Breaking News . . .

Page 3 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

rickn

Diamond Member
Oct 15, 1999
7,064
0
0
Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: EagleKeeper
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: dahunan
and another thing.... this admin has hired fake reporters.. aired fake commercials about their social security plan... paid people to go out and promote their programs illegally -- SO HONESTLY what is to stop them from hiring people to commit acts that keep the peoples minds on terrorism?


You already made your statement.

Why not just hire people to actually committ terrorism.

Other administrations have followed your line of reasoning and some can even stretch it to actually creating wars based on imaginary incidents; similar to terroism.



Sorry... I get frustrated when CSG seems to ONLY support the Bush Admin and not be critical of their misdeeds... it is like he only wants to find ways to bash those who dislike Bush and his admin .. :(

While that is often true of CSG, what's so different about that than the behavior of Conjur, BBond and others who go to such absurd extremes as to try and pin *every* goddamn thing that goes wrong on this planet to Bush? It's just the opposite end of the extreme, and I don't see you pissing about those jerkoffs with their ravings.

As I've said a thousand times here, there are PLENTY of legitimate reasons to loathe Bush. There is MORE than adequate reason to call him a bad president, to say he's leading us in some bad directions, failing to do his job in many areas and so on and so forth. What's NOT legitimate is to claim he's perfect nor to claim that he's the end-all, be-all of bad happenings on earth.

This forum is FILLED with DISHONEST people who attach themselves to one extreme or the other. The one thing they have in common is a REFUSAL to see or acknowledge reality.

Jason


this forum is filled with OPINIONATED people, most of whom are very unwilling to change their opinions.. then again how is that any different from any other facet of life.
 

tommywishbone

Platinum Member
May 11, 2005
2,149
0
0
Ah yes; the diabolical and deadly Cessana 152. For years now, the Russians have been trying to steal the plans for this modern superweapon. It's top speed of almost 115 mph and 110 horsepower make it a potent threat, to be feared thoughout the land. Cowards! Is there no end, to the yellow-bellied absurdities we will commit? I give the current fearmongers a 9.5 on their performance. I almost forgot... run for your life!

Edit: I neglected to send greetings to all forum members. Greetings.
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
42,589
5
0
It was Cessna 172 that landed in Red Square on May 28, 1987.

What if the pilot had packed the plane full of explosives and crashed it into the Kremlin.

It made it through the air defense system.


A small plane could come close to doing the same thing here, if it turned off the transponder.
The pilots of the current incident werre lucky that they had the common sense to not try anything foolish when the escorts showed up.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: EagleKeeper
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: dahunan
and another thing.... this admin has hired fake reporters.. aired fake commercials about their social security plan... paid people to go out and promote their programs illegally -- SO HONESTLY what is to stop them from hiring people to commit acts that keep the peoples minds on terrorism?
You already made your statement.

Why not just hire people to actually committ terrorism.

Other administrations have followed your line of reasoning and some can even stretch it to actually creating wars based on imaginary incidents; similar to terroism.

Sorry... I get frustrated when CSG seems to ONLY support the Bush Admin and not be critical of their misdeeds... it is like he only wants to find ways to bash those who dislike Bush and his admin .. :(

Well Bush is up there with Jesus to them, just about God-like, in fact I have to take picture of the bumper sticker down here that says "Bush is my GOD".
 

WiseOldDude

Senior member
Feb 13, 2005
702
0
0
I venture the entire world is laughing their butts off at the cowardly american leaders that run like scared children from a cesna.

And apparently or government has no faith in the Air Force in a multi million dollar fighter to deal with a very small and slow plane.
 

tommywishbone

Platinum Member
May 11, 2005
2,149
0
0
FWIW, the West German guy, who flew into Red Square, was Matias Rust. He is a cult hero/friend to many. One of my friends from Berlin, was shocked and delighted when Matias' name came up at a recent party (in Los Angeles). Evidently, he is still very popular in certain circles. He was offically charged with "Capital Hooliganism." Silly.


Edit: Because I can't spell Hooliganism.
 

KingofCamelot

Golden Member
Aug 20, 2004
1,074
0
0
Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Almost eleven years ago there was a Cessna 150 that had been stolen from a nearby airport and deliberately crashed into the Whitehouse in a suicide attack.

Strangely the only references to that event is a Whitehouse Press-Breifing Transcript


and a reference on a Fruitcake Conspiracy Theory Website

Both were on 9-11, coincidence ? Threat or Menace ?


