attention.

"I just look at them and smile," she said. "They're damn lucky to be in this country because they would be backslapped if they lived anywhere else. I just pray that they will open their eyes."

Link

Good goin' George. Middle America is gonna love that! I hope it's on video tape somewhere.
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: Painman
(Hat-tip to Kos)

ANNANDALE, Va. -- President Bush stumped for votes and touted tax cuts Monday in northern Virginia, drawing more than 600 supporters and a few dozen Democratic protesters who said his presence in traditionally Republican Virginia is a sign his campaign is in trouble.

In between were Chris Ostendorff of Oakton and her son Chuck, two undecided voters who wanted to hear the president speak but were unsure if they would vote for him.

"I'm still making up my mind," said Chuck, who will be voting for the first time in November and wants to pursue a career in the military. "I was impressed with his speech, but I suspect I would also be impressed with a speech by (Democrat John) Kerry. It's going to be tough to decide."

At several points during Monday's rally, Bush touted the No Child Left Behind Act, which is designed to impose accountability standards on local school systems.

But Chris Ostendorff, a special education teacher, said the law has caused problems, particularly in special education, where students can't always meet a fixed federal standard.

"And I'm not sure how I feel about federal regulation" of local education, she said, still undecided about her vote.

Bush's rally was designed to show how his policies have enabled individual Americans to take "ownership" of the economy and to highlight entrepreneurial success.

Sharon Rainey of Great Falls was one of the entrepreneurs on stage with Bush. She talked about her business, FYI Network, an Internet-based referral and bulletin-board service. The Bush campaign said the tax cuts he supported saved her $1,200 last year.

Rainey, a Bush supporter, said she doesn't know exactly why the Bush campaign contacted her, except that they wanted a small business owner on the panel. She guessed that "a friend of a friend" told the campaign about her business.

Nobody reviewed or scripted her remarks, she said. "They just said, 'Tell your story,' so that's what we did."

She and her family met Bush briefly a few minutes before the rally at Northern Virginia Community College.

"He basically just told us to relax and that we were going to try and have some fun," she said. "He spent most of the time trying to make us feel comfortable."

Bush criticized Kerry's plan to eliminate the tax cuts for those making more than $200,000 a year, saying that the "the rich in America happen to be the small business owners" who put people to work.

Bush also said high taxes on the rich are a failed strategy because "the really rich people figure out how to dodge taxes anyway."

Asked about that comment, Jonathan Beeton, spokesman for Kerry's campaign in Virginia, said "George Bush can speak with authority about really rich people. ... That's his base, so I'm sure he knows what he's talking about. But that doesn't make it right."

In general, Democrats said, the fact that the Bush campaign stopped in Virginia during a recent campaign swing that has also covered the traditional battleground states of Ohio, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin shows weakness in Virginia.

"It seems he wouldn't come to Virginia unless he had a reason," said Virginia Democratic Party Chairman Kerry Donley. "He's seeing his support slip away, and he wants to stop the bleeding early."

Several dozen Kerry supporters demonstrated outside the rally, some wearing costumes dressed as "Miss Leader" and "Hallie Burton." Bush and Kerry supporters engaged in heated but respectful discussions after the rally.

Lois Garrett of Gordonsville, a Bush supporter, said the only problem she had with the Kerry supporters was that they were receiving some media attention.

"I just look at them and smile," she said. "They're damn lucky to be in this country because they would be backslapped if they lived anywhere else. I just pray that they will open their eyes."

Link

Good goin' George. Middle America is gonna love that! I hope it's on video tape somewhere.

It is largely true. The rich have been know to hire accountants and tax lawyers to lower their bills.
 

Painman

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2000
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Originally posted by: charrison

It is largely true. The rich have been know to hire accountants and tax lawyers to lower their bills.

Of course it's true. Doesn't reflect well on the POTUS to be out there tacitly endorsing it though.
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
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Originally posted by: Painman
Originally posted by: charrison

It is largely true. The rich have been know to hire accountants and tax lawyers to lower their bills.

Of course it's true. Doesn't reflect well on the POTUS to be out there tacitly endorsing it though.

"the really rich people figure out how to dodge taxes anyway."

Statement of fact

"the really rich people should figure out how to dodge taxes anyway."

Endorsement


see the difference
 

Painman

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Feb 27, 2000
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The point isn't how you or I interpret it. The point is how average Americans out there may, and it was a careless thing to say, unbecoming of his office.
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
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Originally posted by: Painman
The point isn't how you or I interpret it. The point is how average Americans out there may, and it was a careless thing to say, unbecoming of his office.

I dont think it is any secret to the general population that rich people use accountant and tax lawyers to beat the system. It is probably why our tax code is 80,000 pages.
 

Painman

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2000
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Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: Painman
The point isn't how you or I interpret it. The point is how average Americans out there may, and it was a careless thing to say, unbecoming of his office.

I dont think it is any secret to the general population that rich people use accountant and tax lawyers to beat the system. It is probably why our tax code is 80,000 pages.

key words: "beat the system"
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: Painman
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: Painman
The point isn't how you or I interpret it. The point is how average Americans out there may, and it was a careless thing to say, unbecoming of his office.

I dont think it is any secret to the general population that rich people use accountant and tax lawyers to beat the system. It is probably why our tax code is 80,000 pages.

key words: "beat the system"

Do you think adding more tax laws will make it easier or more difficult to create more loopholes?
 

Painman

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2000
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Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: Painman
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: Painman
The point isn't how you or I interpret it. The point is how average Americans out there may, and it was a careless thing to say, unbecoming of his office.

