Building a New Computer - $3000 upper limit - need MAJOR help

[carterpelham]

General Info: The reason I'm asking for such general advice is because, due to personal and school issues, I haven't been able to keep up with the technology behind computers for the past two to three years. I built a top of the line system with 2x 7800 gtx's and a amd 95nm core cpu, both of which were brand new at the time as I recall. So it's time for me to upgrade.

Per the Sticky:

1. My PC will be used for anything from office document authoring to hardcore gaming. I am entering professional (medical) school so I don't know what my free time level is going to be but since I was awarded a large scholarship, AND my computer was in need of a major update I think i'd like to splurge a bit.

2. My budget, like stated before, is anything under 3000 dollars. I consider this to be high end without being stupid, but i'm open to suggestions on whether this is a good range or not.

3. I will be buying and installing and using the computer in the US.

4. The only real brand preference I have is for Nvidia over ATI, but I'm not super-strict on that. If ATI is ruling the race right now i'd be willing to use ATI.

5. Probably the only thing i'll be using from my current system is the keyboard and mouse. I also have a Creative X-Fi sound card which I might use, and perhaps the dvd and dvd-r drive which I currently have.

6. I have read some current threads but none seemed to match my price range or specs.

7. I might overclock a little bit, but I don't really plan on pushing it to the limit. I won't be watercooling or anything extreme, but I'd like hardware that can be overclocked a bit.

8. I plan to build within the next 2-3 weeks before my school starts.

What i'm looking for is a good reliable system. So, in your opinion, what would be the fastest most reliable system to build in that price range? Specifics would be great:

CASE: Big Lian-Li fan, already have one selected, so don't need input here.

MOBO: Used ASUS with success before. Is nVidia Chipset crap now or what? Again, this will obviously shape the system, so this is of paramount importance to me, and i guess not coincendentally, the area where i have the least amount of current knowledge.

PROC: Intel or AMD? Choose a good one for me.

GFX: Like I said, nVidia is my brand, but if they're in the crapper, well i'll go with AMD. Is 2x or 3x SLI a good option pricewise? how does crossfire compare now? When I was into it, Crossfire kind of sucked compared to SLI IIRC.

MEMORY: DDR3? Is 8 gb reasonable or going overboard?

SOUND: X-Fi still the greatest or still good enough to keep?

PSU: Tell me what's good.

HDD: I've got one SATA that i guess I'll keep but I'll also need another. Is a WD 7200rpm a good choice? Not a huge RAID fan, should I consider doing a RAID 0 config or not?

MONITOR: If you've got any great recommendations please let me know. I think i can find a good one myself or just use my TV/old monitor.

Thanks SO much for your help, and if there is any other info needed, please let me know.

Carter

 

[Farmer]

This one is easy, just list the best currently available:

CASE: OK, Lian Li still makes good cases, pick one you like
MOBO: Whatever you like, X58 chipset, ASUS makes a few
PROC: Core i7, with your budget, there is no other choice; don't go with the Extreme Editions, they are not worth it
GFX: Consider an SLI or Crossfire setup, I myself would go 2xHD4890, with your budget
MEMORY: Has to be DDR3 for Core i7, get 12GB
SOUND: Unless you really care about sound and really need to burn all of your budget, use on board audio
PSU: Your budget is huge, consider a PCP&C 1000W unit just for "headroom" Corsair, OCZ, etc, also good
HDD: Tons of options with your budget, Intel SSDs, WD VRaptors, WD Caviar Blacks in massive RAID array. I'd personally avoid SSDs until they are more mature.
MONITOR: Mid-range, I'd so go with dell, 2209WA for 22", 2407WFP for 24", higher end (like, you want to dedicate 1/3 of your budget to the monitor), IPS display from NEC or Apple.

Good luck. Consider this guide, it's a month old, but still relevant. Their "Double-Stuff Workstation" leaves you $400 for a nice LCD. You can run on Win 7 RC until it comes out. I certainly wish I had your budget every three years.