The White House briefing transcript is dated September 12, 1994 and talks about an "aircraft
crash that took place at the White House early this morning." So much for that 9-11 connection.
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
58,686
3
0
Originally posted by: KingofCamelot
Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Almost eleven years ago there was a Cessna 150 that had been stolen from a nearby airport and deliberately crashed into the Whitehouse in a suicide attack.

Strangely the only references to that event is a Whitehouse Press-Breifing Transcript


and a reference on a Fruitcake Conspiracy Theory Website

Both were on 9-11, coincidence ? Threat or Menace ?
The White House briefing transcript is dated September 12, 1994 and talks about an "aircraft
crash that took place at the White House early this morning." So much for that 9-11 connection.


ummm


SPECIAL AGENT MEYER: What I can do for you right now,
very quickly, is give you what we do know, and try not to belabor the
obvious. At about 1:49 a.m. this morning, a single-engine Cessna
crashed into the South Grounds of the White House. Now, it appears
that this plane was stolen from the Harford County, Maryland Airport
sometime after 7:30 p.m. last night, September 11th.
Going to quibble over an hour or so?
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Below is the opinion of Declan, who has been in D.C. for 10 yrs and will be moving to San Fransisco in a few weeks. He is studying on getting his Pilots License too at D.C.:


A Cessna 150 is one of the tiniest planes you can imagine: it travels at
about 110 MPH and can carry only two people who weigh 170 lbs or less
each. The plane itself is around 1,100 lbs with a thin aluminum shell --
perhaps a third the weight of most cars.

If a Cessna 150 hit a large government building, the impact damage would
be localized. People who weren't near the impact site might not even
notice. As the Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association notes: "The
suicide crash of a Cessna into a Tampa office building demonstrates the
ineffectiveness of a general aviation aircraft as a terrorist weapon."

Yet one of these tiny Cessna 150s reportedly strayed into the controlled
airspace near Washington, DC this afternoon and prompted a panic
evacuation of the White House and the Capitol. Politicians, aides, and
journalists were told by police to run from the buildings as fast as
they could away. "Run, this is no joke, leave the grounds," a U.S.
Secret Service agent told one CNN correspondent.

But was this panic justified?

By the time the buildings were evacuated, F-16s and Blackhawk
helicopters seem to have been in the air and the Feds should have known
that the threat was minimal. The area around Washington, DC is
well-monitored by radar and security agencies should have realized that
the plane was a small aircraft (the cruise speed of the Cessna is lower
than the slowest speed at which large jets can fly). It should have a
very different radar profile too.

There's also a broader question about whether the size of the
"controlled airsapce" near Washington, DC is too large and raises false
alarms like this one.

Contrary to popular believe, it's not just the airspace directly over
the White House. I'm looking at the FAA's VFR Terminal Area Chart right
now, and the "Air Defense Identification Zone" stretches from the *east*
side of the Chesapeake Bay almost to the mountains an hour's drive from
DC to the *west*. Any pilot who wishes to fly in the ADIZ must have an
altitude-encoding transponder and open a flight plan.

The Cessna was reportedly N5826G based in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. We
don't know the all the details but it seems as though the pilot was
heading from Pennsylvania to North Carolina, and a GPS-plotted course
takes you right through the ADIZ. Older, pre-9/11 maps don't show the
ADIZ, and that's led to a series of ADIZ violations especially in 2001
and 2002.

What you won't hear on CNN or Fox News is that the ADIZ was supposed to
be temporary. The House Transportation committee said in a report last
month: "The ADIZ was never intended to be permanent. The committee
believes that the FAA should not make the ADIZ permanent."

It's actually pretty easy to become disoriented aloft (there aren't
exactly marks on the ground telling you where controlled airspace begins
and ends), as one pilot explains here:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/Travel/story?id=748540&page=1

The post-9/11 DC area essentially has three layers of security: the huge
ADIZ, the Flight Restricted Zone (FRZ) at roughly a 15 mile radius
inside it (that can be entered if air traffic controllers tell you to),
and a prohibited zone directly over the White House and Capitol.

Details are still trickling in, but some conversations among DC-area
pilots who were witnesses to what happened today suggest that the Cessna
was inside the ADIZ but perhaps not the FRZ until the F-16s dropped
flares to warn the pilot. If that's true the timing is odd: an FAA
database lists scores of ADIZ "incursions" that didn't lead to emergency
evacuations. Another pilot reports an ADIZ (but not FRZ) incursion as
recently as last Saturday at the Gaithersburg airport, complete with
intercepting helicopter and police, that led an arrest but no red alert.

