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BFG 7800 GTX $47X and ATI X800 XTPE $229

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Games run on the Ti4200 look just as nice as games run on a 6 series

Yeah, sure, keep telling yourself that. So i suppose.

But three years from now you'll have to turn off those "quality" settings anyway on your 6 series card, because it will be too slow to run with them on.

Why would it be too slow to run the quality settings from 3 years prior. Yeah, if were the quality settings 3 years from now, but the settings from 3 years prior should be able to run moderately well.

Link

New card, all the features including fully functional Video Processor. A mere 10 bucks more than the eBay. Oc this sucker and unlock the pipelines, and it will flatten the 9500 (and the Softmodded one). Unlocked and OCed this thing could easily match a 9800 series card.. but you get all the features.

-Kevin
 
It's obvious you guys thirst for threads like this.

So what'll it be? X800XTPE for 229.00 or 7800GTX for 470 ish?

I vote X800XTPE because it's bargain basement for this card.
 
Well ive had a ti4200 and all the features it has i have to turn off just to get acceptable frame rates.

So this will happen with GFX cards 3 years or less down the road. Games will become to demanding even for feature rich cards of today.
 
Originally posted by: Avalon
Games run on the Ti4200 look just as nice as games run on a 6 series, minus the special effects such as DX9.0 water, soft shadows, and high def lighting.

How silly is that? Thats like saying a TNT can "look just as nice" as games run on a 6 series, without all the effects the 6 series can do, that the TNT cannot do.

Besides, only in a static screenshot can it look as nice, without the effects you mention. When in montion, the Ti4200 wont get playable rates, when the 6 series can. Such as high res, and AA/AF. Its all subjecive, but from my point of view, gaming on a Ti4200 is ghetto. I would be in single digits with the settings I play at, not something I would enjoy.

Originally posted by: Avalon
BF2 will not run on a 4200.

That's unfortunate. Still, it's taken 3 years for a title to come out that finally requires the DX9 spec to run.

It doesnt require DX9. It requires a card that can do PS1.4. Something the GF2/3/4's cannot do. The 8500 however can.

 
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Games run on the Ti4200 look just as nice as games run on a 6 series

Yeah, sure, keep telling yourself that. So i suppose.

But three years from now you'll have to turn off those "quality" settings anyway on your 6 series card, because it will be too slow to run with them on.

Why would it be too slow to run the quality settings from 3 years prior. Yeah, if were the quality settings 3 years from now, but the settings from 3 years prior should be able to run moderately well.

Link

New card, all the features including fully functional Video Processor. A mere 10 bucks more than the eBay. Oc this sucker and unlock the pipelines, and it will flatten the 9500 (and the Softmodded one). Unlocked and OCed this thing could easily match a 9800 series card.. but you get all the features.

-Kevin

That card unlocked is roughly the same speed as an unlocked 9500, unless you get a decent overclock on it. Plus it costs more. It may be worth it, but we're talking big budget sector here, and many won't mind saving a bit of change.

I've played games on Ti4200 cards. Even HL2 looks just as good as it does on my 6600, minus shiny water, but even that can be remedied. Of course, if you had a card with crappy picture quality, that is the vendor's issue, and not the chip's. Yes, I already said that I know you will have to drop the resolution to get more playable framerates, which is one way you could say that the game would not look as good. However, that's rather subjective. I find that after 12x9 to me, you get extremely diminishing returns as far as picture quality goes when you keep upping the res. As long as it's 10x7 it looks pretty good to me.

I never said it would be too slow to run 3 year old games three years down the road. I said it would be too slow to run new games using the features that card from three years back supported. IE, trying to run in SM3.0 mode in a game that supported it that came out 2-3 years from now. If you're only going to play today's games, then why are we talking about down the road?

How silly is that? Thats like saying a TNT can "look just as nice" as games run on a 6 series, without all the effects the 6 series can do, that the TNT cannot do.

It's as silly as your opinion makes it. To each his own. You know perfectly well that picture quality VASTLY improved from the TNT days to the GF4 days. A GF4 should still be able to produce similar modern picture quality.

