Blackwater mercs drew weapons on the U.S. Army.

[BarneyFife]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Aimster
Sucks for these guys. They are getting paid good in Iraq.

I bet when they are done with Iraq nobody will hire them because Blackwater will not look good on their resume.

GOOD.

I know some genuinely decent veterans who work for Blackwater, and do so with courage and integrity every day. Condemning each and every one of them, based on your media-derived perception of them, is disgusting.

Just as with everything else concerning Iraq, 99% of you do not have a clue about Blackwater beyond the fabricated talking points you hear on CNN.

As for this particular alleged incident, dealing with those specific operators, I would have shot the idiots.

LMAO!! Blackwater is a joke. I don't feel sorry for any of them.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Stoneburner

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
It didn't happen in America. No American court has jurisdiction over this matter.

Not necessarily true. In fact, this is probably wrong especially if both parties are american citizens.

Actually that was a bit of a joke because er, someone posted that in another Blackwater thread. There are in fact rules that apply to soldiers, even in Iraq, and unless someone had a very very good reason for using deadly force in a non-combat situation they're in for a good roasting. The problem is that Nebor MAY be right. This has been a concern, because apparently Blackwater and others are exempt from Iraqi law. The question is does military law apply to paramilitary agencies? I'm not sure if that has been adequately resolved. Now because someone can get away with murder does not eliminate the wrong of it, regardless of what a few others may say.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: BarneyFife

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Aimster
Sucks for these guys. They are getting paid good in Iraq.

I bet when they are done with Iraq nobody will hire them because Blackwater will not look good on their resume.

GOOD.

I know some genuinely decent veterans who work for Blackwater, and do so with courage and integrity every day. Condemning each and every one of them, based on your media-derived perception of them, is disgusting.

Just as with everything else concerning Iraq, 99% of you do not have a clue about Blackwater beyond the fabricated talking points you hear on CNN.

As for this particular alleged incident, dealing with those specific operators, I would have shot the idiots.

LMAO!! Blackwater is a joke. I don't feel sorry for any of them.

a joke? why is that? what facts or inside knowledge do you possess that would lead to condemning their entire company and every employee, past or present?

I mean, even those involved in the various incidents are innocent until proven guilty, right? RIGHT?!

 

[First]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
It didn't happen in America. No American court has jurisdiction over this matter.

You're exactly right. That's why I can't fathom why the American soldiers didn't fire on them.

Well, they're not utter morons for one.

OK OK, I would have at least shanked one of them.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: BarneyFife

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Aimster
Sucks for these guys. They are getting paid good in Iraq.

I bet when they are done with Iraq nobody will hire them because Blackwater will not look good on their resume.

GOOD.

I know some genuinely decent veterans who work for Blackwater, and do so with courage and integrity every day. Condemning each and every one of them, based on your media-derived perception of them, is disgusting.

Just as with everything else concerning Iraq, 99% of you do not have a clue about Blackwater beyond the fabricated talking points you hear on CNN.

As for this particular alleged incident, dealing with those specific operators, I would have shot the idiots.

LMAO!! Blackwater is a joke. I don't feel sorry for any of them.

a joke? why is that? what facts or inside knowledge do you possess that would lead to condemning their entire company and every employee, past or present?

I mean, even those involved in the various incidents are innocent until proven guilty, right? RIGHT?!

Until proven guilty??????? In what court? Blackwater is EXEMPT from Iraqi law. And any other laws. Right? RIGHT?
Geez, palehorse74, pick up newspaper every once and awhile.

 

[RightIsWrong]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
It didn't happen in America. No American court has jurisdiction over this matter.

You're exactly right. That's why I can't fathom why the American soldiers didn't fire on them.

Because, unlike the Blackwater mercs, the military has an ethical, moral and judicial structure in place.

 

[OutHouse]

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
It didn't happen in America. No American court has jurisdiction over this matter.

You're exactly right. That's why I can't fathom why the American soldiers didn't fire on them.

Because, unlike the Blackwater mercs, the military has an ethical, moral and judicial structure in place.

and the UCMJ

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Aimster
Sucks for these guys. They are getting paid good in Iraq.

