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Buffet says tax the super rich

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I understand the point of taxation. However I dont understand why anybody can claim him sending the govt 5 billion means nothing while claiming giving them more will mean something. That to me sounds like having your cake and eating it too.

Either it is a worthwhile venture or it isnt. If sending the govt 5 billion means nothing and is a waste. I dont think sending them 50 billion or 500 billion will change that feeling.

That said I wouldnt be against a tax increase on the top 2% of wage earners if we see a corresponding cut in govt spending. And I am not talking about govt "cuts" where instead of an 8% increase we see a 5% increase in spending. I mean actual cuts where programs see a negative increase in actual spending.

We have a spending problem plain and simple and have for decades. We cant tax enough now to make up the difference. We have to make deep cuts across the board. Social Security, medicare, military, ect..

Do you believe that sending the govt. $5 with your gas alone would make a difference? Surely not, right? It's the same principle. Insignificant investment does nothing, you need to reach a critical threshold in order to make it worthwhile.

Our government spending is exaggerated as compared to the economy due to our current economic difficulties. A return to a more normal economic outlook along with some long term health care cost containment would be just fine. The idea that we need to make deep cuts is severely misguided in my opinion.
 
Such as what? Our deficit is 1.6 trillion, so we can lower it to 1.5 trillion maybe?

Sure! A 6.25% reduction in the deficit sounds good to me. Actually, that's not true. I don't think we should be decreasing it at all right now. If deficit reduction is your goal however, then I would think that would most certainly be a good start.
 
Do you believe that sending the govt. $5 with your gas alone would make a difference? Surely not, right? It's the same principle. Insignificant investment does nothing, you need to reach a critical threshold in order to make it worthwhile.

Our government spending is exaggerated as compared to the economy due to our current economic difficulties. A return to a more normal economic outlook along with some long term health care cost containment would be just fine. The idea that we need to make deep cuts is severely misguided in my opinion.

No, I dont think it will be a noticeable difference. However I also wouldnt consider a waste either. Which is my point.

Our govt spending isnt going to decrease and we cant outgrow it either or anytime in the near future. When we are nearly double our expected revenue. That is a spending problem.

2008-09 reset the economy. The govt never got its reset. Either we can pretend the economy will grow at 4-6% to match govt spending increases. Or we can face reality that we cant tax or grow enough to close the gap and need to start cutting. Without the compromise of cutting. I dont see the point in taxing more. May as well continue the trainwreck for as long as we can.
 
Hahahahahahahaha!

So if one person pays more, the government spends it and nothing changes.

But if everyone pays more... Wait I don't see the difference.

I knew you wouldnt. Its ok though. My comment was directed towards people with more intellectual capacity to actually grasp concepts.

Plus you are mixing two different topics. Tax policies and spending policies. This thread is about tax policies. Not spending policies. Their are few people here who dont think we have a spending problem, but unfortunately that is not what this thread is about.
 
No, I dont think it will be a noticeable difference. However I also wouldnt consider a waste either. Which is my point.

Our govt spending isnt going to decrease and we cant outgrow it either or anytime in the near future. When we are nearly double our expected revenue. That is a spending problem.

2008-09 reset the economy. The govt never got its reset. Either we can pretend the economy will grow at 4-6% to match govt spending increases. Or we can face reality that we cant tax or grow enough to close the gap and need to start cutting. Without the compromise of cutting. I dont see the point in taxing more. May as well continue the trainwreck for as long as we can.

Government spending didn't decrease in the 90's either, but we were outgrowing it. Do you believe that sustained economic growth of that fashion is no longer possible?

Government spending increases of that level came from a lot of issues associated with the recession. Outside of expanding health care costs (which are a country problem, not a government problem) why do you think that spending would continue to increase at that level?
 
Are you serious? You don't see the difference between insignificant individual action and collective action?

So we can expect a halt to all threads that criticize Republicans for accepting government benefits or pork barrel projects for their districts even as they fight to stop them?

Not accepting government benefits and pork would be individual actions. Ending those things would be collective actions. Yet in this forum we see all the time that teabaggers are criticized for accepting Medicare and Republicans are criticized for taking federal money for their districts.
 
I knew you wouldnt. Its ok though. My comment was directed towards people with more intellectual capacity to actually grasp concepts.

Plus you are mixing two different topics. Tax policies and spending policies. This thread is about tax policies. Not spending policies. Their are few people here who dont think we have a spending problem, but unfortunately that is not what this thread is about.

That's Democrats for you. Taxation and spending are unrelated. Truly amazing.

And then they wonder why we have fiscal problems in this country.
 
Hey, Warren, STFU or get out your check book and write a really big check to the US Government. Trust me they will take it. I say make that cheack for....$10 billion. You can afford it. Either write the check or STFU!

You see, Warren is like a baby in a cradle, on a tree top. When the wind blows the cradle will rock and when the bough breaks, the cradle will fall - and down will come baby,... cradle and all.
 