 

[SparksIT]

IMO, $3000 is over budget, the performance gained over a PC built for half that is not worth. A $3000 dollar PC will be out date in the same amount of time an $1500 PC Your going to be better off, spending $1500 dollars now, and then 2-3 years spend the remaining $1500 building another PC. Personnally, I like to stay on the bleeding edge of technology, instead of the Cutting edge, unless you have maney to spare.

CPU's: Best overall cpu is the Core i7 920, its a little weak in the gaming department, but every thing else it is top, amoung the reasonable priced CPU, price is around $280 unless you know someone that can join the Intel program, then you can get one for $150, or if you live near a Microcenter I beleive you can still get one for about $220.

AMD best option is the Phenom II x4 955, there are some really great deals going on, they are below the 920 in most tasks, the only thing they can really compete with is in gaming. Since money clealy isn't an issue, Core i7 will run better, but from what a read, they do seem to run hotter, so get a decent after market cooler.

GPU's: AMD/ATI has the best bang for the buck, your going to get relatively the same performance, it will just very no how much you pay for it. As with SLI or Xfire performance will be about the same.

Memmory: If you go i7, it has a tri-channel memory chip, so I wouldn't go 8GB your better option, 6 would be more then enough, I wouldn't go more then 12 GB. AMD is dual channel, 4 GB should suit you fine, 8 GB are more then enough.

Sound: Most onboard sound is very decent, but if you have a spare there is no harm in using it.

HDD: RAID 0 does increase performance, but it does increase chance of failure, so if you do go that route, then go RAID 10. SSD drives are getting much better, in terms of size, performance and price.

 

[yh125d]

i7 920 - $250
P6T Deluxe V2 - $300
12GB DDR3 - $225
2x 4890 - $400
Corsair HX850 - $200
Intel X25-E Extreme 64gb SSD - $675
2x Samsung Spinpoint F1 1TB - $170
TRUE + 1200rpm yate loon - $60
2x scythe musashi for the 4890s - $75
LG blu ray drive - $100
High quality ~24" 1080p monitor - $350

Comes to roughly $2800. Although I'd drop the $675 SSD in favor of a OCZ vertex 60gb for $200

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

i7 920 D0 stepping, someone give him the batch code

 

[vailr]

DirectX 11 video cards should be coming out by the end of the year.
So: I'd suggest a single <$100 video card for now as a stopgap, until those DX11 cards are available.
Also: I'd recommend only using SATA HD/Optical drives. Don't re-use any existing IDE drives, unless put in an external USB housing.

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

Originally posted by: SparksIT
IMO, $3000 is over budget, the performance gained over a PC built for half that is not worth. A $3000 dollar PC will be out date in the same amount of time an $1500 PC Your going to be better off, spending $1500 dollars now, and then 2-3 years spend the remaining $1500 building another PC. Personnally, I like to stay on the bleeding edge of technology, instead of the Cutting edge, unless you have maney to spare.

CPU's: Best overall cpu is the Core i7 920, its a little weak in the gaming department, but every thing else it is top, amoung the reasonable priced CPU, price is around $280 unless you know someone that can join the Intel program, then you can get one for $150, or if you live near a Microcenter I beleive you can still get one for about $220.

AMD best option is the Phenom II x4 955, there are some really great deals going on, they are below the 920 in most tasks, the only thing they can really compete with is in gaming. Since money clealy isn't an issue, Core i7 will run better, but from what a read, they do seem to run hotter, so get a decent after market cooler.

GPU's: AMD/ATI has the best bang for the buck, your going to get relatively the same performance, it will just very no how much you pay for it. As with SLI or Xfire performance will be about the same.

Memmory: If you go i7, it has a tri-channel memory chip, so I wouldn't go 8GB your better option, 6 would be more then enough, I wouldn't go more then 12 GB. AMD is dual channel, 4 GB should suit you fine, 8 GB are more then enough.

Sound: Most onboard sound is very decent, but if you have a spare there is no harm in using it.

HDD: RAID 0 does increase performance, but it does increase chance of failure, so if you do go that route, then go RAID 10. SSD drives are getting much better, in terms of size, performance and price.