I dont think it is any secret to the general population that rich people use accountant and tax lawyers to beat the system. It is probably why our tax code is 80,000 pages.

key words: "beat the system"

Do you think adding more tax laws will make it easier or more difficult to create more loopholes?

Straw man. Utterly besides the point. Sound bite politics are the point. And Bush better hope that remark wasn't caught on audio/video.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,805
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Bush's brilliance knows no bounds! If that was the case, what was the need for the Tax Cuts, I mean, they weren't paying them anyways.

Also, he may want to explain why $200+ Billion of Revenues have been lost because of the Tax Cuts? I'd wager they were paying Taxes after all.
 

HermDogg

Golden Member
Jul 29, 2004
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I call BS. I don't care who printed it, but "Bush and Kerry supporters engaged in heated but respectful discussions after the rally." is the biggest crock I've heard in a long time.
 

Painman

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2000
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I also love the comment from the smug b1tch at the end. Dems owe their freedom the the 'pugs my azz. Let's not forget what a bunch of fellows in blue coats took upon themselves the last time this land was ruled by a King named George. And let's also not forget what they did with those loyal to the redcoats!
 

smashp

Platinum Member
Aug 30, 2003
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Then Why Did you Need TO Endorse Tax Cuts For the Rich ,Dubya. I mean if they already
Know" how to avoid paying taxes, didnt you sign alot of worthless legislation?
 

nageov3t

Lifer
Feb 18, 2004
42,808
83
91
the tax cuts were part of a stimulous package, weren't they? like the patriot act, they were designed to be temporary.

the fact that Bush wants to make both things permanent kinda scares me.
 

Acanthus

Lifer
Aug 28, 2001
19,915
2
76
ostif.org
If they get rid of the IRS, it wont be 80,000 pages long :)

I really hope its true come the RNC. A national flat tax would put us all on level ground.
 

arsbanned

Banned
Dec 12, 2003
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Yeah, the Dems need that clip so it can be played over and over for middle and lower class Americans, to educate them about tax policy. ;)
 

bozack

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2000
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Originally posted by: sandorski
Bush's brilliance knows no bounds! If that was the case, what was the need for the Tax Cuts, I mean, they weren't paying them anyways.

Also, he may want to explain why $200+ Billion of Revenues have been lost because of the Tax Cuts? I'd wager they were paying Taxes after all.

the Tax Cuts not only gave a break to the middle but also cut back on the need for the wealthy to try and go around the system....

Honestly it doesn't surprise me the anti Bush crowd gets their panties in a bunch over his remark when all he is doing is telling the truth....I had thought about this earlier but never felt like bringing it up....but now that it is an issue I am curious as to exactly how kerry plans to tax the top percent if many of them do not report income accurately in the first place? at least Bush is being honest about it.
 

jkenn19

Member
Aug 25, 2003
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If you take notice, there hasn't been a single Democrat in a position of power, or Republican for that matter, who has initiated a bill to eliminate tax loopholes. Until one of them do, they are all a bunch of clowns, only looking out for themselves.
 

Fingolfin269

Lifer
Feb 28, 2003
17,948
34
91
Originally posted by: Painman
The point isn't how you or I interpret it. The point is how average Americans out there may, and it was a careless thing to say, unbecoming of his office.

An average American will never even hear about him saying it in the first place.
 

bozack

Diamond Member
Jan 14, 2000
7,913
12
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Originally posted by: Painman
(Hat-tip to Kos)

"the really rich people figure out how to dodge taxes anyway."

Good goin' George. Middle America is gonna love that! I hope it's on video tape somewhere.

are you really stupid enough to think that middle and lower class America have no clue this goes on? please...everyone knows that the very wealthy find tax loopholes all of the time and rarely "pay their share"....to assume middle/lower america does not know of this FACT is simply ignorant.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
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Originally posted by: bozack
Originally posted by: Painman
(Hat-tip to Kos)

"the really rich people figure out how to dodge taxes anyway."

Good goin' George. Middle America is gonna love that! I hope it's on video tape somewhere.

are you really stupid enough to think that middle and lower class America have no clue this goes on? please...everyone knows that the very wealthy find tax loopholes all of the time and rarely "pay their share"....to assume middle/lower america does not know of this FACT is simply ignorant.
Of course we do. That is also the reason a lot of us have little sympathy for the Rich who supposedly pay an "Unfair"portion of taxes.
 

Mookow

Lifer
Apr 24, 2001
10,162
0
0
Originally posted by: Painman
I also love the comment from the smug b1tch at the end. Dems owe their freedom the the 'pugs my azz. Let's not forget what a bunch of fellows in blue coats took upon themselves the last time this land was ruled by a King named George. And let's also not forget what they did with those loyal to the redcoats!

Yeah, because the Democrat and Republican parties were around at that time :roll:. If you want to look at a war in which the Republicans and Democrats were (largely) fighting on opposing sides, the Democrats were wearing gray and the Republicans were wearing Union blue.
 
May 10, 2001
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You guys want to doge taxes? setup a manufacturing facility in your house... let's say sock puppets... make one a day... sell 1 a year, write the rest off your cost of living as costs as over head built into the sock puppets.
 

totalcommand

Platinum Member
Apr 21, 2004
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0
"the really rich people figure out how to dodge taxes anyway."

How did you guys so easily accept that this is a statement of fact?

It's not.

See that anyway there? Take that out and it's a statement of fact. Keep it there and the statement becomes part of an opinion, as in "we should not raise taxes on the rich because the really rich people figure out how to dodge taxes anyway." This is most definitely not just a statement of fact.