Thank you for the clarification of BF2's requirements.
 
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Which is what i have been saying the entire time. If you are fine playing the games with almost all of the quality settings turned off go for it. The 6800's and up have support for those features and are only a few frames per second slower than the X800's. Therefore, in the long run, a 6800 and up will last longer than an X800 series card because of the support for these features, unless of course you are fine playing the games of tomorrow looking like the games of today.

Which you'd be doing anyway cuz you can't run the 6800s with HDR on anything higher than lastgen resolution.

You're almost outdoing rollo, except with a laughable 5900xt I guess you can't pull the superiority complex.
 
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
TAA is no gimmick.

Temporal AA is a gimmick. It is very useful in older titles and some titles today. However, if people think that the X800's are going to be pulling 60fps constantly, with VSYNC on in the next years, they are sadly mistaken... AND NO im not saying a Geforce will do any better in that respect.

-Kevin

That doesn't make it a gimick. Sure it is dissabled when your framerate drops below 60 but it comes right back on when the framerate picks back up again. If you don't like vsync then TAA is pointless, but for people like me who insist on vsync it provides a notable improvment in image quality whenever the framrate is high enough to sutain the effect and with no preformace hit at all.
 
I would insist on vsync is NV would support triple buffering better.

Originally posted by: Avalon

It's as silly as your opinion makes it. To each his own. You know perfectly well that picture quality VASTLY improved from the TNT days to the GF4 days. A GF4 should still be able to produce similar modern picture quality.


Why should it? Its going on 4 years old. Is there some law I dont know about that video cards are supposed to follow? The GF4 is past its usefulness for most people. Let it go, and move on.
 
Originally posted by: Ackmed
I would insist on vsync is NV would support triple buffering better.

Originally posted by: Avalon

It's as silly as your opinion makes it. To each his own. You know perfectly well that picture quality VASTLY improved from the TNT days to the GF4 days. A GF4 should still be able to produce similar modern picture quality.


Why should it? Its going on 4 years old. Is there some law I dont know about that video cards are supposed to follow? The GF4 is past its usefulness for most people. Let it go, and move on.

Because it CAN in HL2 and Doom 3. I agree that it is no longer that useful for most people, but I was just using it as an EXAMPLE. 3 years from now a 6 series will be just as useless as a 4 series is right now. Which can also be said about the x800 series. I'm just trying to say that neither is really going to outlast the other, and in context with this thread, certainly not enough to warrant an extra $250. Besides, we don't even know what monitor and resolution the OP plays his games at.
 
How silly is that? Thats like saying a TNT can "look just as nice" as games run on a 6 series, without all the effects the 6 series can do, that the TNT cannot do.

THANKYOU!!

I've played games on Ti4200 cards. Even HL2 looks just as good as it does on my 6600, minus shiny water

And of course any of the other DX9 features as well as PS1.4 features. Give me a break, you cannot possibly argue that a 4200 looks as good as any card out there when it is so many generations of technology back.

That card unlocked is roughly the same speed as an unlocked 9500, unless you get a decent overclock on it. Plus it costs more. It may be worth it, but we're talking big budget sector here, and many won't mind saving a bit of change.

Yeah, but who would unlock it and not OC it at all?? Additionally, you do forget that this card is:

A. New
B. A Generation ahead
C. Offers MANY features over the 9500 (I can list them)
D. Both cards need softmodding (When this card is softmodded and OCed it will handily beat the Unlocked 9500)

You're almost outdoing rollo, except with a laughable 5900xt I guess you can't pull the superiority complex.

You are incomparable. Everysingle thread, all you do is drop in and troll. Instead of mindlessly flaming me why dont you form your own opinion. Almost everyone else here can have a logical, well thought out argument; try to follow suit.

That doesn't make it a gimick. Sure it is dissabled when your framerate drops below 60 but it comes right back on when the framerate picks back up again. If you don't like vsync then TAA is pointless, but for people like me who insist on vsync it provides a notable improvment in image quality whenever the framrate is high enough to sutain the effect and with no preformace hit at all.

