Bundesbank repatriating its gold from NY/Paris

[momeNt]

Meanwhile, Germany’s Handeslblatt newspaper claimed Monday night that the Bundesbank has developed a new strategy that involves fewer gold bars flung afar. The central bank’s press office said a news conference is planned for Wednesday morning, and the topic will be gold reserves.

“The move to reconsider gold storage and repatriate their gold is a clear indicator that the Bundesbank are thinking about Germany’s economic future, away from the euro, and how gold may play a role in it,” said Jan Skoyles, head of research for The Real Asset Company, in emailed comments. Read Skoyles’ analysis of reasons why Germany plans on repatriating its gold.

PIMCO's twitter:

Gross: Report claims Germany moving gold from NY/Paris back to Frankfurt. Central banks don’t trust each other?

Lot's of cost incurred to move their gold from one place to another, perhaps Gross is on to something. They might want to remove what leverage that USA and France has in order to keep them in the Euro.

 

[Dari]

Lots of governments keep their gold in New York. Not sure WTF they would trust the French though. But, seeing that Germany is now the de facto leader of Europe, I can understand why they would want to repatriate their gold.

 

[zephyrprime]

Basically they are getting ready to take the money and run?

 

[momeNt]

Basically they are getting ready to take the money and run?

Yea pretty much. Obama/Bernanke or Sarkozy/Noyer won't be able to pick up the phone and tell Merkel that she has to stay in the Euro because all her gold is belong to us.

If they leave the Euro though I can't see them continuing their strong exporting, they will no longer have a weak Euro to help them out because I'm sure their new currency will be relatively strong. So I'd expect a very high increase in their living standards unless their gov suppresses that to keep exports up.

 

[Fern]

Odd move, and yes will involve some expenses in shipping the gold. Not sure what to make of it.

Fern

 

[zephyrprime]

Yea pretty much. Obama/Bernanke or Sarkozy/Noyer won't be able to pick up the phone and tell Merkel that she has to stay in the Euro because all her gold is belong to us.

If they leave the Euro though I can't see them continuing their strong exporting, they will no longer have a weak Euro to help them out because I'm sure their new currency will be relatively strong. So I'd expect a very high increase in their living standards unless their gov suppresses that to keep exports up.

Yep. Nobody has benefited more from the euro than Germany. It's the Greeks and etc that benefit from leaving it.

 

[momeNt]

Also something to note, Venezuela did this about 14 months ago.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-...ast-shipment-of-repatriated-gold-bars-1-.html

Their gold was from Europe, USA and Canada.

Thinking it mostly has to do with distrust. Not that the gold is physically there (they have no reason for it not to be with all currency being fiat), but that when/if the time comes that they will need it in a monetary collapse, they controlling country won't cough it up.

Maybe it's to buy Iranian oil and circumvent the embargos, that would be awesome hah.

 

[airdata]

1 word.

Tungsten.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-...ten-filled-gold-bars-are-discovered-manhattan

 

[momeNt]

1 word.

Tungsten.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-...ten-filled-gold-bars-are-discovered-manhattan

Oh yea forgot about that. Perhaps they are ensuring that they aren't getting tungsten cored bars.

 

[ShintaiDK]

You keep your gold in foreign countries only to convert it there if you got trouble at home. So if Germany moves its gold home from the US. Then its either a signal that Germany dont trust the greenback or says that the euro is the only currency that matters now.

Alternative it could be cost savings.

http://articles.marketwatch.com/201...8_1_gold-reserves-gold-holdings-central-banks

Oh, and ECB is located in Frankfurt

 

[DCal430]

Very misleading, right now germany has 1500 tons of gold in the U.S federal reserve bank 44% of its gold, over the next 7 years it will reduce that to 1250 tons of gold, or 37% of its Gold. So this is only a small reduction and it is over 7 years.

For worst Germany has 450 tons of Gold in Paris, but will reduce that to 0 over the next 7 years.

 

[DCal430]

Odd they would move all of the gold from France central bank given France is part of the Euro.

 

[Fern]

1 word.

Tungsten.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-...ten-filled-gold-bars-are-discovered-manhattan

Oh yea forgot about that. Perhaps they are ensuring that they aren't getting tungsten cored bars.

Yes, I briefly considered the tungsten thing, but TBH I wasn't aware it had been confirmed as anything more than an anomaly or unconfirmed rumour. Now I see a report saying that German officials have been raising the issue of having its holdings audited: http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2013-01-16/what-do-german-central-bankers-know-we-dont

Perhaps the Germans don't trust the NY fed reserve to carry out the audit? Perhaps also mean the threat of widespread counterfeit bars is being taken as serious. Could mean any number of things, most of which do not seem particularly benign to me.

