BMW 328i or Acura TL

[halik]

I have a current 328 m sport. I think the TL given its ugly as sin and a bloated fat pig of a car would not even be in the conversation.

I used to drive an 05 tsx and that was when acura could make a car worth buying. Get the 3 series. If its not that really an is350 ( ugly IMHO but its up to you) a w205 c class when it comes out or even a q50 (little bland looking but the sport model still has non run flats and hydraulic steering probably the most connected in the segment these days) are more fun rwd choices

Having driven both the TSX And 335i (both in manual), I would have to say BMW. Much more connected steering and tighter trans. But TSX is surprisingly decent for a FWD car.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

OP are you buying new or used?
If used I would go for a 2005-2006 E46 BMW M3 coupe....its sooo sweet.

"I have 3 kids, looking for a very reliable good MPG to get back and forth to work" = e46 m3

"I live in the country, drive down gravel roads every day, need something with solid suspension" = e46 m3

"I'm a poor college student living on loans and need something dirt cheap but reliable to drive 4 miles to campus" = e46 m3

 

[SpatiallyAware]

I owned BMWs for years, but things have gone down the toilet since they started free maintenance.


They make fantastic cars, but dealer support (in my area, at least) is horrific.

 

[halik]

"I have 3 kids, looking for a very reliable good MPG to get back and forth to work" = e46 m3

"I live in the country, drive down gravel roads every day, need something with solid suspension" = e46 m3

"I'm a poor college student living on loans and need something dirt cheap but reliable to drive 4 miles to campus" = e46 m3

m3 brah!

 

[PricklyPete]

m3 brah!

Do you even lift?

 

[Midwayman]

I have a current 328 m sport. I think the TL given its ugly as sin and a bloated fat pig of a car would not even be in the conversation.

Depends on what you're looking for. "Accelerates and brakes quickly" covers the TL. Wouldn't be first choice for a track toy or a canyon carver, but its a great luxury commuter that a little on the sporty side.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

In my mind a TL is for someone who values tech and ride over performance.

It's also better compared to a 5 series.

328 competes with a TSX.

 

[drbrock]

In my mind a TL is for someone who values tech and ride over performance.

It's also better compared to a 5 series.

328 competes with a TSX.

very true.

The auto in the TL is not very good for performance. You throw it into manual mode and it is a completely different car.

 

[RampantAndroid]

very true.

The auto in the TL is not very good for performance. You throw it into manual mode and it is a completely different car.

Having owned a TSX and driven a TL when my TSX was in for service....sure, it goes in a straight line nice and fast. Steering leaves much to be desired...as does the tech. Unless 2014 changed everything, the system is woefully behind the times with a low res screen and a nav system that's incredibly slow and worthless if you don't have an address you want to go to.

The 328 is every bit a better car than the TL.

 

[KDKPSJ]

At current standard, TL is not tech-friendly at all. It was back when I drove TSX (2006), but it's been stuck there since then. Newer iDrive (2009+) is a light year more tech-friendly. Faster, better display, more features, etc. And iDrive is neither the most advanced nor the most useful infotainment system to begin with.

And as I wrote in my first reply.. TL is a lot bigger than 3, almost one or two class bigger in size. They are just not in the same class anymore despite they are close in price.

 

[Midwayman]

TL is in its last couple months before a complete model change this summer. Tech will be updated.

 

[Dr. Detroit]

At 40-$50K - why is the Chevrolet SS not the answer?

0-60 4.5 seconds and 1/4 mile in 12.9. It's like driving an M5 for half the price. About $45K + TTL.

And the TL is on the way out, 2015 TLX will be on sale this summer.

 

[halik]

At 40-$50K - why is the Chevrolet SS not the answer?

0-60 4.5 seconds and 1/4 mile in 12.9. It's like driving an M5 for half the price. About $45K + TTL.

And the TL is on the way out, 2015 TLX will be on sale this summer.

Asked and answered? Also no manual.

Would be cool to get one and turn it back to Holden though.

 

[Midwayman]

At 40-$50K - why is the Chevrolet SS not the answer?

0-60 4.5 seconds and 1/4 mile in 12.9. It's like driving an M5 for half the price. About $45K + TTL.

Horrible gas mileage, Meh looks inside and out, and its a Chevy. Its basically a 4 door Camaro, not a M5.

 

[Imported]

In CA you can get the IS350 with the F Sport package for under $44k before TTL.

Not considering either car in the OP, but I've driven quite a number of those mentioned in this thread.

 

[RampantAndroid]

In CA you can get the IS350 with the F Sport package for under $44k before TTL.

Not considering either car in the OP, but I've driven quite a number of those mentioned in this thread.

...new, the IS350 AWD with Nav was 48k at the dealer. I got them down to 45k by trying to walk away (and they only offered 14k on my 2010TSX, I got them up to 18k) - so unless you mean used, I don't see how the F Sport is at 44k.

I walked away from Lexus in the end, and went over to Audi the next day and got the price I wanted, a better AWD system (Torsen) and more features on a really awesome A4 for less than a non-F Sport AWD IS350.

 

[NutBucket]

Horrible gas mileage, Meh looks inside and out, and its a Chevy. Its basically a 4 door Camaro, not a M5.

Big block cures everything. It'd be a hoot!

 

[Imported]

...new, the IS350 AWD with Nav was 48k at the dealer. I got them down to 45k by trying to walk away (and they only offered 14k on my 2010TSX, I got them up to 18k) - so unless you mean used, I don't see how the F Sport is at 44k.

I walked away from Lexus in the end, and went over to Audi the next day and got the price I wanted, a better AWD system (Torsen) and more features on a really awesome A4 for less than a non-F Sport AWD IS350.