I dont mind VSYNC. For some reason i have to keep it on or my screen is unreadable and almost scrolling all over the place. While in some games TAA can be a very nice addition. In another part of todays games, you are not going to be able to pull 60fps; more specifically to fit this thread, tomorrows games (ie 1-3years down the road) will not be running at a nice happy 60fps. TAA remains a nice feature, thats about all you can say about it.

I've played games on Ti4200 cards. Even HL2 looks just as good as it does on my 6600, minus shiny water, but even that can be remedied. Of course, if you had a card with crappy picture quality, that is the vendor's issue, and not the chip's. Yes, I already said that I know you will have to drop the resolution to get more playable framerates, which is one way you could say that the game would not look as good. However, that's rather subjective. I find that after 12x9 to me, you get extremely diminishing returns as far as picture quality goes when you keep upping the res. As long as it's 10x7 it looks pretty good to me.

Ok a 4200 can run with all the features from its timeframe (ie PS1.1 etc...). Therefore there is no reason why a 6800 series chip cannot run with the features from its time. Down the road none of these cards today will support the new specs for graphics standards so they can only run with the feature set given at the time... in which case the 6800 series will run in SM3, with all that other crap; whereas the X800 will run in SM2.

You're almost outdoing rollo, except with a laughable 5900xt I guess you can't pull the superiority complex.

Well actually it is because i am only 17 years old and have many other things to spend my money on. When i got that card almost 2 years ago, it was on sale, and it had the VIVO features which i needed for much less than the 9800's (which were clearly the performance leaders). So why dont you get off my back, about what hardware i am running and either:

A. Logoff
B. Contribute to this thread.

-Kevin


 
I think that the best thing to do is to ignore many of these "arguments" in order to make a good judgement call for youself. Simply put, both cards have their strenghts and weaknesses:

The ATI is an extremely fast card, even compared to the 7800GTX. However, it does lack a few features than the Geforce 6/7xxx cards (not a ton - not looking for a game of semantics here). Additionally, a $229 card is a very good buy; this would be a rather smart and economical purchase. I'd say go for the ATI if you plan on staying AGP for a while.

The 7800 GTX, on the other hand, is literally the fastest consumer card you can buy. And $479 for this card is a good deal, too. Not only is it slightly faster than the x800, but it also supports a number of features including (but not limited to SM 3.0). Having said this, one should also consider that the 7800 carries an almost $250 premium over the x800XT PE. Personally, I would go for the NVIDIA simply because all of my current systems are PCI-E, as will be any upcoming builds within the near future. Also, understand that the 7800 is not more future-proof because of SM 3.0; rather, it is more future-proof because all new motherboards by Intel/NVIDIA/ATI/etc. are based on PCI-E and NOT AGP. So if you plan on moving to PCI-E anyitme within the near future, the 7800GTX will be the smarter choice.

As I said earlier, try to ignore a lot of the fanboyish nonsense in this thread, as it contributes nothing to your decision at hand.

 
I am a little afraid that when Ati/Nvidia releases a nice new lineup of cards, that the value of the 6800, x800 lines may drop right off. Look what happened to the value of a 9800xt, down to nothing and the 5950 ultra even less than nothing. Still I am tempted as it is a good match for an aging agp system.
 
Oh well I am in for one, letter says 3 to 4 weeks, so I have plenty of time to change my mind if something better comes along. :beer:
 
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
You're almost outdoing rollo, except with a laughable 5900xt I guess you can't pull the superiority complex.

Well actually it is because i am only 17 years old and have many other things to spend my money on. When i got that card almost 2 years ago, it was on sale, and it had the VIVO features which i needed for much less than the 9800's (which were clearly the performance leaders). So why dont you get off my back, about what hardware i am running and either:
Hilarious how you don't take your own advice. Instead of buying the more expensive 9800 with more features, features that are now being used today infact, you buy a 5900 XT with less features (but is slower, unlike the x800s which are faster than the 6800s). Looks like your so called "opinion" took a direct 180.
 
