Bizarre problem apparently solved, but unsure why

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
17,717
9,603
136
I'm still testing to see whether the intermittent problem has definitely been fixed, but I think I'm past the point where it "should have failed by now". This is apparently a PSU question, so bear with me!

The bizarre problem - customer's desktop PC, sandy bridge era, running Win7. I've visited the customer three times in total, for the same issue every time, about six months apart, until the most recent (third) appointment where it wasn't apparently going to go away with a quick fix. On each occasion the computer's ethernet connection would fail to do DHCP or have difficulty detecting a network connection.

On the first occasion I 'fixed' the problem by swapping the ethernet lead for another one. On the second occasion I 'fixed' it through a solution I've found before to work with the BT Hub (BT's wireless router) whereby swapping the ethernet socket in use on the router inexplicably works. On the third occasion neither of these solutions worked, nor did:

1 - try yet another cable
2 - power cycle the router, disconnecting it from the mains for a minute in between, also tried factory resetting the router
3 - try another router (different brand)
4 - remove Microsoft Security Essentials (it does have a network inspection module which I've never seen cause a problem, but there's always a first time)
5 - try a PCI NIC (which also involved removing a pointless graphics card to get to the slot)
6 - try msconfig base services only / Windows Safe Mode + Networking
7 - netsh int ip reset / netsh winsock reset (I was running out of ideas with the latter, I kinda knew it wouldn't work)
8 - try ubuntu live cd

(not in the exact order I did things in)

Occasionally the computer would manage to do DHCP but it would generally only work for one OS session, then restarting or cold booting would make the problem resurface. The symptoms didn't alter with any of these tactics.

I had another think about it, and tried to think of the remaining possibilities even though it felt like I had eliminated the PC hardware, software and networking from the equation already, and decided to give swapping out the PSU (which was a cheapo one) a try.

The old PSU is unbranded. It also has a single 4 pin CPU connection whereas the replacement has the now standard 2x4 CPU connection. I can't imagine this in itself making much difference but it's an obvious difference so I thought I'd mention it. My only theory as to how this is a PSU issue is that perhaps onboard devices like the NIC or a piddly little PCI card are powered on a different rail to the one that the graphics card, board and CPU are using, perhaps the 5V rail?
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,352
10,049
126
The old PSU is unbranded. It also has a single 4 pin CPU connection whereas the replacement has the now standard 2x4 CPU connection. I can't imagine this in itself making much difference but it's an obvious difference so I thought I'd mention it. My only theory as to how this is a PSU issue is that perhaps onboard devices like the NIC or a piddly little PCI card are powered on a different rail to the one that the graphics card, board and CPU are using, perhaps the 5V rail?

Yep, could be the +5V or +3.3V rail.

A friend of mine, some months ago, I did some work on his PC, and in the process, had to shut down and power up the machine.

Well, it didn't want to power-on. The time that it did, there was a delay of like 10 minutes, after I pushed the power button, until it finally came on and POSTed.

So I (apparently correctly) diagnosed it as a +5VSB PSU problem. Swapped in a new PSU, now it powers on easily and quickly.

I also had a problem with an older PC I was refurbishing. It had a Xion PSU that came with a case.

I was in the process of updating Ubuntu through different LTS versions, and one time, when I re-booted, the BIOS started giving errors about "keyboard not found". Also, the HDD had been acting flaky, so I swapped in an SSD. Was going to try a Mint install, but without a working keyboard, that wouldn't help. Tried all the USB ports on the machine, they all failed. So I put the PC away. It came to me that, probably, the +5V line on the PSU had failed.

So a few days ago, I dug it back out, and swapped in a known-good better-quality PSU. It worked fine again. USB keyboard + mouse wireless dongle was properly detected, no issues after swapping the HDD with Ubuntu back in.

Bad PSU can make a lot of various parts of the PC just plain "flaky".