Breaks in the ranks? The real reason for GWB's secret trip to Iraq.

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
We signed up to fight our nation's enemies and we are fully prepared to do that. But if they're going to usurp the laws of this country at the expense of our most precious asset, our soldiers, then I will not stand for that, not for a minute."

A dozen other officers refused to sign the waiver, and four enlisted soldiers as well. This is the fighting spirit that makes American soldiers indomitable in battle: God help the War Party if it is ever turned against them.
Text
 

tnitsuj

Diamond Member
May 22, 2003
5,446
0
76
People go AWOL all the time. Doesn't neccessarily correlate to anything and certainly not to the presidents trip.
 

Bulk Beef

Diamond Member
Aug 14, 2001
5,466
0
76
That, I believe, is a major part of the reason why the President went to Baghdad: sure, he was directly addressing the Iraqis, and every politician is always running for reelection, but his primary audience, in this instance, really was the troops. Buck up, he was telling them. Because we're with you, the American people are with you, and I'm with you.
That's a bit of a stretch.

And that guy really needs to calm down about the draft - it's not going to happen.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,530
3
0
I do agree with this quote in the article.
Shinseki was right: Wolfowitz was wrong. They are going to need 200,000-plus troops to keep Iraq from flying apart at the seams.
Fscking Neocons waging the war on the cheap at the expense of our soldiers lives.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,530
3
0
Originally posted by: sward666
That, I believe, is a major part of the reason why the President went to Baghdad: sure, he was directly addressing the Iraqis, and every politician is always running for reelection, but his primary audience, in this instance, really was the troops. Buck up, he was telling them. Because we're with you, the American people are with you, and I'm with you.
That's a bit of a stretch.

And that guy really needs to calm down about the draft - it's not going to happen.
Bush and his Posse would be drummed out of Washington if he tried that.
 

Bulk Beef

Diamond Member
Aug 14, 2001
5,466
0
76
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: sward666
That, I believe, is a major part of the reason why the President went to Baghdad: sure, he was directly addressing the Iraqis, and every politician is always running for reelection, but his primary audience, in this instance, really was the troops. Buck up, he was telling them. Because we're with you, the American people are with you, and I'm with you.
That's a bit of a stretch.

And that guy really needs to calm down about the draft - it's not going to happen.
Bush and his Posse would be drummed out of Washington if he tried that.
They're not the ones talking about it.

 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Originally posted by: alchemize
YABB's are just turning purple over this trip.
Justins about as right as you can get...But nice try.
 

smashp

Platinum Member
Aug 30, 2003
2,443
0
0
Originally posted by: alchemize
YABB's are just turning purple over this trip.


Your Ignorance Blinds you from the fact that "TRUE" conservative mided individuals oppose This president and his actions more than your average Leftist does.

Or have you forgoten about those fundamental CONSERVATIVE beliefs of Isolation and smaller government.



IMHO the Bush trip was to boost morale among the troops as well as earn political points.
 

miguel

Senior member
Nov 2, 2001
621
0
0
Originally posted by: Zebo
We signed up to fight our nation's enemies and we are fully prepared to do that. But if they're going to usurp the laws of this country at the expense of our most precious asset, our soldiers, then I will not stand for that, not for a minute."

A dozen other officers refused to sign the waiver, and four enlisted soldiers as well. This is the fighting spirit that makes American soldiers indomitable in battle: God help the War Party if it is ever turned against them.
Text
I read this far:

Le Canard Enchaine, a French weekly, has the skinny on a story that the American media probably wouldn't touch with a ten-foot pole: over 1,700 American military personnel have deserted their posts in Iraq, so far.
and refuse to read anymore. How can anyone say the media wouldn't jump all over that story? And how does a "French weekly" get that info? Honestly, Zebo, why don't you post something from a non-slanted site?
 

smashp

Platinum Member
Aug 30, 2003
2,443
0
0
Originally posted by: miguel
Originally posted by: Zebo
We signed up to fight our nation's enemies and we are fully prepared to do that. But if they're going to usurp the laws of this country at the expense of our most precious asset, our soldiers, then I will not stand for that, not for a minute."