Originally posted by: zendari
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
You're almost outdoing rollo, except with a laughable 5900xt I guess you can't pull the superiority complex.

Well actually it is because i am only 17 years old and have many other things to spend my money on. When i got that card almost 2 years ago, it was on sale, and it had the VIVO features which i needed for much less than the 9800's (which were clearly the performance leaders). So why dont you get off my back, about what hardware i am running and either:
Hilarious how you don't take your own advice. Instead of buying the more expensive 9800 with more features, features that are now being used today infact, you buy a 5900 XT with less features (but is slower, unlike the x800s which are faster than the 6800s). Looks like your so called "opinion" took a direct 180.


lol
 
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
How silly is that? Thats like saying a TNT can "look just as nice" as games run on a 6 series, without all the effects the 6 series can do, that the TNT cannot do.

THANKYOU!!

I don't need to scramble for support to make my own opinion feel more solid.

I've played games on Ti4200 cards. Even HL2 looks just as good as it does on my 6600, minus shiny water

And of course any of the other DX9 features as well as PS1.4 features. Give me a break, you cannot possibly argue that a 4200 looks as good as any card out there when it is so many generations of technology back.

I just did.

That card unlocked is roughly the same speed as an unlocked 9500, unless you get a decent overclock on it. Plus it costs more. It may be worth it, but we're talking big budget sector here, and many won't mind saving a bit of change.

Yeah, but who would unlock it and not OC it at all?? Additionally, you do forget that this card is:

Who would not OC the 9500? Plus, I'm not forgetting anything. Let me show you.

A. New So is the 9500, some of mine come boxed BBA still sealed, while others come as new system pulls
B. A Generation ahead And? They perform the same. Your card is $70 shipped, mine is $45.
C. Offers MANY features over the 9500 (I can list them) So why didn't you? A lot of these features still aren't even hardly used.
D. Both cards need softmodding (When this card is softmodded and OCed it will handily beat the Unlocked 9500)The 9500 can unlock and OC as well. There's NO WAY this card will "handily" beat an unlocked and OC'd 9500. If you get a good overclock on it, it will slightly best it. I should know, I own both 6200 and 9500 cards? 6200s do not often hit the 500mhz core speed of their 6600GT brethren. It's rare. In addition to that, we're stuck with DDR memory, which is usually good for 700-800mhz.

I'm in no way saying the 6 series are bad cards. I think they've got a slight edge to the x800 series. However, the OP does not have infinite funds. It will last him 3 years, even if by then he has to reduce his resolution. If you really believe the OP is going to need 6 series features, then he should hover around Newegg's refurbs. Leadtek has a refurbed 6800GT that pops up from time to time for $210, and I believe it was AGP.
 
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
Not only is it slightly faster than the x800

It is a hell of a lot more than slightly faster.

-Kevin


Nothing more than semantics, which is exactly what I was trying to avoid in my post. Sure, we are all aware of the performance difference between the x800 and the 7800; I was simply trying to offer an unbiased comparison between the two.

 
Originally posted by: zendari
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
You're almost outdoing rollo, except with a laughable 5900xt I guess you can't pull the superiority complex.

Well actually it is because i am only 17 years old and have many other things to spend my money on. When i got that card almost 2 years ago, it was on sale, and it had the VIVO features which i needed for much less than the 9800's (which were clearly the performance leaders). So why dont you get off my back, about what hardware i am running and either:
Hilarious how you don't take your own advice. Instead of buying the more expensive 9800 with more features, features that are now being used today infact, you buy a 5900 XT with less features (but is slower, unlike the x800s which are faster than the 6800s). Looks like your so called "opinion" took a direct 180.


Busted! 😀
 
Originally posted by: zendari
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
You're almost outdoing rollo, except with a laughable 5900xt I guess you can't pull the superiority complex.

