Brian & Anand Hate SD Card's in Phones

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openwheel

Platinum Member
Apr 30, 2012
2,044
17
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I strongly disagree with your analysis on cost. Labor? Either your phone is built by robot or Foxconn slave but either way labor is practically a non-concern. How many points are soldered in on a smartphone now? 1000? What's another 8? Especially for a company like Samsung that manufactures so much in house, the total cost is going to remain very close to the raw component cost. I threw $0.27 out tongue-in-cheek but I still maintain its a reasonable cost estimate for an established manufacturer.

You're shifting the argument in order to make it winnable for yourself. Go back and look at the thread topic. We are discussing whether or not there are justifiable reasons to exclude uSD slots.

I dont consider corporate profit margins to be a compelling reason.

I stated that cost is not a realistic concern. I stand behind that.

Cost is not driving this decision. Profit is.

There are lots of things companies could to in order to drastically increase profits, that we as a community have railed against and mostly successfully.

Why should Google and Apple get a pass on blatant profiteering when we dont let Microsoft? Last I checked, no one here ever said "Oh, its OK for Microsoft to switch to single use activations. Those activations cost a little bit because of the internet data used, but more importantly they could make more money."

You don't think extra cost in millions of dollars is a concern for manufacturers? Granted millions of dollars is a fraction of the overall cost, but that's what your "$0.27" translate to.

Also, the cost to impliment SD card slot is not $0.27. It's simply wishful thinking. Labor on engineering and design, labor on cost negotiation...etc. No, the same team designing the camera implimentation is not going to work overtime for free trying to squeeze an SD card slot into the phone.

Again, I am not arguing "against" you, or trying to "win" an argument. I am simply stating the obvious. Manufacturers are trying to maximize profit and minimize cost.

There are people who has to carry 500 albums on a single metro tram ride. If they don't mind paying $100 for extra 16gig then more power to them, but I wouldn't lose any sleep over them not having a SD card slot.
 
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TerryMathews

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,464
2
0
There are people who has to carry 500 albums on a single metro tram ride. If they don't mind paying $100 for extra 16gig then more power to them, but I wouldn't lose any sleep over them not having a SD card slot.

Hey I think you're starting to get it. Having a uSD slot allows you to have an extra 16GB of space without paying $100 for it.

The rest of your argument is simple BS. I linked to you a retail product that is DESIGNED, MANUFACTURED, AND SHIPPED for under a dollar, presumably profit included. There is no reason to think that any cell phone OEM can't integrate that same part for less cost since they are able to omit packaging, USB interface, and shipping.

However, if you're comfortable with the cell manufacturers walking all over you be my guest. Doesn't mean the rest of us that see the handwriting on the wall have to lie down and take it.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
32,833
10,969
136
You don't think extra cost in millions of dollars is a concern for manufacturers? Granted millions of dollars is a fraction of the overall cost, but that's what your "$0.27" translate to.

Also, the cost to impliment SD card slot is not $0.27. It's simply wishful thinking. Labor on engineering and design, labor on cost negotiation...etc. No, the same team designing the camera implimentation is not going to work overtime for free trying to squeeze an SD card slot into the phone.

Again, I am not arguing "against" you, or trying to "win" an argument. I am simply stating the obvious. Manufacturers are trying to maximize profit and minimize cost.

There are people who has to carry 500 albums on a single metro tram ride. If they don't mind paying $100 for extra 16gig then more power to them, but I wouldn't lose any sleep over them not having a SD card slot.

Aluminium unibody adds way more to the cost than an SDcard slot.
 

Oyeve

Lifer
Oct 18, 1999
22,055
880
126
One Max is the perfect example. You gained an SD card slot, but you lose a whole lot more everywhere else.

Samsung Galaxies too. You gained an SD card slot, but you must suffer through bloatware and cheap plastic.

This is one of the stupidest moronic statements in this thread. We dont suffer. We enjoy. you can look at your puny screen sealed closed in solid alluminum POS phone all you want and we will enjoy our large screen, fully usable changable adaptable phones.Cheap plastic my ass. I bet if they called it poly-carbonate like some other douchebags they would love it.
 

mnewsham

Lifer
Oct 2, 2010
14,539
428
136
This is one of the stupidest moronic statements in this thread. We dont suffer. We enjoy. you can look at your puny screen sealed closed in solid alluminum POS phone all you want and we will enjoy our large screen, fully usable changable adaptable phones.Cheap plastic my ass. I bet if they called it poly-carbonate like some other douchebags they would love it.

Meh, as an LG G2 owner I would hate the S4, tiny ass battery, no OIS, SD 600 instead of the SD800, and I personally don't like AMOLED screens.

