Build the best machine for under $1200

[zgdesign]

Hello Guys,

I am looking to build a new machine, which I will be using primarily for image processing, and retouching 45 megapixel 16 bit files with CS3. What would you say is the best processor/mb/ram/psu/videocard combo?

So far I know that I want to use the Q6600 processor and 8gb of ram, maybe gskill?

All suggestions are welcome, and thanks in advance!

 

[Duvie]

NO ocing?

If so, beware of populating all 4 dimm sockets. It often times (and this can be mobo specific) can really limit ocing.

The quadcores will work nicely with CS3 which actually takes advanatge of more then 2 cores....

Are you going to need a monitor for this system, or just the case and components?

 

[zgdesign]

Actually I'm not planning on ocing, just leaving it the way it is, since I'm not familiar with it.

Also, I forgot about the OS and HDs.

Do you recommend XP64 or Vista64?
And perhaps 2 small drives/raid 0 for OS and 2 small drives/raid 0 for scratchdisk?

 

[zgdesign]

I already have an Eizo CG24 monitor, but eventually might go up to a 30". At this point the system is my main concern.

 

[Capitalizt]

8GB of RAM is ridiculous if you ask me. You won't need more than 4GB of DDR800 for anything. Put the extra $$ towards a better processor.

And you really should learn how to OC. You can turn a $300 chip into a $900 chip with about 10 minutes of work.

 

[zgdesign]

I currently have 4gb in my machine, and CS3 eats it up real fast, especially when working on large 16bit files with multiple layers. Then it resorts to the HD which slows things dramatically.

 

[Duvie]

I am not sure about in XP64 will see more then 4gb of memory...Vista may be your route there....I haven't and dont plan on switching to vista in the near future....

 

[v8envy]

XP64 does indeed see > 3.5 gigabytes of RAM. There are 'extensions' to the 32 bit server flavors of 2000 and XP to also get a larger memory address space through paging. The performance hit for that is noticeable still thousands of times faster than swapping to a HD -- in essense you're swapping to unused RAM vs the HD.

Mboard compatibility with 4x 2 gig sticks is... hit and miss. You will defintiely want to go to the mboard manufacturer's site and pick the exact 2 gig module model numbers the manufacturer says will work 4 at a time as opposed to getting the cheapest 2 gig sticks which have a rebate this week. You can certainly do the later, but be prepared for becoming a PC enthusiast to get it to work. =)

You should still be able to OC a 200 or 266 mhz FSB processor to 333 mhz FSB without too much sweating.

 

[Tempered81]

4x 2g pc26400 modules $150
q6600 intel processor $250
3850 graphics card $150
4x 320gb sataII for 2x raid 0 $300
asus p5k deluxe $150
500-750 watt psu $60
case/opticals/extras $140

= $1200

 

[PolymerTim]

Originally posted by: Capitalizt
8GB of RAM is ridiculous if you ask me. You won't need more than 4GB of DDR800 for anything.

I wouldn't say that. It depends on the user. Most users, especially gamers, will rarely every use 4GB, but people doing image/video editing on large files will often easily use as much as they can get. With the current prices, there is no reason for zgdesign to not get it.

Originally posted by: Duvie
I am not sure about in XP64 will see more then 4gb of memory...Vista may be your route there....I haven't and dont plan on switching to vista in the near future....

Both XP64 and Vista64 can handle larger amounts of memory (more than motherboards, which become the limiting factor at around 8-16GB I think). I would say check the compatibility of Vista with the programs and any legacy hardware drivers you will be keeping on the new system. If the support is already there, go ahead and jump on it. Vista's been out for over a year now and with SP1, most of the issues everyone keeps complaining about are gone. As I mentioned, just check for compatibility for your particular programs and older hardware first and you should be safe.

I'm not sure what kind of video card you need for photo editing, but it may be a little tight getting an upper end GPU and raid setup for $1200. I'm just going to throw out something similar to what I'm considering that's only a little more expensive and you can use this as a starting point.