I bet when they are done with Iraq nobody will hire them because Blackwater will not look good on their resume.

GOOD.

I know some genuinely decent veterans who work for Blackwater, and do so with courage and integrity every day. Condemning each and every one of them, based on your media-derived perception of them, is disgusting.

Just as with everything else concerning Iraq, 99% of you do not have a clue about Blackwater beyond the fabricated talking points you hear on CNN.

As for this particular alleged incident, dealing with those specific operators, I would have shot the idiots.

From behind your desk?:roll:

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Nebor
The Army shouldn't have backed down. They have guns for a reason. They should have responded to BLackwater's threats with deadly force.

i agree. why did they backdown? that seems like bullshit.

 

[Arkaign]

What really sucks about this is that if Hillary, Giuliani, or Thompson get the white house, look for a non-stop continuation of the same pile of shit we've been witnessing ever since 1989 : the sham of the Panama Invasion, the debacle of GW1 (read up on our negotiations with the Shia resistance and you'll know some of why we're in the blender in 2007 with them), spiraling deficits and spending, corruption everywhere, Somalia, Bosnia, NK Nukes, Selling secrets to China, ever-widening trade deficit, floundering dollar, lowering of real wages, increasing the gap between the rich and poor, the death of the middle class, the destruction of the US's global respectability, civil liberties dissolving, both political parties fucking the american people with no lube, and so on.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: Citrix

Originally posted by: RightIsWrong

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
It didn't happen in America. No American court has jurisdiction over this matter.

You're exactly right. That's why I can't fathom why the American soldiers didn't fire on them.

Because, unlike the Blackwater mercs, the military has an ethical, moral and judicial structure in place.

and the UCMJ

Pretty sure ROE in Iraq holds that if people are approaching you with weapons aimed your way, you can open fire. That's just common sense.

 

[Lemon law]

I don't care who you are, if blackwater mercenaries have drawn their weapons first, only the stupid decide to fire back and get shot. So I have to agree with Palehorse74 also because many good and decent people do work for blackwater. But if blackwater can't police all its people which it clearly does not bother to, the good and the bad get tarred with the same brush. Private mercenaries is a bad idea bound to go wrong. Now that its gone spectacularly wrong, past incidents not previously addressed are coming to light also. Proving again, that Private mercenaries are an accident waiting to happen. And we are not dealing with just isolated incidents but systemic abuse.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: Lemon law
I don't care who you are, if blackwater mercenaries have drawn their weapons first, only the stupid decide to fire back and get shot. So I have to agree with Palehorse74 also because many good and decent people do work for blackwater. But if blackwater can't police all its people which it clearly does not bother to, the good and the bad get tarred with the same brush. Private mercenaries is a bad idea bound to go wrong. Now that its gone spectacularly wrong, past incidents not previously addressed are coming to light also. Proving again, that Private mercenaries are an accident waiting to happen. And we are not dealing with just isolated incidents but systemic abuse.

Weapons in war zones aren't generally "drawn" because they're long guns. Better to go down fighting than be disarmed and dismembered by Iraqi insurgents.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Lemon law
I don't care who you are, if blackwater mercenaries have drawn their weapons first, only the stupid decide to fire back and get shot. So I have to agree with Palehorse74 also because many good and decent people do work for blackwater. But if blackwater can't police all its people which it clearly does not bother to, the good and the bad get tarred with the same brush. Private mercenaries is a bad idea bound to go wrong. Now that its gone spectacularly wrong, past incidents not previously addressed are coming to light also. Proving again, that Private mercenaries are an accident waiting to happen. And we are not dealing with just isolated incidents but systemic abuse.

Weapons in war zones aren't generally "drawn" because they're long guns. Better to go down fighting than be disarmed and dismembered by Iraqi insurgents.

I guess the same holds true for the Iraqis. Since the Blackwater mercs can kill them with no consequences better the Iraqis shoot them first.
See how convoluted your logic is? Just like when you said the Blackwater mercs were innocent until proven guilty. But you didn't know they were exempt from all laws and would never go to trial.

