Bill O'Reilly its time for gun control

[LegendKiller]

Yes, I do believe that is the topic.
And what I put forth is a comprehensive compromise that falls short of the Dem's desire to outlaw and confiscate every single firearm. Though admittedly, it'd look a lot like that. But my idea allows everyone to "hunt" and defend their home. It also maintains an armed society to a degree.

With the frequency of shootings, there is an obvious dilemma in the United States.

The frequency of shootings? They are a statistically insignificant amount as a percentage of all deaths for the average citizen not engaged in crime or gangs or suicides. You'd be far better off requiring ignition interlock in ever vehicle made and mandating retrofitting all vehicles to prevent 100% of dwi deaths, accidents..etc.

 

[LegendKiller]

Ummm, they work pretty well actually.

Yeah, tell that to the mp which just died. Reportedly it was a home made gun.

 

[openwheel]

The "gun loving" crown is so arrogant when it comes "gun control" because the typical anti-gun writers don't have a clue about weapons. Somehow they feel they are in the right because they can tell the difference between Glock and H&K. They lack common sense when it comes to gun laws.

I am a proud gun owner but I am the first to admit there is a huge problem with gun laws in this country. I get it, it's a toy and we don't want our toys taken away. Problem is, no one is proposing to take our toys away.

 

[buckshot24]

The frequency of shootings? They are a statistically insignificant amount as a percentage of all deaths for the average citizen not engaged in crime or gangs or suicides. You'd be far better off requiring ignition interlock in ever vehicle made and mandating retrofitting all vehicles to prevent 100% of dwi deaths, accidents..etc.

More people die in ladder falls than mass shootings.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isYF5E0WxGU

 

[WelshBloke]

Yeah, tell that to the mp which just died. Reportedly it was a home made gun.

Interesting argument you've got there.

So even though there's a vastly lesser amount of gun deaths in the UK vs the US because there's a recent gun death in the UK that means that the UK gun laws aren't working?

Thats your argument?

Feel free to put up your own words as to why the UK gun laws are dysfunctional if you think I'm being unfair.

 

[Artdeco]

The "gun loving" crown is so arrogant when it comes "gun control" because the typical anti-gun writers don't have a clue about weapons. Somehow they feel they are in the right because they can tell the difference between Glock and H&K. They lack common sense when it comes to gun laws.

I am a proud gun owner but I am the first to admit there is a huge problem with gun laws in this country.

I just read an interesting piece, suggesting that if one becomes knowledgable about firearms, one tends to become an advocate. I've met a ton of people over the years, and can't remember one that knew anything about guns not being a gun owner, or someone that was an advocate changing their opinion, aside from folks getting up in years and deciding they shouldn't drive or own guns...

The other dynamic I suspect in play is that our politicians feel they are at risk (and probably rightly so) of violence, being that AR15's and ther variants are as popular, a ban or a restriction may personally affect them.

And I agree, gun laws are a mess...

 

[LegendKiller]

Interesting argument you've got there.

So even though there's a vastly lesser amount of gun deaths in the UK vs the US because there's a recent gun death in the UK that means that the UK gun laws aren't working?

Thats your argument?

Feel free to put up your own words as to why the UK gun laws are dysfunctional if you think I'm being unfair.

What are your demographics? What about drugs, illegal immigrants, gang activity...etc.

Simply comparing rates without adjusting for those is idiotic and would likely result in comparable homicide rates even including guns.

Preventing legal owners because criminals are criminals when homicide rates for legal gun owners is ridiculous.

 

[buckshot24]

I just read an interesting piece, suggesting that if one becomes knowledgable about firearms, one tends to become an advocate. I've met a ton of people over the years, and can't remember one that knew anything about guns not being a gun owner, or someone that was an advocate changing their opinion, aside from folks getting up in years and deciding they shouldn't drive or own guns...

The other dynamic I suspect in play is that our politicians feel they are at risk (and probably rightly so) of violence, being that AR15's and ther variants are as popular, a ban or a restriction may personally affect them.

And I agree, gun laws are a mess...

Seems like the cause and effect would be the other way around. You become knowledgeable because you're interested. I don't know anything about Pokemon because I have no interest in it.

 

[ivwshane]

What are your demographics? What about drugs, illegal immigrants, gang activity...etc.