That's Democrats for you. Taxation and spending are unrelated. Truly amazing.

And then they wonder why we have fiscal problems in this country.

And what do you know...im not a democrat. Oops. Sorry to disappoint.

You see your problem is you accosiate more taxation as automatically more spending. I try to look for solutions to our problems regardless of how they have been handled in the past. More taxation especially on the wealthy and huge spending cuts.
 
So we can expect a halt to all threads that criticize Republicans for accepting government benefits or pork barrel projects for their districts even as they fight to stop them?

Not accepting government benefits and pork would be individual actions. Ending those things would be collective actions. Yet in this forum we see all the time that teabaggers are criticized for accepting Medicare and Republicans are criticized for taking federal money for their districts.

Why are you asking me this? I have no control over the dumb things other people say. You do have control over what you say though.
 
Government spending didn't decrease in the 90's either, but we were outgrowing it. Do you believe that sustained economic growth of that fashion is no longer possible?

Government spending increases of that level came from a lot of issues associated with the recession. Outside of expanding health care costs (which are a country problem, not a government problem) why do you think that spending would continue to increase at that level?

Govt spending in the 1990s was slowed to the point we were able to catch up and run a surplus. But so what? How does that apply to todays economic and govt outlook?

It has increased at an unsustainable rate for a decade under Bush and Obama. I will call it an educated guess that when all is said and done we can expect it to continue to grow unless congress or Obama suddenly grows a pair and put a halt to our growth. And with the threat of a double dip recession. I dont think we will see the expected growth out of the economy either to close this gap.
 
Why can't we all agree that the ONLY solution to our economic problems is to BOTH cut spending AND increase tax revenues.

We need to put all of it on the table, and it's going to HURT really bad for the entire country. We will all need to sacrifice to get out of this mess. We keep having the same tired arguments over, and over, and over, and over again without actually discussing real solutions.

And Conservatives, spending cuts INCLUDE our defense budget. It can't just be social security, medicare, education, etc. It has to be across the board cuts to all programs.
 
(Note: I strongly believe that the Carried Interest provision needs to be fixed.)

Really? So his advocating taxing his income more so the fed can take more of his money is a PR stunt? And what kind of stunt is he actually trying to pull here? Enlighten us please as what his ulterior motive may be kind sir.

What kind of PR stunt?

IDK exactly what's driving him, but I think the following need to be weighed when listening to W Buffet:

1. Buffet has gone to great expense and efforts to structure his business so that he personally profits from the (true) loophole known as the Carried Interest Provision. This wasn't thrust upon him, he purposefully sought it out. I think he's gone so far with that he skirts the law and the IRS should pursue him.

2. Buffet has stepped forward with this stance only AFTER he does NOT need any more money. What's his personal sacrifice here? Heck, he's got so much money he's busy trying to give it away, he's got no real use for it.

3. Examine some of his comments closely. He's talking BS. E.g.,:

"I have worked with investors for 60 years and I have yet to see anyone - not even when capital gains rates were 39.9 percent in 1976-77 - shy away from a sensible investment because of the tax rate on the potential gain," he said

"People invest to make money, and potential taxes have never scared them off."

This statement appears to be crafted to give the impression Buffet assures us that tax rates have no influence on investments. That's utter BS. I think he knows it and has cleverly added a 'modifier' to cover himself.

Firstly, investments are, to a large extent, valued on their AFTER-tax RoR. You increase the tax rate, you devalue the investment. If this wasn't so we wouldn't have tax-free and double tax-free municipal bonds and bond funds.

There's also a large element of 'risk v reward' in considering investments. Higher taxes reduce the reward thus altering the balance between the two in the analysis.

Our tax law has been littered with tax incentives such as sec. 179 business expense, Investment Tax Credit, Green Energy Credits etc. All these have encouraged investors to take advantage of the tax benefits etc as intended by Congress. We've had people invest large sums is otherwise stupid tax shelters merely for the tax effects. To say that taxes don't affect investment is utterly and blatantly false.

(The 'modifier I referred to above was his curious and seemingly unnecessary inclusion of the adjective "sensible" in describing investments. Do we really need to be reminded that consideration of non-sensible investments shouldn't be considered? What makes these investments sensible? Why likely the consideration of the tax effect and whether they make sense on an after-tax basis. I.e., it's a circular logic-type statement that actually says nothing.)

His remarks are not beyond questioning. (And I say while remaining in strong agreement with him wtr to fixing the carried interest loophole.)

Fern
 
Fern - way to copy that from another source while making it look like you came up with all of that on your own...

Anyone that can defend a person with his income level having a lower tax-rate than Joe Citizen can't be serious.

Bober - for once I agree with you - what's next - this doesn't solve our budget issues at all, but it's a step in the right direction.

Full of win in this thread - Buffet's opinion on this isn't relevant? Gold Jerry, Gold! Buffet is just some guy who made a bunch of money a long time ago in the stock market...wow - even better.