G2 has 32GB standard, no SD card slot, but I dont see the need considering I use USB OTG and a flashdrive to store my media, or when I go on vacation I can bring my external hard drive and have my entire 700GB movie collection with me and watch it on my phone (again with USB OTG) instead of bringing my laptop.

But to each his own.
 

poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
One Max is the perfect example. You gained an SD card slot, but you lose a whole lot more everywhere else.

Like what really? Like in technical terms, not "OMG I see a gap between the metal!!!" terms.

Samsung Galaxies too. You gained an SD card slot, but you must suffer through bloatware and cheap plastic.

First of all, starting with the S4 you can get a Google Edition without the bloatware but with the removable battery and SD card slot.

Secondly, that "cheap plastic" has actually served me very well. I have dropped my S4 at least a dozen times with only a little scratching on the rim as a result. Compare that to an aluminum device that leaves a permanent bump after a drop, or scratches easily.

Another benefit of the "cheap plastic" design of the S series is how modifiable it is. For example, I had alternate battery covers for my S2. For my S4 I got a $10 pack off ebay that I put in behind the cover that allows me to charge the device on my Qi pad wirelessly. It works because the plastic is willing to stretch some to accommodate the pack. If someone reviewed my device they would complain about the hump probably, but I get the practical benefit of wireless charging for change basically.

You obviously have your opinions of what a phone should be like, and the top selling Android OEM has another. And the market has agreed with Samsung- the fancy aluminum and unibody One has not kept the HTC boat from sinking.
 

tommo123

Platinum Member
Sep 25, 2005
2,617
48
91
Meh, as an LG G2 owner I would hate the S4, tiny ass battery, no OIS, SD 600 instead of the SD800, and I personally don't like AMOLED screens.

G2 has 32GB standard, no SD card slot, but I dont see the need considering I use USB OTG and a flashdrive to store my media, or when I go on vacation I can bring my external hard drive and have my entire 700GB movie collection with me and watch it on my phone (again with USB OTG) instead of bringing my laptop.

But to each his own.

when i go on vacation i can take 80GBs of content with me without having a cable dangling out of my phone connected to various adapters to get it working while sucking more juice out of my battery.

a galaxy note 2 has 11 hour battery life (airplane mode, max brightness connected to bluetooth earphones - tested myself) so can watch movie after movie after movie, get drained then have its battery replaced and be good to go for 2-3 days of heavy use of the phone. means we can use our phones on flights to australia on 1 charge and still have a fully charged phone when we step off.

the best bit - we can do it without cables dangling all over the place (mSD to SD adapter plugged into an SD reader plugged into an usb OTG cable plugged into the phone, then the external battery pack you'd have connected somehow)

to each his own but i'd rather have the choice of having my setup
 

Cerb

Elite Member
Aug 26, 2000
17,484
33
86
They are incredibly biased for the industry. I suppose it is unrealistic to expect for them to evaluate things from users/consumers/enthusiast's perspectives at this point. It is an inevitable journey for majority of the tech bloggers who become known over time, from my observations. There are a few exceptions (e.g. Gary Key who does not write for AT any more), but they are, well, exceptions.
Given that SD cards not capable of 10 IOPS are still being sold, that SD card incompatibilities exist with some phones, that exFAT loses data too easily, and that even FAT32 will get unmounted and need a chkdsk all too often (luckily, you can get apps for that on Android), and that they are physically internal...their biases have some grounding, though I think they go a bit far (I don't recall exactly what they said, but I did listen to what the OP is talking about). Even those that can handle 100+ IOPS can't handle more than a few MB/s of writing, without a special card reader*. Even if you root an Android phone, the speed hit ruins it for some apps you thought would be OK to move, because they end up waiting on the SD as they try to edit their data. But, the reliability issues are more important. I don't need an extra disk management app for my phone's internal storage to stay readable**.

Since we already have battery covers, and SIM slots, I don't think it affects build quality much.

I don't want no expansion options, but SD, in all its forms, has consistently been a pain, IME, compared to other types of storage. Its sole advantage was being small, and that still is the best feature it has. All the problems they have used as PC supplemental storage, they have in phones and tablets.

But, given that it's SD or nothing, I would want a SD slot even with a large internal storage.

I don't feel the need to have every mp3 I have on my phone
Nobody sells microSDXC cards that big, and probably won't for years. So, even if you wanted to do that, it's not yet possible. It can be done on a tablet, but $500 seems like a bit much, to me (TMK, the Lexar is the only one yet available).