Simply comparing rates without adjusting for those is idiotic and would likely result in comparable homicide rates even including guns.

Preventing legal owners because criminals are criminals when homicide rates for legal gun owners is ridiculous.

So by bringing up the UK shooting, you were doing what exactly? Comparing the two without looking at all the variables? Yeah you are right, it was a pretty idiotic thing to do.

Self ownage for the win!

 

[glenn1]

The frequency of shootings? They are a statistically insignificant amount as a percentage of all deaths for the average citizen not engaged in crime or gangs or suicides. You'd be far better off requiring ignition interlock in ever vehicle made and mandating retrofitting all vehicles to prevent 100% of dwi deaths, accidents..etc.

Yeah, I kinda remember infrequency being a key element of the argument against Voter ID for some folks. I guess the willingness of some on the left to demand a photo ID is completely dependent on how the quick cost/benefit they do. I can see the flow chart in their head already and imagine the conditional logic and resulting decision tree.


SELECT <(check photo ID)>;
WHEN <buying gun>, <buying alcohol> <getting married> .......
ELSE
SELECT <(no photo ID)>;
WHEN <voting>
IF <likely to vote Democrat>
OTHERWISE
end

 

[SlowSpyder]

Interesting argument you've got there.

So even though there's a vastly lesser amount of gun deaths in the UK vs the US because there's a recent gun death in the UK that means that the UK gun laws aren't working?

Thats your argument?

Feel free to put up your own words as to why the UK gun laws are dysfunctional if you think I'm being unfair.

I'm sure your gun laws are fairly effective in doing what they are meant to do. But for America, I don't think the right answer should be trading away a right for more security. Especially not when that right is one of the pillars the country was founded on.

If the UK banned skateboarding, statistically they may have fewer kids dying from head injuries due to skateboarding. Does that mean we should follow suit and ban or significantly restrict skateboarding? How much freedom do we trade for the warm fuzzy feelings and perception of a safer society?

 

[LegendKiller]

So by bringing up the UK shooting, you were doing what exactly? Comparing the two without looking at all the variables? Yeah you are right, it was a pretty idiotic thing to do.

Self ownage for the win!

No, it is proof that people who want guns will get them anyway. How is that "self ownage"?

Did you eat lead paint chips as a kid?

 

[WelshBloke]

What are your demographics? What about drugs, illegal immigrants, gang activity...etc.

Simply comparing rates without adjusting for those is idiotic and would likely result in comparable homicide rates even including guns.

Preventing legal owners because criminals are criminals when homicide rates for legal gun owners is ridiculous.

As far as I'm aware the US is (overall) a decent, first world country. It would have to be a complete shit hole if, as you appear to be implying, the difference in gun death rates was down to a dysfunctional society and not the prevalence of guns in the country.

I'm not sure that I agree at all with your argument that the UK is in some way 'better' than the US. We simply have a whole lot less guns due to our gun laws.

 

[LegendKiller]

Interesting argument you've got there.

So even though there's a vastly lesser amount of gun deaths in the UK vs the US because there's a recent gun death in the UK that means that the UK gun laws aren't working?

Thats your argument?

Feel free to put up your own words as to why the UK gun laws are dysfunctional if you think I'm being unfair.

Hey, if you want to give up your rights to appease nanny state nuttery, go ahead. It isn't surprising coming from the UK. It's why we tossed you guy out.

 

[ivwshane]

No, it is proof that people who want guns will get them anyway. How is that "self ownage"?

Did you eat lead paint chips as a kid?

Ah so now you want to go down the, "unless a law prevents all crime, it's a bad law and not worth it" argument?

I've never had lead paint chips, how did you like them?

 

[LegendKiller]

The "gun loving" crown is so arrogant when it comes "gun control" because the typical anti-gun writers don't have a clue about weapons. Somehow they feel they are in the right because they can tell the difference between Glock and H&K. They lack common sense when it comes to gun laws.

I am a proud gun owner but I am the first to admit there is a huge problem with gun laws in this country. I get it, it's a toy and we don't want our toys taken away. Problem is, no one is proposing to take our toys away.

What huge problem?

Define huge.

 

[LegendKiller]

Ah so now you want to go down the, "unless a law prevents all crime, it's a bad law and not worth it" argument?