My budget plan
-higher taxes on 'mega rich' and yes, I'd draw the line at a million dollars
-elimination of mega-corporations' tax breaks - yes, I'm talking to you Exxon - but it shouldn't be limited to the oil companies either
-end the farce we call the 'war on drugs'
-10k troop levels in Iraq/Afghanistan - no higher - maintain a presence in the gulf as well, but these are drastic troop level reductions

-finally - our defense spending is beyond ridiculous - we spend more than every other nation on earth - combined. Cutting back a bit shouldn't be out of the question - regardless of your political affiliation, the numbers we spend just don't make sense.

Job creation - major infrastructure projects to rebuild and modernize our national water supplies & supply lines, the power grid(s) needs a major overhaul - that should be a good start.

Also - Social Security - again, it's foolish to think that as the life expectancy rates rise, the retirement age for SS shouldn't rise with it. Also - SS taxation shouldn't have a cap.

I'm not holding my breath.
 
Fern - way to copy that from another source while making it look like you came up with all of that on your own...
-snip-

What?

Anything in my post copied from elsewhere is in quotes.


Full of win in this thread - Buffet's opinion on this isn't relevant? Gold Jerry, Gold! Buffet is just some guy who made a bunch of money a long time ago in the stock market...wow - even better.

Buffet's investment strategy is no secret. He looks for companies with a good LT growth prospects at a good value. As long as you execute the basics well (and even he makes mistakes in this as he has admitted) you'll do well when the stock market has an upward trajectory. When it doesn't, it's a fuggin loser strategy. Buffet's been losing a lot of money lately:

http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2011/03/28/berkshire-takes-big-accounting-hit/

Buffet's remark are NOT beyond question. He recently stated he felt housing and employment would make big gains reasonably soon. I think that's a questionable statement, as do many economists.

Fern
 
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Fern - way to copy that from another source while making it look like you came up with all of that on your own...

Anyone that can defend a person with his income level having a lower tax-rate than Joe Citizen can't be serious.

Bober - for once I agree with you - what's next - this doesn't solve our budget issues at all, but it's a step in the right direction.

Full of win in this thread - Buffet's opinion on this isn't relevant? Gold Jerry, Gold! Buffet is just some guy who made a bunch of money a long time ago in the stock market...wow - even better.

My budget plan
-higher taxes on 'mega rich' and yes, I'd draw the line at a million dollars
-elimination of mega-corporations' tax breaks - yes, I'm talking to you Exxon - but it shouldn't be limited to the oil companies either
-end the farce we call the 'war on drugs'
-10k troop levels in Iraq/Afghanistan - no higher - maintain a presence in the gulf as well, but these are drastic troop level reductions

-finally - our defense spending is beyond ridiculous - we spend more than every other nation on earth - combined. Cutting back a bit shouldn't be out of the question - regardless of your political affiliation, the numbers we spend just don't make sense.

Job creation - major infrastructure projects to rebuild and modernize our national water supplies & supply lines, the power grid(s) needs a major overhaul - that should be a good start.

Also - Social Security - again, it's foolish to think that as the life expectancy rates rise, the retirement age for SS shouldn't rise with it. Also - SS taxation shouldn't have a cap.

I'm not holding my breath.

afaik Fern is an accountant.
 
It's a farce, the problem has always been the loopholes, and since the supreme court says corporations are people too let's close the loopholes that lets a company like GE pay no taxes while moving jobs overseas.

obviously, which is why raising taxes has never worked. we keep all of the deductions and "loop holes" on the books and those with the money to use them/find them abuse it. this is why a FLAT TAX will work. No one can avoid it, there are no deductions or "loop holes" you earn x amount you get taxed 20%(this number can be whatever the fuck is found to be the most effective) and EVERYONE pays that amount. Those with less who will be he hit harder will have it made up through SOCIAL SERVICES to HELP them, not carry them, but HELP them.
 
Doesn't Buffet receive most of his income through dividends through his stocks of BH?

and doesn't BH pay income tax on those profits before they're distributed to him? And then he pays his income tax on his dividends?

Correct me if I'm wrong.
 
capital gains is the biggest scam and ripoff of the American people. Of course ,the "patriot" teabaggers out there want to convince you that the ultra rich deserve to pay only 17% of their total income, while everyone else pays their necessary 30%

I know, it's crazy, but they eat this shit up as if it were spit out by Alexander Hamilton himself.

idiots.
 
This is not news.

June 28, 2007: Warren Buffett: Tax the Rich! http://www.cnbc.com/id/19483842/Warren_Buffett_Tax_the_Rich

Nov 22, 2010: Warren Buffett agrees: Tax the rich
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/warren-buffett-agrees-tax-rich.html

Oh, and two threads from seven years ago where even you are posting comments on Buffet's positions on taxing the rich more:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=1273728&highlight=buffet+tax
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=1275159&highlight=buffet+tax

yeah, I was thinking this too. He says it about every year, along with his cadre of ultra wealthy pals.


lol--trickle down my ass.
 
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