A dozen other officers refused to sign the waiver, and four enlisted soldiers as well. This is the fighting spirit that makes American soldiers indomitable in battle: God help the War Party if it is ever turned against them.
Text
I read this far:

Le Canard Enchaine, a French weekly, has the skinny on a story that the American media probably wouldn't touch with a ten-foot pole: over 1,700 American military personnel have deserted their posts in Iraq, so far.
and refuse to read anymore. How can anyone say the media wouldn't jump all over that story? And how does a "French weekly" get that info? Honestly, Zebo, why don't you post something from a non-slanted site?
yeah perhaps one no so far Leaning to .........The Right?
 

miguel

Senior member
Nov 2, 2001
621
0
0
Originally posted by: smashp
Originally posted by: miguel
Originally posted by: Zebo
We signed up to fight our nation's enemies and we are fully prepared to do that. But if they're going to usurp the laws of this country at the expense of our most precious asset, our soldiers, then I will not stand for that, not for a minute."

A dozen other officers refused to sign the waiver, and four enlisted soldiers as well. This is the fighting spirit that makes American soldiers indomitable in battle: God help the War Party if it is ever turned against them.
Text
I read this far:

Le Canard Enchaine, a French weekly, has the skinny on a story that the American media probably wouldn't touch with a ten-foot pole: over 1,700 American military personnel have deserted their posts in Iraq, so far.
and refuse to read anymore. How can anyone say the media wouldn't jump all over that story? And how does a "French weekly" get that info? Honestly, Zebo, why don't you post something from a non-slanted site?
yeah perhaps one no so far Leaning to .........The Right?
Um, the site "www.antiwar.com" is not leaning to the right, you fool. I'd criticize him if he posted from right-leaning web sites too.
 

smashp

Platinum Member
Aug 30, 2003
2,443
0
0
Originally posted by: miguel
Originally posted by: smashp
Originally posted by: miguel
Originally posted by: Zebo
We signed up to fight our nation's enemies and we are fully prepared to do that. But if they're going to usurp the laws of this country at the expense of our most precious asset, our soldiers, then I will not stand for that, not for a minute."

A dozen other officers refused to sign the waiver, and four enlisted soldiers as well. This is the fighting spirit that makes American soldiers indomitable in battle: God help the War Party if it is ever turned against them.
Text
I read this far:

Le Canard Enchaine, a French weekly, has the skinny on a story that the American media probably wouldn't touch with a ten-foot pole: over 1,700 American military personnel have deserted their posts in Iraq, so far.
and refuse to read anymore. How can anyone say the media wouldn't jump all over that story? And how does a "French weekly" get that info? Honestly, Zebo, why don't you post something from a non-slanted site?
yeah perhaps one no so far Leaning to .........The Right?
Um, the site "www.antiwar.com" is not leaning to the right, you fool. I'd criticize him if he posted from right-leaning web sites too.
Justin is rather Extremely Liberatarian
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Alright miguel you picked the very first link saying you don't like it but that's not the story I quoted. Second there are 10's of links there from other sites...to include newsday, worldnetdaily, and even the "weekly standard" which s the neo-con flag ship. I encourage you to read the whole story for some prespective of his "conspiracy" then decide. Futhermore you bash him as a conspiracy theorist... he's a scholar at the Ludwig Von Misis (sp) inistitue which is a devote conservative ecomonic think tank at auburn university. BFD ..he's against the war? Most real conservatives are.
 

miguel

Senior member
Nov 2, 2001
621
0
0
Originally posted by: Zebo
Alright miguel you picked the very first link saying you don't like it but that's not the story I quoted. Second there are 10's of links there from other sites...to include newsday, worldnetdaily, and even the "weekly standard" which s the neo-con flag ship. I encourage you to read the whole story for some prespective of his "conspiracy" then decide. Futhermore you bash him as a conspiracy theorist... he's a scholar at the Ludwig Von Misis (sp) inistitue which is a devote conservative ecomonic think tank at auburn university. BFD ..he's against the war? Most real conservatives are.
Huh? I clicked on your link and read the article. The quote you posted on the top of this thread came from that article. What are you talking about?
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Originally posted by: miguel
Originally posted by: Zebo
Alright miguel you picked the very first link saying you don't like it but that's not the story I quoted. Second there are 10's of links there from other sites...to include newsday, worldnetdaily, and even the "weekly standard" which s the neo-con flag ship. I encourage you to read the whole story for some prespective of his "conspiracy" then decide. Futhermore you bash him as a conspiracy theorist... he's a scholar at the Ludwig Von Misis (sp) inistitue which is a devote conservative ecomonic think tank at auburn university. BFD ..he's against the war? Most real conservatives are.
Huh? I clicked on your link and read the article. The quote you posted on the top of this thread came from that article. What are you talking about?
No you said it came from some french daily heres the orginal story from seattle times: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2001803468_mcalpine29.html
 