That CPU will beat any Core 2 or Phenom II in gaming. I'm not sure what you're talking about.

 

[carterpelham]

Thanks for the help. Do you guys think that the 950 i7 would be in any way worth it over the 920? I mean it is almost .5 GHz faster but twice as much, which is almost a reasonable tradeoff. Also, my DVD and DVDr drives are IDE, should I upgrade to SATA?

EDIT: Oh, and will the stock cooler for the processor be sufficient, or should I look for another CPU heatsink/fan?

EDIT #2: So I've made my first draft of the components for the computer: tell me what you think:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16811112198 - LIAN LI PC-60FWB Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817139010 - CORSAIR CMPSU-750HX 750W ATX12V 2.3 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS SILVER Certified Modular Active PFC Power ... - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16813188039 - EVGA E758-A1 3-Way SLI (x16/x16/x8) LGA 1366 Intel X58 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16819115202 - Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80601920 - Retail

2x -- http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820145222 - CORSAIR XMS3 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model TR3X6G1600C9 - Retail

2x -- http://www.newegg.com/Product/...?ItemList=Combo.194180 - XFX HD-489A-ZDEC Radeon HD 4890 Xtreme 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820227450 - OCZ Summit OCZSSD2-1SUM120G 2.5" 120GB SATA II MLC Internal Solid state disk (SSD) - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16822136334 - Western Digital Caviar GP WD5000CSRTL 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Hard Drive - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16827136162 - LG Black 8X BD-ROM 16X DVD-ROM 40X CD-ROM SATA Internal Combo LG Blu-ray Reader & 16X LightScribe DVD±R DVD Burner - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16824001280 - SAMSUNG T240HD Rose-Black 24" 5ms HDMI Widescreen HDTV Monitor - Retail

$2,502.84

 

[SparksIT]

Originally posted by: WaitingForNehalem

That CPU will beat any Core 2 or Phenom II in gaming. I'm not sure what you're talking about.

I never said beat, I said compete. You can start by reading AnandTech own Review of the 955.

Originally posted by: carterpelham
Thanks for the help. Do you guys think that the 950 i7 would be in any way worth it over the 920? I mean it is almost .5 GHz faster but twice as much, which is almost a reasonable tradeoff. Also, my DVD and DVDr drives are IDE, should I upgrade to SATA?

EDIT: Oh, and will the stock cooler for the processor be sufficient, or should I look for another CPU heatsink/fan?

From a value stand point no, the 950 is not worth the money, but if you are willing to pay for it is your choice, the 950 will out perfom the 920.

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

With your budget, you could get a 975 at 3.33GHz!

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

Originally posted by: SparksIT

Originally posted by: WaitingForNehalem

That CPU will beat any Core 2 or Phenom II in gaming. I'm not sure what you're talking about.

I never said beat, I said compete. You can start by reading AnandTech own http://www.anandtech.com/cpuch...owdoc.aspx?i=3551&p=14">Review</a> of the 955.

Originally posted by: carterpelham
Thanks for the help. Do you guys think that the 950 i7 would be in any way worth it over the 920? I mean it is almost .5 GHz faster but twice as much, which is almost a reasonable tradeoff. Also, my DVD and DVDr drives are IDE, should I upgrade to SATA?

EDIT: Oh, and will the stock cooler for the processor be sufficient, or should I look for another CPU heatsink/fan?

From a value stand point no, the 950 is not worth the money, but if you are willing to pay for it is your choice, the 950 will out perfom the 920.

Wait until the next generation of video cards. There isn't a difference yet because the Core i7 is gpu limited. Then it will really shine.