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Lemon law
I don't care who you are, if blackwater mercenaries have drawn their weapons first, only the stupid decide to fire back and get shot. So I have to agree with Palehorse74 also because many good and decent people do work for blackwater. But if blackwater can't police all its people which it clearly does not bother to, the good and the bad get tarred with the same brush. Private mercenaries is a bad idea bound to go wrong. Now that its gone spectacularly wrong, past incidents not previously addressed are coming to light also. Proving again, that Private mercenaries are an accident waiting to happen. And we are not dealing with just isolated incidents but systemic abuse.

Weapons in war zones aren't generally "drawn" because they're long guns. Better to go down fighting than be disarmed and dismembered by Iraqi insurgents.

Most Operators carry sidearms to go with their rifle of choice (typical MP5, M16-A4, M14 Sopmod, etc). So it's possible they pulled their .45s just for kicks

 

[Arkaign]

Wonder if any of the Blackwater guys have ever used one of these :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norinco_CQ-311

Pretty funny, cheap asian knockoff of the M16 Wonder if it was actually any good?

 

[Lemon law]

If you are a US army grunt, which would you prefer to have a weapon to the back of your head? An Iraqi insurgent or a blackwater employee?

The point is that the blackwater employee is hired to be on our side.

But if you draw down on someone, anyone, when they have a gun already trained on you, you set up a situation where one or the other of you is going to be dead. I don't blame US troops for not firing back and getting themselves killed.

I blame blackwater personnel with zero judgment and defective training for starting the problem.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: techs
Until proven guilty??????? In what court? Blackwater is EXEMPT from Iraqi law. And any other laws. Right? RIGHT?
Geez, palehorse74, pick up newspaper every once and awhile.

Current newpaper articles report that Iraqi's are claiming BW'w license expired in June '06, and that therefore they ARE subject to Iraqi law.

Fern

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: techs
Until proven guilty??????? In what court? Blackwater is EXEMPT from Iraqi law. And any other laws. Right? RIGHT?
Geez, palehorse74, pick up newspaper every once and awhile.

Current newpaper articles report that Iraqi's are claiming BW'w license expired in June '06, and that therefore they ARE subject to Iraqi law.

Fern

I'd love to see a link. I've been under the impression that Blackwater was untouchable because of regulation, not contract.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Aimster
Sucks for these guys. They are getting paid good in Iraq.

I bet when they are done with Iraq nobody will hire them because Blackwater will not look good on their resume.

GOOD.

I know some genuinely decent veterans who work for Blackwater, and do so with courage and integrity every day. Condemning each and every one of them, based on your media-derived perception of them, is disgusting.

Just as with everything else concerning Iraq, 99% of you do not have a clue about Blackwater beyond the fabricated talking points you hear on CNN.

As for this particular alleged incident, dealing with those specific operators, I would have shot the idiots.

From behind your desk?:roll:

yes, even from there... loser.

 

[Lemon law]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Aimster
Sucks for these guys. They are getting paid good in Iraq.

I bet when they are done with Iraq nobody will hire them because Blackwater will not look good on their resume.

GOOD.

I know some genuinely decent veterans who work for Blackwater, and do so with courage and integrity every day. Condemning each and every one of them, based on your media-derived perception of them, is disgusting.

Just as with everything else concerning Iraq, 99% of you do not have a clue about Blackwater beyond the fabricated talking points you hear on CNN.

As for this particular alleged incident, dealing with those specific operators, I would have shot the idiots.

From behind your desk?:roll:

yes, even from there... loser.

What an idiotic post Palehorse74. Its exactly WHAT DID NOT HAPPEN. What we have is an auto accident that occurs all over the world with depressing frequency. The blackwater guys pulled guns while the more rational US troops did not. No one was killed. Later a protest by the US troops was filed shortly after it happened in 2006. Its was passed up the US command and promptly buried by the US command. The shit should have hit the fan in 2006 and did not because there is something radically wrong with the command structure of
of the US command. If anything, Palehorse74 should be taking his gun and using it to shoot the US high command for defective followup.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Lemon law

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Aimster
Sucks for these guys. They are getting paid good in Iraq.