CPU: $254 - Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 OEM
--OEM just comes without a HSF, but you can buy a better one for about the same price difference with retail.
--Also note that in the next couple of months, the 45nm quads should be coming out, which may be a better choice if you're not in a hurry.

HSF: $27 - ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 7 Pro 92mm CPU Cooler
--or depending on if/how much overclocking you may need something more powerful like:
$65 (fan not included) - Thermalright Ultra-120 eXtreme

MB: $125 - GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3R
RAM: 2 * $103 ($68 AMIR) - Patriot 4GB(2 x 2GB) DDR2 800 CAS5
GPU: $240 - EVGA GeForce 8800GT 512MB
HD: $110 - SAMSUNG SpinPoint T Series HD501LJ 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
Case: $140 (often has a $30-$50 MIR) - Antec P182 ATX Mid Tower Case
PSU: $100 ($80 AMIR) - CORSAIR CMPSU-550VX
DVD: $30 - take your pick
OS: $220 - MS Vista64 Home Premium Retail (might find this cheaper somewhere)

Total cost of this setup (with only 1 HD) is about $1450 (w/o rebates).
I would also agree that you should give overclocking a try. Nothing extreme, but you shouldn't have too much trouble getting that Q6600 2.4 GHz up to about 3.0 GHz just by bumping the FSB from 266 to 333 and a few minor voltage adjustments, which can be a pretty big improvement. Just check out this thread to get an idea of how it works.
http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2057083&enterthread=y

Good luck!

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: jaredpace
4x 2g pc26400 modules $150
q6600 intel processor $250
3850 graphics card $150
4x 320gb sataII for 2x raid 0 $300
asus p5k deluxe $150
500-750 watt psu $60
case/opticals/extras $140

= $1200

That's nice, but way overkill on the video card. A $35 7100GS would do just as good for the work he's describing. That means $115 in his pocket or towards something else (better monitor, faster cpu, whatever)

 

[Arkaign]

PolymerTim, you're doing it too.

8800GT 512MB @ $240 for "using primarily for image processing, and retouching 45 megapixel 16 bit files with CS3"???

Overkill / poor allocation of his budget.

 

[GarfieldtheCat]

Originally posted by: Arkaign
PolymerTim, you're doing it too.

8800GT 512MB @ $240 for "using primarily for image processing, and retouching 45 megapixel 16 bit files with CS3"???

Overkill / poor allocation of his budget.

I agree that for just CS3 ideing, 880GT is overkill. Get a cheaper VC.

The rest of his list is pretty good, but I would make it two hard drives, so the 2nd drive can be a scratch disk. No RAID.

 

[Tempered81]

Originally posted by: Arkaign

Originally posted by: jaredpace
4x 2g pc26400 modules $150
q6600 intel processor $250
3850 graphics card $150
4x 320gb sataII for 2x raid 0 $300
asus p5k deluxe $150
500-750 watt psu $60
case/opticals/extras $140

= $1200

That's nice, but way overkill on the video card. A $35 7100GS would do just as good for the work he's describing. That means $115 in his pocket or towards something else (better monitor, faster cpu, whatever)

why not just do:

e2140 $59
1gb ddr2 667 $4
abit ip35e $60
7600gs $22
160gb SataI $39
550 watt generic psu $29
case/opticals/extras $100

and save 900 bucks to spend on booze & women.

You can still edit a jpg with that system.

 

[fuzzybabybunny]

Originally posted by: zgdesign
I currently have 4gb in my machine, and CS3 eats it up real fast, especially when working on large 16bit files with multiple layers. Then it resorts to the HD which slows things dramatically.