I've never had lead paint chips, how did you like them?

What is "all crime"? The number of deaths from gun crime outside of gangs and suicide is statistically insignificant.

 

[ivwshane]

What is "all crime"? The number of deaths from gun crime outside of gangs and suicide is statistically insignificant.

It was a generalized statement and the point seems to be lost on you.

I'm also not sure where you are coming up with this "statistically insignificant" number.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5071639.html

 

[WelshBloke]

Hey, if you want to give up your rights to appease nanny state nuttery, go ahead. It isn't surprising coming from the UK. It's why we tossed you guy out.

I was hoping that you might come back with something of substance to back up your arguments.

 

[Artdeco]

As far as I'm aware the US is (overall) a decent, first world country. It would have to be a complete shit hole if, as you appear to be implying, the difference in gun death rates was down to a dysfunctional society and not the prevalence of guns in the country.

I'm not sure that I agree at all with your argument that the UK is in some way 'better' than the US. We simply have a whole lot less guns due to our gun laws.

But you guys don't have to spend $1,000's of $ to buy silencers either, we have some damn stupid laws, because the folks writing the laws aren't listening.

For instance glenn1 is willing to accept new laws and trying to discuss the issue.

I'm kind of with the NRA mindset that every inch ends up being a mile that we give up, and with the mindless stuff I'm reading, I'm not a fan of further laws.

To really effect change, all semi automatic weapons, revolvers etc need to be banned and confiscated, there are so many weapons in this country, it'll take 50-75 years to wear them out.

If confiscation happens any time soon, there are literally a thousand "militias" in the US, and a lot of individuals that'll resist, think standoffs like Waco & Ruby Ridge, et al cropping up for decades.

I think the wisest thing is to ban the sale of semi autos without confiscation, offer a buy back program (for years) and enforce the hell out of existing laws would be the path of least resistance.

Then the terrorists will be forced to bomb and stab us, or use guns, like Europe

 

[openwheel]

It really comes down to this:

People who love guns want to keep buying guns with fewer restriction.

People who want to ban guns have no idea how big a 9mm is anyway.

NRA wants to sell more guns because money is beautiful, as beautiful as guns. Period.

No one knows how to compromise to come up with sensible gun laws in America. We get Donald Trump as POTUS 45 and China takes over as the leader of the "FREE WORLD".

 

[WelshBloke]

But you guys don't have to spend $1,000's of $ to buy silencers either...

I bet you wouldn't either if you didn't have the guns to screw them on to.

Then the terrorists will be forced to bomb and stab us, or use guns, like Europe

Are you saying that there are less bombs and stabbings because you have more guns? I don't think that it works like that.


I'm not arguing for any gun laws in the US, it's not my country and, frankly, if you want shooting someone to be a legitimate option that's up to you guys.
I was just taking issue with the argument that the UK gun laws don't work, they quite clearly do.
What you guys do about guns is your problem.

 

[ivwshane]

But you guys don't have to spend $1,000's of $ to buy silencers either, we have some damn stupid laws, because the folks writing the laws aren't listening.

For instance glenn1 is willing to accept new laws and trying to discuss the issue.

I'm kind of with the NRA mindset that every inch ends up being a mile that we give up, and with the mindless stuff I'm reading, I'm not a fan of further laws.

To really effect change, all semi automatic weapons, revolvers etc need to be banned and confiscated, there are so many weapons in this country, it'll take 50-75 years to wear them out.

If confiscation happens any time soon, there are literally a thousand "militias" in the US, and a lot of individuals that'll resist, think standoffs like Waco & Ruby Ridge, et al cropping up for decades.

I think the wisest thing is to ban the sale of semi autos without confiscation, offer a buy back program (for years) and enforce the hell out of existing laws would be the path of least resistance.

Then the terrorists will be forced to bomb and stab us, or use guns, like Europe

I'd be fine with that!

 

[LegendKiller]

I was hoping that you might come back with something of substance to back up your arguments.

And I was hoping you'd come back with something other than thumb sulking nanny state nuttery. Did you turn in all of your knives like a good little boy?

 

[Artdeco]

I bet you wouldn't either if you didn't have the guns to screw them on

Damn, I could have sworn you were in Germany, oops :'(