I bet when they are done with Iraq nobody will hire them because Blackwater will not look good on their resume.

GOOD.

I know some genuinely decent veterans who work for Blackwater, and do so with courage and integrity every day. Condemning each and every one of them, based on your media-derived perception of them, is disgusting.

Just as with everything else concerning Iraq, 99% of you do not have a clue about Blackwater beyond the fabricated talking points you hear on CNN.

As for this particular alleged incident, dealing with those specific operators, I would have shot the idiots.

From behind your desk?:roll:

yes, even from there... loser.

What an idiotic post Palehorse74. Its exactly WHAT DID NOT HAPPEN. What we have is an auto accident that occurs all over the world with depressing frequency. The blackwater guys pulled guns while the more rational US troops did not. No one was killed. Later a protest by the US troops was filed shortly after it happened in 2006. Its was passed up the US command and promptly buried by the US command. The shit should have hit the fan in 2006 and did not because there is something radically wrong with the command structure of
of the US command. If anything, Palehorse74 should be taking his gun and using it to shoot the US high command for defective followup.

ok, dude, fix your exaggeration and sarcasm meters.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Lemon law
I don't care who you are, if blackwater mercenaries have drawn their weapons first, only the stupid decide to fire back and get shot. So I have to agree with Palehorse74 also because many good and decent people do work for blackwater. But if blackwater can't police all its people which it clearly does not bother to, the good and the bad get tarred with the same brush. Private mercenaries is a bad idea bound to go wrong. Now that its gone spectacularly wrong, past incidents not previously addressed are coming to light also. Proving again, that Private mercenaries are an accident waiting to happen. And we are not dealing with just isolated incidents but systemic abuse.

Weapons in war zones aren't generally "drawn" because they're long guns. Better to go down fighting than be disarmed and dismembered by Iraqi insurgents.

I guess the same holds true for the Iraqis. Since the Blackwater mercs can kill them with no consequences better the Iraqis shoot them first.
See how convoluted your logic is? Just like when you said the Blackwater mercs were innocent until proven guilty. But you didn't know they were exempt from all laws and would never go to trial.

I definitely agree that the Iraqis should shoot first. From their perspective, that's a logical thing to do. They'll be the bad guys either way in my eyes.

And I knew all along that Blackwater was subject to no laws. I never said "innocent until proven guilty." That was someone else. I'm FULLY aware that America is above the law.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: Lemon law
I don't care who you are, if blackwater mercenaries have drawn their weapons first, only the stupid decide to fire back and get shot. So I have to agree with Palehorse74 also because many good and decent people do work for blackwater. But if blackwater can't police all its people which it clearly does not bother to, the good and the bad get tarred with the same brush. Private mercenaries is a bad idea bound to go wrong. Now that its gone spectacularly wrong, past incidents not previously addressed are coming to light also. Proving again, that Private mercenaries are an accident waiting to happen. And we are not dealing with just isolated incidents but systemic abuse.

Weapons in war zones aren't generally "drawn" because they're long guns. Better to go down fighting than be disarmed and dismembered by Iraqi insurgents.

I guess the same holds true for the Iraqis. Since the Blackwater mercs can kill them with no consequences better the Iraqis shoot them first.
See how convoluted your logic is? Just like when you said the Blackwater mercs were innocent until proven guilty. But you didn't know they were exempt from all laws and would never go to trial.

I definitely agree that the Iraqis should shoot first. From their perspective, that's a logical thing to do. They'll be the bad guys either way in my eyes.

And I knew all along that Blackwater was subject to no laws. I never said "innocent until proven guilty." That was someone else. I'm FULLY aware that America is above the law.

Sorry, Nebor. I confused you with Palehorse74. Sometimes the quote brackets can be confusing. It was he who said innocent until proven guilty, not you.

 

[The Yeti]

:laugh: BS. You guys believe everything you read on the Interwebs?