Yeah, I do a lot of photo work too with large stitches that can range anywhere from 20MP to 300MP. Definitely kills 4GB of RAM immediately. Once you install 8GB you'll find that CS3 uses it rather oddly. Task Manager will never show CS3 using more than ~3.5GB of that RAM, but the remaining free RAM is allocated in the background to be used as a scratch disk of sorts. So once CS3 uses up the 3.5GB of RAM, it will go for a scratch disk, and it will first go for the remaining free RAM for the scratch before going for the HDD. Strange system. The benefits are there, but it's not immediately apparent if looking at the task manager.

I would also focus on some sort of mirroring and backup solution. Off-site backups, extra hard drives lying around for more data redundancy. RAID by itself will not be iron clad because if all your data is mirrored on different drives that are attached to the same computer, and something like a catastrophic PSU failure knocks out every HDD in your system, you will still have lost all your data despite it being mirrored.

And yeah, video card doesn't really matter.

Get yourself a colorimeter if you don't have one already.

 

[PolymerTim]

Originally posted by: Arkaign
PolymerTim, you're doing it too.

8800GT 512MB @ $240 for "using primarily for image processing, and retouching 45 megapixel 16 bit files with CS3"???

Overkill / poor allocation of his budget.

Thanks for the correction. I really don't know anything about image editing and wasn't sure if it used the video card at all, but I definitely went overkill.

On that note, what level of video card is recommended just for reasonable 2D like Vista and playing movies? I realize you don't need much, but I'm guessing integrated graphics won't cut it?

 

[Markfw]

Originally posted by: jaredpace
4x 2g pc26400 modules $150
q6600 intel processor $250
3850 graphics card $150
4x 320gb sataII for 2x raid 0 $300
asus p5k deluxe $150
500-750 watt psu $60
case/opticals/extras $140

= $1200

For $60 you can;t buy a PSU that I would put in any system, let alone one with 4 HD's, more like $90 or more.

 

[v8envy]

ORLY?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817371007

No rebate, $55 shipped PSU more than capable of powering even a gamer system. FWIW, my X3210 + 7600GT + 4x 250gb drive system is pulling 274 out of the *wall* at load according to a borrowed kill-a-watt. If it seems high reduce it by 20% (assuming 80% PSU efficiency) to get the 220-ish watts which is more in line with reviews/specs.

 

[Markfw]

Originally posted by: v8envy
ORLY?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817371007

No rebate, $55 shipped PSU more than capable of powering even a gamer system. FWIW, my X3210 + 7600GT + 4x 250gb drive system is pulling 274 out of the *wall* at load according to a borrowed kill-a-watt. If it seems high reduce it by 20% (assuming 80% PSU efficiency) to get the 220-ish watts which is more in line with reviews/specs.

I stand corrected !

Of course its original price was $90, so I was close......

Edit: What is ORLY ?

 

[narreth]

Originally posted by: Markfw900

Originally posted by: v8envy
ORLY?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817371007

No rebate, $55 shipped PSU more than capable of powering even a gamer system. FWIW, my X3210 + 7600GT + 4x 250gb drive system is pulling 274 out of the *wall* at load according to a borrowed kill-a-watt. If it seems high reduce it by 20% (assuming 80% PSU efficiency) to get the 220-ish watts which is more in line with reviews/specs.

I stand corrected !

Of course its original price was $90, so I was close......

Edit: What is ORLY ?

oh really

 

[lopri]

That 500W from blew itself up last week. I was extremely lucky that I was able to disconnect that before it damaged other parts. I was furious and I'm looking to seek the damage from Antec. Had that happened while I wasn't around, God knows what'd have happened.. After experiencing the quality control issue of Antec first-hand, I will be very cautious with their PSUs. I've had PSUs that don't sustain OC or not co-op'ing with mobo, etc., but it was my first time ever seeing a PSU start making pop-corn noise and eventually spark.

Get a Seasonic or Corsair units, or even OCZ.

