Builing new PC, what cpu is better for OCing?

[quantumgroove]

I am looking at getting a new MB with new ram and a new cpu.
But i was wondering what CPU is better at OC,
a P4 2.4Ghz 533FSB
a P4 2.53Ghz 533 FSB
or
An Athalon XP 2400

And if i should get a P4 What speed DDR ram should i buy?
Also what mother board is decently priced with good features but also good at overclocking, if thats a factor.
And least but not least would i need to use some sort of water cooling for this setup or could i get away with just using a good fan heatsink combo. For one my pc has 9 fans in it already so i'm not sure if that enough or what?
Thanks to whomever replies to this thread!

QuantumGroove

 

[Duvie]

I smell a flame war!!!!

i will leave it simple....

Until more results come in on the ability of the 2400+ to oc with air cooling alone you may want to wait....The best you may be able to achieve is 2.4-2.5ghz at current and that would be equivalent to a 3000-3100+ xp using amd's new revised rating ratio of 100:83 (thanks MechBgon) and therefore could be better then a 2.53ghz if all it gets is 2.8-2.9ghz.

Waiting also could lead to better 2.53ghz p4 chips are the new c1 stepping 2.53ghz chips which should start coming out in Nov.

Tomshardware review shows a 3200+ rated chip didn't beat the 2.8ghz p4 (rdram system with pc1066) intest so as long as you get to 2.9ghz and have a ddr system running 400+mhz ddr that comparison should be close....

Price currently favors the 2400+ but I would be skeptical until I see a few more results...get a nice average...

A 2.4ghz could possible hit same top speed as 2.53ghz but would attain a higher fsb then the 2.53 to get it so a 2.9ghz p4 2.4ghz machine would and should be faster....This is more comparable to 2400+...same price but for a retail chip...the retail HSF likley will not be good enough though at 2.9ghz if you attain it....


If many start showing the 2400+ hitting the 2.4-2.5ghz range then the amd would have ocing crown in this range...however c1 stepping and rumored d1 stepping should turn the scale on that maybe drastically....

 

[quantumgroove]

what kind of cooling is required to achieve 2.8 or 2.9 GHz with a p4 2.53Ghz @533FSB.
and what mother board is good for this i was thinking about getting an Asus P4b533-e.

 

[oldfoof]

I would Say the 2400+

Theres My 2 bits

 

[quantumgroove]

Alright but what kind of cooling do i need, will a good fan+heatsink combo work considering i've already got 8 fans in my case or am i going to have to invest in a water cooled case?

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: quantumgroove
Alright but what kind of cooling do i need, will a good fan+heatsink combo work considering i've already got 8 fans in my case or am i going to have to invest in a water cooled case?

Heatsink roundupo is here
Link

Alpha is reeeeal popular here. But, as you can see, thermalright prety much rules. For $22 for a ax-7 or $45 for the SLK-800 (all copper) coupled with a varible speed YSTECH fan from newegg you should keep below 40C with any chip you buy.

 

[ctk1981]

The first thing I would find is a board that supports AGP/PCI lock. If you're going to OC with the FSB this is going to be important. Of all attempts I've done with AMD's to overclock, the best I ever managed was 147mhz and I think it ended up destroying my Soundblaster Audigy card. Im not sure if any boards for amd have the AGP/PCI lock yet, but if there is one Id check into that first.

That being said, my newest adventure is jumping ship to the "dark side". Ive already picked up a proven motherboard from ASUS and Im going to be throwing in a C1 stepping P4 2.66ghz. This board supports the AGP/PCI lock, so I hope to hit at least 150mhz FSB to get me to 3Ghz on the processor. As suggested by others in this section, im then changing the memory timing from 1:1 to 3:4 to get me 400mhz DDR. Ill be using a 512MB stick of corsair XMS 3200C2 ram. (Give props to THUGSROOK for all his testing and all the other boys that have suggested this setup for me)

Im just sad to say Ive never gotten a really good FSB overclock out of a AMD. I blame partially the lack of AGP/PCI lock because I have a ton of items on the PCI bus to hold me back (soundcard, NIC, Tv tuner, etc).

For a heatsink I ended up going with the new swiftech MCX4000 and that spiffy ys-tech tmd fan.

Good luck with your decision!

 

[CrazySaint]

AFAIK, no current Athlon boards support PCI/AGP lock, however, most KT333/400 mobos support a 1/5 divider at 166MHz (thus allowing you to run your FSB at 166 and keep PCI/AGP in spec) and I think that some of the KT400 boards support a 1/6 divider at 200MHz allowing you to run your PCI/AGP in spec at those speeds as well. Unless you're going to get an Athlon processor and plan on doing some "extreme overclocking" (i.e., very high voltage) then air cooling should be fine, although unless you have some very special cooling needs, 8 fans is serious overkill. Choosing between the 2.4B and 2.53B according to the OC DB the 2.4B averages 2.8GHz while the 2.53 averages 2.95 (both approx. numbers) but the 2.4B has a lower multiplier which would help counteract the difference in clockspeed. Supposing you reach the "average OC" with either chip, the 2.4B would be running at 175FSB while the 2.53 would be running at 255FSB. Assuming you have some good RAM, you could reasonably run the 2.53 at a 3:4 mem ratio for about DDR414 and the 2.4B at a 4:5 mem ratio for about DDR436 (you would actually need some very good RAM for this speed, Corsair XMS PC3000C2 or PC3200C2 could reasonably handle those speeds, I'd recommend you get the kind with the "platinum" heatspreader). As for the XP 2400+, as Duvie said until we start seeing some more results, it will be hard to say. If you can hit 2.4-2.5GHz then you could challenge either of the "average" 2.4B or 2.53B overclocks, but we still don't know how likely you are to hit those speeds (or higher) with the 2400+.

Oh, and as for motherboard, you can get the Abit BG7 for about $100 at most places and it seems to be a very good OC board with decent features. For about $150 at mwave.com you can get the P4B533-V which has some better features and would probably be less likely to encounter issues (although there aren't that many issues with the BG7). For more information on either board, see the "Official *insert board name here) thread" in the motherboard forum.

 

[ctk1981]

Yea but the next big question is will the CPU you get run at 166mhz FSB anyways?

I just went back and set all my memory timings to normal to try that exactly. Set the FSB to 166mhz, jumped the voltage up to 1.8, 2.6 on mem, everything goes into spec like it should 33/66mhz however the CPU would not take that extra 33mhz overclock on the FSB.

So I thought, well maybe its the ram. So set it back to normal specs and ran the ram at 166mhz FSB....the computer is booted and running memtest86 right now.

Must have some pretty nice PC2100 ram to be running at PC2700. Im going to play around with timings if it pasts all the tests at PC2700.

Not trying to put down AMD's or anything, I used them almost exclusively to this point..just never had any great luck with overclocking so far. Maybe one of those 1600+ gems with that great core would work. Mine is a 1900+ stepping (not sure which core).

 

[laugh]

P4B533, P4B533-E, or P4B533-VM? From recent anandtech review on 845PE, P4B533-V uses DDR33 while P4B533-E uses DDR266. What the heck is P4B533-VM (on newegg)?

 

[Toymaker]

My P4 2.53(C1) is at 2.85 (150 mhz fsb) with just the stock HSF and on a P4S533 motherboard. When I get a better board and maybe better cooler, it will definitely go much higher. An Asus P4B533 or Abit's BD7-II are a couple of good motherboard choices. The AMD XP2400+ is predicted to be a very good overclocker WHENEVER they become available(?).

 

[Slickone]

One thing to remember:
No one buys AMD -> AMD goes out of business -> Intel prices go up like the old days.

 

[Soulkeeper]

another vote for the 2400+

 

[XBoxLPU]

Originally posted by: Slickone
One thing to remember:
No one buys AMD -> AMD goes out of business -> Intel prices go up like the old days.

You can't buy paper launches

 

[Slickone]

Originally posted by: XBoxLPU

Originally posted by: Slickone
One thing to remember:
No one buys AMD -> AMD goes out of business -> Intel prices go up like the old days.

You can't buy paper launches

True. But just remember later on.