Fern

 

[ShintaiDK]

Odd they would move all of the gold from France central bank given France is part of the Euro.

Not at all. The gold in France can only be converted to Euro. Same as the gold in Frankfurt. The gold in France predates the Euro and its function was gone.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/17/b...al-bank-to-repatriate-gold-reserves.html?_r=0

Bundesbank officials were anxious to note that the decision was not a reflection of French trustworthiness. Rather, it is because France and Germany now share the euro, so there is no need for reserves as insurance against currency crises.

 

[ShintaiDK]

For worst Germany has 450 tons of Gold in Paris, but will reduce that to 0 over the next 7 years.

From NYTimes.

Moving the 300 tons of gold from New York and 374 tons from Paris.

 

[ShintaiDK]

This is the interesting part:

The New York Fed stores the German gold without cost on the theory that the presence of foreign gold supports the dollar’s status as the global reserve currency. A spokesman for the New York Fed declined to comment.
The Bank of England, by contrast, charges about €550,000 a year for storage, Bundesbank officials said.

That can only mean distrust to either the dollar, to the FED or to both.

More fuel to the reason why:
http://www.spiegel.de/international...-see-gold-in-us-federal-reserve-a-864068.html

Seems its a mistrust to the FED.

 

[DCal430]

From NYTimes.

Strange this article says 450 tons are in Paris now and will all be moved,

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...k-repatriated_n_2487098.html?utm_hp_ref=world

But NY Times says only 374 are in Paris now and all will still be moved.

That article also says Germany has 3,400 tons total, but the NY Times says they have 3,100 total.

This article also says they will move 270 tons from New York to Germany, instead of the 300, but 300 is close to 270.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/story/2013/01/16/germany-gold.html

 

[momeNt]

This is the interesting part:



That can only mean distrust to either the dollar, to the FED or to both.

More fuel to the reason why:
http://www.spiegel.de/international...-see-gold-in-us-federal-reserve-a-864068.html

Seems its a mistrust to the FED.

Good for them.

Finally sites like Zerohedge gain some credibility for breaking the tungsten news very early!

PIMCO's Bill Gross has also been preaching the growing distrust between central banks and this is a prime example.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Good for them.

Finally sites like Zerohedge gain some credibility for breaking the tungsten news very early!

PIMCO's Bill Gross has also been preaching the growing distrust between central banks and this is a prime example.

I dont get how you could even remotely come to this conclusion.

 

[Texashiker]

You keep your gold in foreign countries only to convert it there if you got trouble at home. So if Germany moves its gold home from the US. Then its either a signal that Germany dont trust the greenback or says that the euro is the only currency that matters now.

The only currency that has stood the test of time is gold and silver.

Nations come and go. Gold and silver will always retain some kind of value.

As for Germany wanting its gold, maybe they know something we dont.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

The only value metal has is for its industrial uses.

No one is going back to gold and silver coins.

Pure fantasy.

 

[Texashiker]

The only value metal has is for its industrial uses.

No one is going back to gold and silver coins.

Pure fantasy.

Nations come and go, currencies come and go, laws come and go,,, the only thing that stays constant through the centuries is gold and silver.

 

[Nebor]

The only value metal has is for its industrial uses.

No one is going back to gold and silver coins.

Pure fantasy.

I tend to agree. I have some Doomsday Prepper type friends that have tens of thousands of dollars in gold and silver coins. I feel like if our society collapses, I would never, ever trade food, medical supplies, ammunition, or anything else that I can actually use for precious metal. It just doesn't make sense. Gold is really as much a fiat currency as any other without a willing civilization to back it up.

 

[werepossum]

I tend to agree. I have some Doomsday Prepper type friends that have tens of thousands of dollars in gold and silver coins. I feel like if our society collapses, I would never, ever trade food, medical supplies, ammunition, or anything else that I can actually use for precious metal. It just doesn't make sense. Gold is really as much a fiat currency as any other without a willing civilization to back it up.

Depends on how much society collapses and how much food, medical supplies, ammunition, etc. you have. If one is living in a tribal society in the remote Amazon then gold is worthless - but then so is food, for anyone can simply and easily gather their own when hungry. Unless everyone is convinced that utter chaos will reign for the foreseeable future then gold and silver still have value. Even when there is no civilization, gold and silver are still reliable exchange currencies; I may not want what you have, but for gold I might give up something with the expectation that I can later trade the gold for something I do want.

 

[sontakke]

When is Italian Job - 3 coming out? There has to be a movie about grabbing all that gold while it is in transit.