Brand new IS350 F Sport without AWD has 48k MSRP as well. Just in my e-mail communications I've already got 44k with one dealer but I'm pushing for under 43k. A few people have had success at under 43k per clublexus. I'm also at a few hundred over invoice on a 228i so its a matter of deciding now.

 

[Midwayman]

Big block cures everything. It'd be a hoot!

For sure. It would be fun rental or as a toy. I just can't see it as your DD. Plus you're getting up into the price point where you have a lot of options.

 

[RampantAndroid]

Brand new IS350 F Sport without AWD has 48k MSRP as well. Just in my e-mail communications I've already got 44k with one dealer but I'm pushing for under 43k. A few people have had success at under 43k per clublexus. I'm also at a few hundred over invoice on a 228i so its a matter of deciding now.

Well, color me amazed then. Lexus of Bellevue, WA was incredibly high pressure and unwilling to budge. I told them to get it to 43 or 44k (can't remember which I said) and I'd buy that night...but the owner refused to budge. So I demanded the keys to my car back...they got even MORE high pressure, I demanded the keys back more forcefully and left.

I hope not all Lexus dealers are that bad. The only answer for "Well, the Audi A4 I looked at has more than your car offers for less cash" was "well, we're Lexus. We don't break down." normally don't get into number talks when I'm just test driving, but they refused to let me just test drive. Lexus was worse than the Ford dealership I went to. Barrier Audi and Bellevue BMW were far more friendly and pleasurable to deal with.

 

[Dr. Detroit]

Horrible gas mileage, Meh looks inside and out, and its a Chevy. Its basically a 4 door Camaro, not a M5.

Oh I forgot, when spending $45K on a car, an extra $1000 a year in gas would be breaking the bank............ FYI Premium fuel is not required.

Every review says the interior is nice and the tech is quite good.

Meh Looks? Have you seen a Acura lately and its beaked nose and "meh" performance.

At least the SS comes standard with leather unlike the 328i which give you "leatherette" AKA Vinyl.

 

[Dr. Detroit]

...new, the IS350 AWD with Nav was 48k at the dealer. I got them down to 45k by trying to walk away (and they only offered 14k on my 2010TSX, I got them up to 18k) - so unless you mean used, I don't see how the F Sport is at 44k.

I walked away from Lexus in the end, and went over to Audi the next day and got the price I wanted, a better AWD system (Torsen) and more features on a really awesome A4 for less than a non-F Sport AWD IS350.

So let me get this straight - you went from a 306HP V6 to a 210HP 4cyl Turbo A4. You do realize the IS350F Sport is a S4/33p/C350 competitor right?

 

[RampantAndroid]

So let me get this straight - you went from a 306HP V6 to a 210HP 4cyl Turbo A4. You do realize the IS350F Sport is a S4/33p/C350 competitor right?

The S4 is far more powerful. You assume I was looking solely based on performance also... In a corner, I saw no real difference. In AWD function, the Lexus was a reactive system...I easily spun the wheels. In the A4, I couldn't spin the wheels (and in the end, I've only spun wheels on ice, or when I turn off the traction system and am on gravel or ice. And on ice, I WANT to spin tires sometimes and just let the mechanical differentials do the work.)

Did not like the interior of the 350 - passenger arm rest was the cup holders (ow!), transmission stuck into the driver side a fair amount and I'm 6'4". Nav system used a *** backwards mouse/trackball type thing. I didn't dare think of touching it unless I was parked and had 5 minutes to attempt to click what I wanted.

Modding - yeah, Audi wins this one...

Dealership I'd have to deal with: Huge minus for Lexus. I'll be happy to never go in there again.

Transmission & fuel economy: 8 speed straight 4 beats a 6 speed V8.

Oh, and for performance, the 350 is what, 0-60 in 5.7s with AWD. An S4 is around 4.9 and an A4 AWD is 6.7s (using a few 2013 numbers here; the A4 in 2014 got a new intake manifold and gained some HP in general, and a bunch of HP for E85 which is only supported in 2014 A4s with Quattro due to a 5th injector being added so the car can cold start using E85.) If I feel like it I can easily mod my A4 to gain some extra boost here and there, put in an HFC to remove any spool up time and do a stage 1 tune from APR (which doesn't need a new exhaust and intercooler) for not too much cash and gain quite a bit of power.

If my choice was between an IS350 and a S4...I'd make the same choice I did before: Audi.

 

[RampantAndroid]

Oh I forgot, when spending $45K on a car, an extra $1000 a year in gas would be breaking the bank............ FYI Premium fuel is not required.

Every review says the interior is nice and the tech is quite good.

Meh Looks? Have you seen a Acura lately and its beaked nose and "meh" performance.

At least the SS comes standard with leather unlike the 328i which give you "leatherette" AKA Vinyl.

Numbers are impressive, but externals are ugly as heck. I far preferred the beak on my 2010 TSX.

Also, it's Chevy. I might consider a Ford or Lincoln (if Lincolns weren't so ugly!) but I will NOT consider a single car from GM.

 

[Dr. Detroit]

Numbers are impressive, but externals are ugly as heck. I far preferred the beak on my 2010 TSX.

Also, it's Chevy. I might consider a Ford or Lincoln (if Lincolns weren't so ugly!) but I will NOT consider a single car from GM.

Ugly? No one would refer to the SS as ugly - bland yes, understated, yes - but ugly?

C'mon now. Not everyone wants there car to have sharp edges and a beaked nose.

The Smoking Tires SS Review:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nM_-xRPRulM