Some pilots are already wondering about the timing. Congress is
considering legislation this week to fix the ADIZ (basically, to remind
the FAA and Transportation Security Administration it was supposed to be
temporary) and re-open Reagan National airport to general aviation. If
the FAA and TSA wanted to derail the legislation, this line of thinking
goes, exaggerating the threat from a tiny Cessna would be a great way to
do it.

-Declan
(member of a DC-area flying club and a pilot-in-training at an airport
inside the ADIZ)
 

KingofCamelot

Golden Member
Aug 20, 2004
1,074
0
0
In regards to Conjur and CaptnKirk:

I was just trying to disregard the plane crash in 1994 as coincidence. Theres a lot of events that have occured on September 11 in the past: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_11 . Surely I can draw many conclusions from the many shared occurances on this day. For example, there have been quite a few battles and otherwise military-related events that have occured on September 11. One that stands out is George H.W. Bush giving a speech in which he threatens to forcefully remove Iraqi soldiers from Kuwait. My god Watson! I have uncovered a truth that has been hidden from the American public, September 11 was not just a randomly chosen day for the terrorist attack, it was purposefully set on the anniversary of this speech!!!! Don't like that example? Heres another. September 11 marks the day that the British Mandate of Palestine began. Bingo! Obviously the date September 11 was chosen for a terrorist attack because it coincided with the anniversary of the British Mandate of Palestine and the terrorists were obviously trying to send a message, how could someone have missed this?! The list goes on, perhaps it was in retaliation for the US invasion of Honduras? The construction of the Pentagon? The Boston Red Soxes winning the World Series? (Always had a suspicion Bin Laden didn' like the Red Soxes) 9-1-1 Emergency Number Day? Or perhaps it has to do with the 1973 military coup in Chile? The list could go on, but I think I'll stop there.

Incase I haven't made my point, in my book coincidences mean nothing unless you can support it with evidence more convincing than a couple of similarities, or logical connections.

As to whether or not the 1994 plane crash was a test-run, or preliminary investigation into the possiblity of a future attack with bigger planes, there are too many problems with that theory for me to accept right off the bat. For example, if this was to see if a larger attack on the White House was a possibility or not, then why does it seem that the White House was not a primary target of September 11, but rather a secondary lesser target if even a target at all? If the 1994 occurance was a test-run, what took them 7 years to put a plan into action, surely you wouldn't test run if you didn't already have a somewhat solid plan and idea of what would happen, and I'll admit it could take several years to put into place, but 3-4 years sounds more likely to me. Gotta love conspiracy theories though, they come by the hundreds, and whenever one dies, five will pop up to take its place. I guess somethings got to keep the paranoids off the streets at night.
 

PatboyX

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2001
7,024
0
0
odd that this happens right after the grenade debacle.
also: wasnt this the day of attacks all over iraq that appeared to be co-ordinated?
 

CaptnKirk

Lifer
Jul 25, 2002
10,053
0
71
Now, it appears that this plane was stolen from the Harford County, Maryland Airport
sometime after 7:30 p.m. last night, September 11th.


Some people know how to read . . .
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
58,686
3
0
Originally posted by: PatboyX
odd that this happens right after the grenade debacle.
also: wasnt this the day of attacks all over iraq that appeared to be co-ordinated?
And the same day as Ridge's revelation that the terror alerts were ratcheted up even when the evidence was flimsy.
 

CADsortaGUY

Lifer
Oct 19, 2001
25,162
1
76
www.ShawCAD.com
Originally posted by: conjur
Originally posted by: CADsortaGUY
Originally posted by: conjur
Originally posted by: EagleKeeper
Conspiracy theorists UNITE

Far from that.


http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=52&threadid=1575187&enterthread=y
I think
There's your problem.

Well, it's obviously a problem for you on the left because it doesn't take much actually thinking to destroy your little diatribes and disinfo efforts.

CsG
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
58,686
3
0
Yes, they did. But if the President wasn't notified because the plane was moving slowly and parallel to the White House, what was everyone evacuated and scared by the fear-mongering and the Code Red? Instill fear into the people. Push that new Patriot Act through. Keep the Ridge revelation and the British memo out of the press.

These people must have posters of Goebbels all over their bedrooms.