miguel

Senior member
Nov 2, 2001
621
0
0
Originally posted by: Zebo
Originally posted by: miguel
Originally posted by: Zebo
Alright miguel you picked the very first link saying you don't like it but that's not the story I quoted. Second there are 10's of links there from other sites...to include newsday, worldnetdaily, and even the "weekly standard" which s the neo-con flag ship. I encourage you to read the whole story for some prespective of his "conspiracy" then decide. Futhermore you bash him as a conspiracy theorist... he's a scholar at the Ludwig Von Misis (sp) inistitue which is a devote conservative ecomonic think tank at auburn university. BFD ..he's against the war? Most real conservatives are.
Huh? I clicked on your link and read the article. The quote you posted on the top of this thread came from that article. What are you talking about?
No you said it came from some french daily heres the orginal story from seattle times: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2001803468_mcalpine29.html
*sigh* this from YOUR ARTICLE, dude!

Le Canard Enchaine, a French weekly, has the skinny on a story that the American media probably wouldn't touch with a ten-foot pole: over 1,700 American military personnel have deserted their posts in Iraq, so far. They go on leave, and, once back in the U.S., disappear, never to be seen or heard from again.
 

Witling

Golden Member
Jul 30, 2003
1,448
0
0
I think my credentials as a bleeding heart liberal are fairly well established on this board. I read the article in the Le Canard Enchaine, a French weekly, when it was published. I firmly believe that we cannot and will not succede in Iraq. I did not make a post to this article, however, because I thought it was axe grinding. It may or not be axe grinding, but I, flaming liberal though I am, didn't want to post this article. Without a doubt there have been desertions and AWOLs (Absent Without Official Leave). There are desertions in peace time and in every conflict we've ever fought. People are complicated. Although I think that the administration lives and feeds on the muck at the bottom of the pond (Democrats feed one level above, which still isn't very nice), it is sufficient to blame the administration for the things for which they are responsible. We don't need to bring additional muck to the pond, for which the administration is not responsible. Americans have grown increasing more pampered and less responsible. I'd expect a higher desertion and AWOL rate if we sent them down to Bahama to guard the Miss Universe candidates.
 

Mrburns2007

Platinum Member
Jun 14, 2001
2,595
0
0
Originally posted by: Whitling
I think my credentials as a bleeding heart liberal are fairly well established on this board. I read the article in the Le Canard Enchaine, a French weekly, when it was published. I firmly believe that we cannot and will not succede in Iraq. .

We are succeeding, we just need to find Saddam and his leaders. Most people in Iraq want Democracy to succeed, there all just waiting for when Saddam is finally killed.
 

BaliBabyDoc

Lifer
Jan 20, 2001
10,737
0
0
We are succeeding, we just need to find Saddam and his leaders. Most people in Iraq want Democracy to succeed, there all just waiting for when Saddam is finally killed.
Actually you have no idea what most people in Iraq want. The Shi'ites don't miss Saddam but they aren't big advocates for a US-installed junta. The Kurds and Sunni definitely don't want Democracy b/c true democratic rule would entrench the Shi'ites at the top of the power totem. There's certainly the potential for an Islamic state with democratic tendencies (ala Turkey).

Saddam was never the key to Iraq. The people are the key to Iraq. At this point in time, a few people are ardently supporting US efforts and a few people are fiercely opposed to US efforts. IMHO, the majority of Iraqis are waiting for the US to deliver on promises. Aside from the Kurds, Iraqis in general have been repeatedly let down by American efforts in the region. Unfortunately, the window of opportunity is narrowing.
 

Witling

Golden Member
Jul 30, 2003
1,448
0
0
Mr. Burns.

You said:We are succeeding [in Iraq], we just need to find Saddam and his leaders. Most people in Iraq want Democracy to succeed, there all just waiting for when Saddam is finally killed.

As the great rock and roll singer Buddy Holly wrote and sang, "Rave on."

"Finally killed" as opposed to maybe, "temprarily killed." Sorry, the copy editor in me made me do it.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY