bill gates call to end h1-b visa cap
- Thread starter z0mb13
- Start date
some of the quotes:
One, he claims we are not graduating enough math and science majors and two, the graduates aren't as good as those educated in other countries.
Gates claimed there are not enough skilled programming people here and so he needs to hire foreign nationals.
One, he claims we are not graduating enough math and science majors and two, the graduates aren't as good as those educated in other countries.
Gates claimed there are not enough skilled programming people here and so he needs to hire foreign nationals.
And hes totally correct. Most computer science grad, and many CE grads are incompetent at programming. IMHO its better to allow importation of labor, than exportation of labor, atleast economically.
soon more of these visas will be granted to chinese nationals becos david stern claims the US aren't growing enough tall people fast enough
so you are talking out of your ass
h1b is only for skilled workers, visa for sport players are different
alkemyst
No Lifer
- Feb 13, 2001
- 83,769
- 19
- 81
providing the rules of h1-b are followed I agree with this.
The problem I see is in the beginning the H1-B rules require you have to have a 'fair compensation' and you have to have searched domestically for the right candidate. Currently I know this gets abused.
Later on, once the H1-B people are in the marketplace and *willing* to work for less, your 'fair compensation' drops measurably.
In an enterprise like Micro$oft, Bill sees that. He knows if he can get this passed he can have an army of Indian programmers happy to have a nice income and willing to work for next to nothing and some benefits (and not care about living in Seattle).
However, I don't agree with paying more than someone is willing to work for....but it has to be across the board or the economy suffers. We really need to get away from paying power and light guys $100k+ a year, auto assembly line workers upper 5 figures and beyond, the garbage man a decent 5 figure income, etc.
I see a lot of the gluttony in America allowing other nations to surpass it in might eventually, even if we are still the *richest* nation.
The problem I see is in the beginning the H1-B rules require you have to have a 'fair compensation' and you have to have searched domestically for the right candidate. Currently I know this gets abused.
Later on, once the H1-B people are in the marketplace and *willing* to work for less, your 'fair compensation' drops measurably.
In an enterprise like Micro$oft, Bill sees that. He knows if he can get this passed he can have an army of Indian programmers happy to have a nice income and willing to work for next to nothing and some benefits (and not care about living in Seattle).
However, I don't agree with paying more than someone is willing to work for....but it has to be across the board or the economy suffers. We really need to get away from paying power and light guys $100k+ a year, auto assembly line workers upper 5 figures and beyond, the garbage man a decent 5 figure income, etc.
I see a lot of the gluttony in America allowing other nations to surpass it in might eventually, even if we are still the *richest* nation.
Drakkon
Diamond Member
- Aug 14, 2001
- 8,401
- 1
- 0
IMO Its not that their aren't enough skilled programmers its that there are so many that are still in the "I DESERVE 100K a year working from home only 8 months a year" mindset while overseas people are still realistic...so long as i can hire two guys in asia for every 1 guy here and get 1.5 times as much work done from them as i would the american programmer its going to be worth it. Also the attitude of those overseas (when they do work for you) is MUCH more respectful than most american's out there, to them the first question i get asked after tuning in a project is "how did it work for you" while from my american counterpart I hear "when will i get my paycheck"
another benefit of abolishing the h1b is a boost to our stupid immigration system..
instead of wasting green cards by chance (via the lottery), why not give them to people that are actually productive to the society?
Looks like you kiddies better get to work and start taking some real courses and actually learning something or you are going to wake up one day and only be able to find work at Starbucks while all the foreigners have all the good jobs.....all while you complain that the foreigners having the good jobs is the PROBLEM.
Now don't get mad at me, I realize a lot of you you young folks are actuallyseeking real degrees but you have to realize that the educational system in this country completely sucks and has slowly been dumbed down over the decades. This means that YOU have to make it a point to learn stuff that is relevant to your degree and aspirations on you own. If you have a passion then follow it and never loose your craving for information and knowledge as a silly degree means very little in the way of real world skills and abilities these days. It is all up to you. A degree might get you a job but a degree alone won't let you keep it or advance. It is time to get back to a more Puritan work ethic in this country.
Now don't get mad at me, I realize a lot of you you young folks are actuallyseeking real degrees but you have to realize that the educational system in this country completely sucks and has slowly been dumbed down over the decades. This means that YOU have to make it a point to learn stuff that is relevant to your degree and aspirations on you own. If you have a passion then follow it and never loose your craving for information and knowledge as a silly degree means very little in the way of real world skills and abilities these days. It is all up to you. A degree might get you a job but a degree alone won't let you keep it or advance. It is time to get back to a more Puritan work ethic in this country.
He's at the top of his game, of course he doesn't care about the normal middle class person in america.
this is actually good for normal middle class person.. it gives them more competition to not sit on their asses and actually do something worthwile rather than banking on their respective unions
One problem is that while Microsoft might want H1-B to bring in highly skilled people, many other companies use it to bring in normally-skilled, low-paid indentured servants (who will be forced to leave the US very quickly if their employer drops them).
There can be no 'low-paid' servants as the rules for H1B clearly states that the salary has to be at the current 'normal' level.
The rules are obviously not followed. I know someone who was being grossly underpaid in the 40k-50k range in the 90s with a MSEE in Silicon Valley. When he got his greencard, he immediately resigned and got a new job over 80k.
They should remove foreign students who get degrees within the US from the H1-b limit.
That's the theory, along with a supposed effort to recruit in the US first. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. Some companies decide to break the rules just like they do on paying overtime.
I've read first-hand accounts from H1-B workers who were underpaid, and were kept in line (extra hours and no back-talking) by the difficulty of finding a new H1-B job in the allotted time.
I've read conflicting data on exactly how widespread the problem is of hiring normally-skilled workers for low-end wages is -- groups representing US workers say it happens often, industry trade groups say it happens rarely if at all, and the government doesn't seem to put too much effort into getting more reliable data.
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