 

[Markfw]

Wow ! good to know lopri. I have Antec's on three of my quads (550 watt, older models, last year), 2 OCZ powerstreams, and one fortron 700. And I have an Antec 450 on my only currently working C2D (the others are for sale)

 

[taltamir]

The E8400 is a better choice then current quad cores. It has SSE4 which greatly improves graphics work (more then doubles the performance in some encoding tests) and is being patched into CS3 as we speak... It is also natively faster.
You could wait a month for the SSE4 quad cores to arrive. when the architecture is identical, quad core is better for graphics. its just that the q6600 is over a year old and the E8400 is a month old... The Q9### CPUs are gonna be your best choice... its just not out yet.
EDIT: from wikipedia "Yorkfield CPUs were expected to be released in January 2008. However, the release of Yorkfield was delayed to March 15th 2008"
So if you can wait until march 15th you can get a new architecture quad core... and intel says they will cost the SAME as existing quad cores of the same speed. (which they have already done with the E8400 and its wolfdale family) They are meant to be quick replacements.
So wait until middle of march for a quad core and you should get a much much faster CPU for your type of work.

I would say that if you get one today:
CPU: E8400

Motherboard: Asus P35 based motherboard of your choice
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...ption=asus+p35&x=0&y=0
Asus has unmatched quality. And you probably don't want to spend hours troubleshooting why your system doesn't work... They are also engrish free...

45 megapixel camera? damn... 8GB (or more!) might be in order for pictures THAT big. I am not 100% sure but there is a good chance of it. You should look online.

Seasonic PSU or an Antec earthwatts (which is a rebranded seasonic)... at least 400 watts... don't bother going over 500watts as it is not gonna be needed.

video card:
Do you game AT ALL? Video card has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH VIDEO EDITING.
Photoshop and encoding does NOT use video card for ANYTHING!
The ONLY reason to buy an expensive video card is for gaming!
I would NOT use a built in one on the mobo since they are crap... but a 50$ video card is good enough. like a geforce 6 or 7. Any non game I build a PC for gets a 50$ GF6 or 7 video card. It gives them quality drivers and image quality (compared to built in one)... but it wouldn't play newer games (which they don't need)...
There is also the issue of being easily replaceable if needed.

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: jaredpace

Originally posted by: Arkaign

Originally posted by: jaredpace
4x 2g pc26400 modules $150
q6600 intel processor $250
3850 graphics card $150
4x 320gb sataII for 2x raid 0 $300
asus p5k deluxe $150
500-750 watt psu $60
case/opticals/extras $140

= $1200

That's nice, but way overkill on the video card. A $35 7100GS would do just as good for the work he's describing. That means $115 in his pocket or towards something else (better monitor, faster cpu, whatever)

why not just do:

e2140 $59
1gb ddr2 667 $4
abit ip35e $60
7600gs $22
160gb SataI $39
550 watt generic psu $29
case/opticals/extras $100

and save 900 bucks to spend on booze & women.

You can still edit a jpg with that system.

Well, all sarcasm aside, a 2140 with 1GB is not a bad budget box.

But you're deflecting an honest truth. Re-read the OP. He's not gaming (or at least makes no mention of it in the OP) with this box. Whether his video card is godly fast or not makes no difference in Photoshop. It doesn't make sense to buy a more expensive, hotter, more power hungry video card if it's just going to idle there in 2d. Money isn't infinite, and if you can save some of the budget by cutting an unnecessary expense (that doesn't affect his usage at ALL, like the hack-and-slash budget box you outlined would), then it's a good thing.

Note that I didn't slam your build idea, it's all quality stuff, just overkill on the VC if he's not gaming.

 

[Tempered81]

I agree if he doesnt play a 3d game, and only edits photos, he should have the cheapest dx9 card he can buy. If he one day decides he likes computer games, he can upgrade to a 150-200 dollar card, and sell the old card that he only originally paid 20 bucks for. so it makes sense.

maybe even a dx8 sm2.0 card or something.

Just always throws me off when people have oc'd q6600's/e8400's, 8gb of extreme ram, a badass motherboard, and a 20 dollar VC