 

[vailr]

Originally posted by: carterpelham

2x -- http://www.newegg.com/Product/...?ItemList=Combo.194180 - XFX HD-489A-ZDEC Radeon HD 4890 Xtreme 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16827136162 - LG Black 8X BD-ROM 16X DVD-ROM 40X CD-ROM SATA Internal Combo LG Blu-ray Reader & 16X LightScribe DVD±R DVD Burner - Retail

$2,502.84

Unless you really need to view Blu-Ray movies on your PC, I'd suggest going instead with a SATA DVD-RW drive.
For data backup, an external eSATA HD drive, maybe 1 Tb, would be more practical.
For video card, I'd go with a single Radeon 4770 (as a stopgap until DX11 cards are available).
For an HDTV tuner card, I'd recommend the PCIe Hauppauge WinTV HVR-1800.

 

[deputc26]

Get OCZ Vertex not Summit, they are roughly the same price but vertex is faster. For You though I'd definitely boot and run programs off an Intell SSD.

Get i7 920 and OC it. There is no point in getting the 950 or 975 as they OC pretty much the same. And yes, get an aftermarket cooler.

And... get a 1Tb Caviar Black instead of that 500gb drive. It is significantly faster.

 

[Farmer]

Your parts selection is great. I have a few other recommendations:

Regarding the discussion on Core i7 game performance, it is irrelevant, you will be getting a Core i7, it is the best processor currently available. At this price point, it would be impossible to recommend any other CPU. Specifically, Core i7 920 is the way I'd go. Nothing else in that line up is worth the price premium, especially the Extreme Editions. You can get a 950 by just buying a $50 cooler and overclocking your 920 yourself.

I would recommend the Intel SSD if you really want to get an SSD. I'd truly recommend an array of 640GB Caviar Blacks or Velociraptors in RAID, IMHO, it is a better value. $/GB for SSDs is really too high at the moment.

I'd recommend Caviar Black drives in place of the Caviar GP you listed: the WD Black series are some of the best 7.2K RPM drives out right now. Compared to other 7.2K RPM drives, the speed difference is noticeably faster with the Black (I can speak from experience). The 1TB OEM Black drive is cheaper than the retail GP drive you listed. You may already know this, but it is always better to go for OEM hard drives: they cost less, and all you lose is the box.

For storage in general, if I were in your situation, I'd go with the smallest possible Intel SSD for a boot drive and a RAID array of 1TB Caviar Blacks. If you don't want to spend so much on an SSD, replace with the cheapest Velociraptor.

If you are getting that EVGA board and don't mind spending a little more money, it might please you to get a Tri-SLI setup with three GTX 275s. That would be quite monstrous. In response to suggestion to hold off on graphics cards until Dx11 options arrive, that is up to you. If you spend $3000 on a new computer every three years, is is totally unnecessary to hold off: this system will run anything that comes out in the next three years fine. If you plan on keeping this system longer, then it's up to your judgment. The thing about waiting on parts to come out is that there is always something around the corner.

I would also recommend an LCD that has something other than a TN+film panel. If you don't mind waiting a little longer on the monitor purchase, Dell is releasing an IPS 24" LCD soon, and Dell discounts their monitors considerably from time to time. I am particularly picky about this, but I wouldn't even consider mating a TN panel to such a monstrous system.

 

[heyheybooboo]

I'll take a shot ...

Antec 900 Case / Earthwatts 750w combo: $200

Phenom 955BE / Asus 790FX AM3 combo: $320
(I'm guessing the Realtek ALC1200 audio has content protection and will work well for you. I know the MSI 790FX AM3 Realtek ALC889 has content protection and the combo is $5 less than the Asus. Regardless, it will take some time before TrueHD audio is worked out so don't sweat it)

2 X XFX Radeon HD 4870 1GB: $300

G.Skill 6GB (3 x 2GB) DDR3 1600: $95

Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s: $89.99 With Promo Code EMCLVMV44
(I'd wait a year or so for SSDs to come down in price.)

Blu-Ray drive and a copy of PowerDVD will run you around $200.

