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BioShock 2 PC Requirements, DRM Revealed

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Cogman said:
How on earth does an "install limit" stop piracy... It's ridiculous.
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how is this even a question? so you have 3 install limits. that means that only 3 people can potentially install it instead of 50 million.

I wouldn't say it stops piracy, but it makes people think before doing or scared to do it. This doesn't take into account game hacks and stuff that remove the install limit.
 
mindcycle said:
The problem is that most games, i'd say 90% or more, are cracked day one or even before the release date. In those cases the DRM is largely ineffective and the money the publisher spent on said DRM is basically money wasted.
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Unsurprisingly, the much-complained-of Securom protections on Bioshock and Mass Effect did, in fact, stop zero-day piracy. In fact it took ages for a non-broken ME crack to appear. Meanwhile, the basically unprotected ME2 has been floating around on torrents for weeks (release is today), with pirating assholes coming on the official forums to spoil everyone.

The pirates have a powerful FUD machine that cranks up against any protection that works. Sucks for us.
 
pontifex said:
how is this even a question? so you have 3 install limits. that means that only 3 people can potentially install it instead of 50 million.

I wouldn't say it stops piracy, but it makes people think before doing or scared to do it. This doesn't take into account game hacks and stuff that remove the install limit.
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They've already admitted DRM is going to eventually be broken, and that they plan for that. So if you already know your system is going to be broken, why put an install limit on it? It doesn't delay the time it takes for crackers to break the install limit one iota, nor does it make them "think twice."

Here is how a cracker looks at cracking the game.
1. Create the crack
2. Test the crack, see if you can install the game without it calling home. (you do this WITHOUT having the internet/network cable plugged in).
3. if step two fails repeat.
4. publish crack.

That is the work flow, in a nut shell. You can see, that the only consideration they would take to the install limit is making sure their internet is unplugged before testing out their cracks. It is barely even a consideration to them, and definitely not a hindrance.

The ONLY people that will have issues with the install limit are legitimate users of the game.
 
Does anyone know if the Steam version will be DRM restricted? If it is going to be, I'm not going to bother paying full price or even discounted 33.75 for it.
 
Maybe after a while it will come out on steam, like Bioshock finally did.


Personally, I'm ok with the 6-9 install limit if they remove it after a couple of years as they did bioshock 1.


Maximilian said:
Heh... six and half dozen :/

Piss poor they dont just release the thing on steam without any of the bundled securom or GFWL suckage. Most of their sales will be on consoles anyways why they are putting so much effort into this is beyond me, seems like a clueless higher up was tasked with overseeing the PC version and decided more DRM = less piracy = better.
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pontifex said:
how is this even a question? so you have 3 install limits. that means that only 3 people can potentially install it instead of 50 million.
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Unless it's cracked, like every other piece of software in history.

So now instead of buying used games at EB Games which no longer work due to install limits, your option for cheap games is to torrent them. This are good biznezz!
 
*adjusts tin foil hat*

I think DRM is a very clever way to have users buy console versions rather than PC versions. But why even make a PC version you ask? Easy! If they just canceled the PC version, fed up PC gamers wouldn't buy it on principle. And why do they want that console gaming over PC gaming? Easy as well! DLC has to be purchased to be played. "But DLC is only a small portion of profits!" True, except when you have 1-2 million people paying an extra $10 for something that you "didn't finish on time for release" adds up fast. Also, to play online, you need to pay a fee for some consoles. Not to mention everyone likes to have a large screen TV. Eventually, they can phase PC gaming out. That is a lot less configurations they have to support. Less money developing, more profits.

It is all money. It makes sense though; every company wants to make a profit.
 
I remember when I got Gears of War for the PC, and there was a big bug early on where GFWL would corrupt your save data and delete ALL of your save games. Yeah, that was fun starting over again when I was on the train in Act 5 on Insane. :\
 
This was a good trick by 2k Games. I don't know if I give them too much credit, but it's pretty shrewd if they planned this out. They include the controversial SecuROM, impose install limits, and then do this bowing and scraping act to address consumer outrage and win back some favor. But what have they really done? They removed SecuROM-based install limits, but enforce the same limit through GFWL. Great.

I'm generally pretty vehemently anti-DRM, but temporary install limits make sense in the world of digital distribution, as long as the limits are eventually removed or used-up installs are easily refunded upon uninstallation or with a tool. My issue is that they use SecuROM at all. GFWL isn't much better in terms of annoyance, and BioShock 2 still has both.
 
Isn't GFWL tied to your account? Wouldn't it mean you can't activate it with more than 15 accounts? Or is there something I'm missing?
 
zerogear said:
Isn't GFWL tied to your account? Wouldn't it mean you can't activate it with more than 15 accounts? Or is there something I'm missing?
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I guess that would be an important distinction, but I think you consume one activation every time you install and set up the game + GFWL. I'm not sure, though.
 
CoinOperatedBoy said:
I guess that would be an important distinction, but I think you consume one activation every time you install and set up the game + GFWL. I'm not sure, though.
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Even if it is that, couldn't you just create an offline account to login to like every other GFWL games under the sun? How would they 'activate' it then?

As far as I know GFWL is mainly for achievements/multiplayer, so I would assume that it would only protect that element of the game.
 
I think the GFWL only needs to be activated for each account. Like, for instance, say I buy it and activate it under an account, then I reinstall it. I don't have to input the GFWL code in again if I log into my account. If for some reason my account gets deleted, and I use the code again, that is two activations.
 
smackababy said:
I think the GFWL only needs to be activated for each account. Like, for instance, say I buy it and activate it under an account, then I reinstall it. I don't have to input the GFWL code in again if I log into my account. If for some reason my account gets deleted, and I use the code again, that is two activations.
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You do have to input the GFWL code again...well at least I know you do if you reinstall Windows. I don't know whether you have to if you uninstall and reinstall the game though. I had to input the CD-Key for GTA IV, Fallout 3, and Batman AA...the last of which I was unable to restore my save for, which makes me SO mad since I was more than halfway through the game!
 
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xCxStylex said:
Personally, I'm ok with the 6-9 install limit if they remove it after a couple of years as they did bioshock 1.
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Clarification: they didn't remove online activation itself (which is what they should have done), they just changed the limit to "infinity+1". So there will still come a day when 2K Games takes those servers down and no one can install Bioshock anymore.

CoinOperatedBoy said:
This was a good trick by 2k Games. I don't know if I give them too much credit, but it's pretty shrewd if they planned this out. They include the controversial SecuROM, impose install limits, and then do this bowing and scraping act to address consumer outrage and win back some favor.
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Exactly the same thing 2K Games and EA did with Bioshock & Mass Effect. Say the status quo is at 4 (out of 10). Introduce a game with level 6 DRM. Wait for the whiplash. "Relax" the DRM requirements until it's only level 5. The community is happy because "it's not as bad as it could be", ignoring the fact that it's still worse than it used to be. That's how the frog boils in the pot, y'know.

zerogear said:
Isn't GFWL tied to your account? Wouldn't it mean you can't activate it with more than 15 accounts? Or is there something I'm missing?
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2kElizabeth was clear in stating that Bioshock 2 is a non-SSA game (Server-Side Authentication), so no, it won't get tied to your account (GFWL can do SSA or non-SSA). Examples: everything on Steam or Steamworks is SSA - one game serial, one account, forever. Red Faction: Guerilla was SSA on GFWL - one game serial, one account, forever. Mass Effect is non-SSA - install limits but transferable license, does not get tied to a unique account.
 
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