* With a Sandisk Ultra 64GB, I get 18MBps sequential read, and 11 write, in my USB readers (none UHS). But, only 13MBps and 4.5MBps in my phone. Both get about the same 4K CDM score, around 0.6MBps about 150 IOPS). It was cheaper than the non-Ultras when I bought it, before you go there :).

** I tried EXT4, but of course, Windows compatibility was gone, as I expected, on top of needing an app just for the phone to mount it on boot ;). I tried NTFS, too, but that made it where it only worked as USB storage.
 
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sweenish

Diamond Member
May 21, 2013
3,656
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Puddle Jumper

Platinum Member
Nov 4, 2009
2,835
1
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WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
32,833
10,969
136
Becase it involves yet another device to carry, not to mention using wifi for transferring files back and forth is going to use precious power you will desperately need if you can't switch out batteries.

It's quite a nice gadget though. Fits a different usage but it's still cool.
 

Cerb

Elite Member
Aug 26, 2000
17,484
33
86
Can't they just use an ext file system and leave it up to OEMs to license fat/exFAT if they want?
Probably. Maybe that's why my phone lacks exFAT support :).

If there are truly so many people putting a lot of value into removable battery and SD-Card slot then surely the manufacturers would have built these features into their phones.
They did. I bought one. I like it. Were it to have a digitizer, and slightly better display, it would be perfect, in my view. But, oh no, it has a visible split along the side! The horror!

Everyone but Apple and Nokia offers storage expansion, and replaceable batteries, though not necessarily in every model. Why? To cover their bases. Someone else will make that sale by doing so, if they don't.
 
Feb 19, 2001
20,155
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lol @ openwheel. getting trashed as usual in all arguments

I don't get why you're so against it. That's fine if you don't want to use SD cards; there are others who do.
 

Raduque

Lifer
Aug 22, 2004
13,140
138
106
G2 has 32GB standard, no SD card slot, but I dont see the need considering I use USB OTG and a flashdrive to store my media, or when I go on vacation I can bring my external hard drive and have my entire 700GB movie collection with me and watch it on my phone (again with USB OTG) instead of bringing my laptop.

But to each his own.

What you appear to not understand, is that most of the people in this thread do not WANT danglies on their phones. We want the storage INSIDE our phones, where we don't have to worry about cables, floppy things and connector stress, extra devices and extra JUNK in our pockets.
 

LostPassword

Member
Dec 2, 2007
197
1
81
on my last vacation i took 7 gb of photos&videos. these were 3 meg photos. now, look at these 12-20+ megapixel phones nowadays. i'd fill that up in no time.

also phones are getting bigger right? can't tell me they can't fit room for one in there.
furthermore, tablets don't even have the phone innards in there yet they don't have the sd card slot. its companies trying to upsell models with more internal storage at overprice cost, and freaking anand sides with them.
 
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openwheel

Platinum Member
Apr 30, 2012
2,044
17
81
This is one of the stupidest moronic statements in this thread. We dont suffer. We enjoy. you can look at your puny screen sealed closed in solid alluminum POS phone all you want and we will enjoy our large screen, fully usable changable adaptable phones.Cheap plastic my ass. I bet if they called it poly-carbonate like some other douchebags they would love it.

I guess you are not mature enough to have difference of opinion or a real discussion. In my opinion the One Max is completely outclassed by the One in terms of design. The writing is on the wall, simply read every review. You get a SD card hooray! Merry Christmas to you.

I don't like Samsungs plasticky shell and never will. Get over it just my $0.02
 

openwheel

Platinum Member
Apr 30, 2012
2,044
17
81
Hey I think you're starting to get it. Having a uSD slot allows you to have an extra 16GB of space without paying $100 for it.

The rest of your argument is simple BS. I linked to you a retail product that is DESIGNED, MANUFACTURED, AND SHIPPED for under a dollar, presumably profit included. There is no reason to think that any cell phone OEM can't integrate that same part for less cost since they are able to omit packaging, USB interface, and shipping.

However, if you're comfortable with the cell manufacturers walking all over you be my guest. Doesn't mean the rest of us that see the handwriting on the wall have to lie down and take it.

You can cry and whine all you want. Fact is they don't want to spend millions to implement SD card and they are over charging idiots for additional internal storage. You are beating yourself up for an SD card slot when there are simple work around. Very ironic. Perhaps you will get it some day.
 
Feb 19, 2001
20,155
23
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You can cry and whine all you want. Fact is they don't want to spend millions to implement SD card and they are over charging idiots for additional internal storage. You are beating yourself up for an SD card slot when there are simple work around. Very ironic. Perhaps you will get it some day.
Is this workaround USB OTG?