Big 3 Take A Thumping In June

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Who wants a gas car when you can drive a Telsa or a Volt.

Anyone who wants to drive more than 100 miles in a single day.

ZV

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: Ktulu
Might want to change the title to "Big 4".

Toyota apparently took a huge hit of 21%.

http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2202954&enterthread=y

So how are the Toyota nut riders going to spin this?

I'd guess Tundra sales dropped like a rock.

I don't see why 4 cylinder Camrys and the Corolla sales would drop?

Fern

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: Ktulu
Might want to change the title to "Big 4".

Toyota apparently took a huge hit of 21%.

http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2202954&enterthread=y

So how are the Toyota nut riders going to spin this?

I'd guess Tundra sales dropped like a rock.

I don't see why 4 cylinder Camrys and the Corolla sales would drop?

Fern

Maybe because it has more to do with the failing economy and less to do with the Big 3 getting their "just desserts".

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: WHAMPOM
NA! It is 2008 and an EV1 would get 300 miles plus with an upto date battery pack instead of the orignal sixty mile-lead/acid. But GM destroyed them all, a great example of cutting of their nose to spite their face.

Not that we need 300-mile battery packs; a 60-mile commuter vehicle satisfies the needs of 90% of our population.

It would satisfy the need to dictate what people can have, that much is certain.

As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: Ktulu
Might want to change the title to "Big 4".

Toyota apparently took a huge hit of 21%.

http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2202954&enterthread=y

So how are the Toyota nut riders going to spin this?

I'd guess Tundra sales dropped like a rock.

I don't see why 4 cylinder Camrys and the Corolla sales would drop?

Fern

corolla was up 15.6%. prius sales were down ~33% because toyota has supply issues.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Ldir

Originally posted by: Genx87

4-600 mile ranges will be a requirement for these things to replace pure gasoline engines.

Why? Most gasoline cars do not have that range.

Because you can't refill an electric car in under 5 minutes the way you can a gasoline vehicle. There are several times each year where I will drive over 800 miles in one day.

ZV

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

Ask people again next year when the national average for gas is $5.50/gallon.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

Ask people again next year when the national average for gas is $5.50/gallon.

not going to happen.

 

[Engineer]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Who wants a gas car when you can drive a Telsa or a Volt.

Anyone who wants to drive more than 100 miles in a single day.

ZV

And what's wrong with the Volt in that respect? It uses both charge and generator (gas) and has a 600+ mile range. I see no issues.

 

[Engineer]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

Ask people again next year when the national average for gas is $5.50/gallon.

not going to happen.

At some point, it will indeed happen. Oil isn't going to last forever.....

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

Ask people again next year when the national average for gas is $5.50/gallon.

not going to happen.

What's not going to happen?

When gas was $3/gallon back in February, how many people said "it's not going to happen" about $4/gallon? Four short months later, it's a reality.

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

Ask people again next year when the national average for gas is $5.50/gallon.

not going to happen.

I bet you said that about 4 dollar gas too.

 

[Oceandevi]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

Ask people again next year when the national average for gas is $5.50/gallon.

not going to happen.

What's not going to happen?

When gas was $3/gallon back in February, how many people said "it's not going to happen" about $4/gallon? Four short months later, it's a reality.

Its been at 3.99 here bud. So there.

I drive 12 miles each way to work. I want a solar car so I can ride the solar winds.

 

[Ktulu]

Can the OP please update their post to reflect the real numbers

http://online.wsj.com/article/...tml?mod=googlenews_wsj

Honda up 1.1%
GM down 18.5%
Toyota down 21.4%
Ford down 28%
Chrysler down 36%

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Ktulu

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

Ask people again next year when the national average for gas is $5.50/gallon.

not going to happen.

I bet you said that about 4 dollar gas too.

no, i didn't

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As much as I agree that an electric car with a 60 mile range would meet the needs of maybe 80% of the population about 80% of the time, the simple fact is that, for most people, that loss of 20% of their functionality is not an acceptable compromise.

ZV

Ask people again next year when the national average for gas is $5.50/gallon.

not going to happen.

What's not going to happen?

When gas was $3/gallon back in February, how many people said "it's not going to happen" about $4/gallon? Four short months later, it's a reality.

you will not see 5.50 gas in 2009, barring *real* war or massive disaster, like the arabian peninsula sinking into the ocean or russia getting nuked

 

[ericlp]

Good...

Personally I hope 2 of the big 3 ... awww, fuck it, I hope all 3 go out of business. I'd feel a bit sad if one of them actually made a hybrid that got 40-50 MPG. Wake up call?

.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: mxyzptlk

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Who wants a gas car when you can drive a Telsa or a Volt.

Kinda sucks that if you were in the income bracket that could afford a Tesla, rising fuel costs would be of little concern to you in any vehicle.

and I guess you'd have to be from the future to drive a volt..

I would have thought that anybody who can rub two words together would have figured out that many people won't buy big ticket items today when what they really want is only two years away.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: ericlp
Good...

Personally I hope 2 of the big 3 ... awww, fuck it, I hope all 3 go out of business. I'd feel a bit sad if one of them actually made a hybrid that got 40-50 MPG. Wake up call?

.

gm is going in the right direction i feel, i general like chevy's lineup

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: Engineer

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Who wants a gas car when you can drive a Telsa or a Volt.

Anyone who wants to drive more than 100 miles in a single day.

ZV

And what's wrong with the Volt in that respect? It uses both charge and generator (gas) and has a 600+ mile range. I see no issues.

Tesla:

231 mi EPA city
224 mi EPA highway
227 mi EPA combined (city/highway)

Volt: 40 mi battery and the 350-400 gas hybred.

 

[StageLeft]

shocker that toyota dropped this much but honda didn't.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
shocker that toyota dropped this much but honda didn't.

toyota had been moving pretty forcefully into the tradition big-car american market, ie trucks and suv's. I'm not surprised at all.

 

[KlokWyze]

Volkswagon FTW. 🙂

 

[Banzai042]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Skoorb
shocker that toyota dropped this much but honda didn't.

toyota had been moving pretty forcefully into the tradition big-car american market, ie trucks and suv's. I'm not surprised at all.

I'd say this is a pretty accurate assessment, particularly combined with the supply problems with the prius that were mentioned earlier. I don't think that it's a toyota exclusive problem, but many of their popular vehicles that started out small have gotten large. I don't get why a new version of a car seems to mean larger dimensions and more weight, I have yet to see an exception to this rule, though it's possible that I missed something.

I would say that part of the problem is that the price of gas spiked too fast for the auto makers to react. The fact that they could have, and probably should have, reacted sooner exists, but at the same time there wasn't a great economic incentive to do so at the time. As Csaba Csere of car and driver pointed out in his column in the July 2008 issue, the development of a car takes a long time. His example was the Pontiac Solstice: Bob Lutz started working for GM in September 2001, and initiated a fast track program to get a cheap sports car ready for the Detroit auto show in January 2002, barely having a moving mockup ready in record (by a large margin) time. The solstice then hit showrooms in 2005. Consider that this was a car receiving huge editorial accolades before being available for sale, and was part of Lutz's campaign to get GM back on track, so they had a large incentive to get it out fast. The reality of the situation is that the cars for the next few model years are already in the process of production, which involves the setup for production lines that takes place after the design is completed. The cars on sale now were designed when Gas was still relatively cheap and the idea of large engined SUVs was still popular. I think it's going to be a few more years before we have any cars aside from the few token hybrid models that truly address the fuel cost situation.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

It should be noted in terms of number of sales per capita, the numbers are even more dismal since our nation's population continues to increase every day.