Wall patching materials and paint: $65

Mitsubishi HC5500 1080p LCD Home Theater Projector: $1,725


Total: $2,995.00

Mitsubishi HC5500 1080p LCD Home Theater Projector

Image Quality
Broadcast Format Displayed: 1080p (HDTV)
Broadcast Format Supported: 1080i (HDTV), 1080p (HDTV), 480i (SDTV), 480p (EDTV), 576i, 576p, 720p (HDTV)
Contrast Ratio: 14,000 : 1
Brightness: 1200 lumens
Max Resolution: 1920 x 1080
Display Type: Polysilicon LCD
Aspect Ratio: 16:9
Max Projection Distance: 26.25 ft
Min Projection Distance: 5.2 ft
Max Diagonal Image Size: 250 in (!)
Six foot female genitalia for prospective OB/GYNs
Min Diagonal Image Size: 50 in

Diddling around with the Pythagorean Theorem with room standard 8-foot ceiling with dimensions 14' x 16'. With something in the range of a 15' projection distance at a 16:9 aspect ratio let's say you might squeeze a screen size of 10'-8" x 6' on a 14' x 8' wall. Not bad.

But you are going to need a bigger room ... :laugh: ... (with a taller ceiling if you want to eventually add some 'decorative theater aesthetics' like a screen border and curtains) to max out the projector. To project an image to cover a 14' x 8' wall the room would need to be around 22' long. Now that would be really cool (bowel resection, anyone?).

The deal with HD projectors these days (not sure about that specific model) is some are capable of true 24 -96 fps. I've seen some that will do 120 'interpolated' fps. An LCD is going to be 'generally' 60Hz (and some a synthetic 120Hz) so all that fps gaming power is not really making it to your eyes.

 

[bob4432]

what processor are you currently running? was 95nm skt462(A) or 754 or 939? what is your current ram situation?

 

[deputc26]

Farmer's advice is really pretty good. You definitely want i7 920 with an after market cooler.
You also definitely want a caviar black or 2 for storage.

Most x58 mobos are really pretty good the one you've got there is no exception, likewise RAM. There are also many good case options like the one you selected.

I am a much greater advocate of (good) SSDs than Farmer, I cannot overstate what a great difference it makes in system responsiveness. The 80gb Intel is the way to go right now BUT Tuesday Intel will launch new SSDs and prices will likely drop/speeds and capacities go up.

There is some merit in Vailr's suggestion to get $100 gfx card now and waiting for the DX11 parts but really you'd be waiting pretty long. nVidia and ATI are pretty close to on par with each other right now ATI having a slight price/performance advantage at most price points.

If you don't mind mail-in rebates then three of these will be faster and $25 more than your 4890s. Otherwise the 4890s are pretty solid. You could also go tri-fire with 4870s but I am unsure of ATI's 3 way scaling, I believe nvidia scales better with three cards.

For a tri-sli board I would up your psu to 1000w... just in case.

I fall on the opposite end of the spectrum so far as monitors go, I have seen some horrible TN panels but all the new ones look good to my eyes, I'd go with this 24.6" 1080p monitor for $200.

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

Originally posted by: deputc26
Farmer's advice is really pretty good. You definitely want i7 920 with an after market cooler.
You also definitely want a caviar black or 2 for storage.

Most x58 mobos are really pretty good the one you've got there is no exception, likewise RAM. There are also many good case options like the one you selected.

I am a much greater advocate of (good) SSDs than Farmer, I cannot overstate what a great difference it makes in system responsiveness. The 80gb Intel is the way to go right now BUT Tuesday Intel will launch new SSDs and prices will likely drop/speeds and capacities go up.


There is some merit in WaitingforNehalem's suggestion to get $100 gfx card now and waiting for the DX11 parts but really you'd be waiting pretty long. nVidia and ATI are pretty close to on par with each other right now ATI having a slight price/performance advantage at most price points.

If you don't mind mail-in rebates then three of these will be faster and $25 more than your 4890s. Otherwise the 4890s are pretty solid. You could also go tri-fire with 4870s but I am unsure of ATI's 3 way scaling, I believe nvidia scales better with three cards.

For a tri-sli board I would up your psu to 1000w... just in case.

I fall on the opposite end of the spectrum so far as monitors go, I have seen some horrible TN panels but all the new ones look good to my eyes, I'd go with this 24.6" 1080p monitor for $200.

You mean vailr.

 

[deputc26]

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