Well actually it is because i am only 17 years old and have many other things to spend my money on. When i got that card almost 2 years ago, it was on sale, and it had the VIVO features which i needed for much less than the 9800's (which were clearly the performance leaders). So why dont you get off my back, about what hardware i am running and either:
Hilarious how you don't take your own advice. Instead of buying the more expensive 9800 with more features, features that are now being used today infact, you buy a 5900 XT with less features (but is slower, unlike the x800s which are faster than the 6800s). Looks like your so called "opinion" took a direct 180.

Hmmmm.... i cant think of any features that the 9800Pro supports that the 5900XT doesn't. Looks like you have no clue what you are talking about.

Yeah my opinion changed huh?

I already said that i didn't have a lot of money yet needed VIVO. This was the fastest 5900XT but also the cheapest. It also came with a custom fan. I realized full well the 9800 was faster, however i needed VIVO to do video editing. Additionally when i got this card i was 15. Unlike the OP who can afford the 7800 i could not afford a 9800. I was running a Geforce 2Ti before that, and it was pitiful. I didn't want to save any more money or anything, i just needed something to go along with my, at that time, new system.

Once again, nothing to add to this conversation. Just trying to make someone look bad. Well, here is some news, you aren't going to succeed in proving me wrong in this matter, so just quit trolling and flaming.

-Kevin
 
Originally posted by: Avalon
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
How silly is that? Thats like saying a TNT can "look just as nice" as games run on a 6 series, without all the effects the 6 series can do, that the TNT cannot do.

THANKYOU!!

I don't need to scramble for support to make my own opinion feel more solid.

I've played games on Ti4200 cards. Even HL2 looks just as good as it does on my 6600, minus shiny water

And of course any of the other DX9 features as well as PS1.4 features. Give me a break, you cannot possibly argue that a 4200 looks as good as any card out there when it is so many generations of technology back.

I just did.

That card unlocked is roughly the same speed as an unlocked 9500, unless you get a decent overclock on it. Plus it costs more. It may be worth it, but we're talking big budget sector here, and many won't mind saving a bit of change.

Yeah, but who would unlock it and not OC it at all?? Additionally, you do forget that this card is:

Who would not OC the 9500? Plus, I'm not forgetting anything. Let me show you.

A. New So is the 9500, some of mine come boxed BBA still sealed, while others come as new system pulls
B. A Generation ahead And? They perform the same. Your card is $70 shipped, mine is $45.
C. Offers MANY features over the 9500 (I can list them) So why didn't you? A lot of these features still aren't even hardly used.
D. Both cards need softmodding (When this card is softmodded and OCed it will handily beat the Unlocked 9500)The 9500 can unlock and OC as well. There's NO WAY this card will "handily" beat an unlocked and OC'd 9500. If you get a good overclock on it, it will slightly best it. I should know, I own both 6200 and 9500 cards? 6200s do not often hit the 500mhz core speed of their 6600GT brethren. It's rare. In addition to that, we're stuck with DDR memory, which is usually good for 700-800mhz.

I'm in no way saying the 6 series are bad cards. I think they've got a slight edge to the x800 series. However, the OP does not have infinite funds. It will last him 3 years, even if by then he has to reduce his resolution. If you really believe the OP is going to need 6 series features, then he should hover around Newegg's refurbs. Leadtek has a refurbed 6800GT that pops up from time to time for $210, and I believe it was AGP.

You make some very good points. If both cards were one of those rare cards that OC a lot, then i think the 6200 would edge out, especially because of features. I did go a bit overboard in the description, averting from fact to shady fact. Sorry, the 9500 is a good deal but the 6200 just appears to be better in mind. But its all good 🙂

I think it is time to settle this argument. Both are good cards, and both have their pros and cons. Pick the one that suits you best.

-Kevin
 
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
That doesn't make it a gimick. Sure it is dissabled when your framerate drops below 60 but it comes right back on when the framerate picks back up again. If you don't like vsync then TAA is pointless, but for people like me who insist on vsync it provides a notable improvment in image quality whenever the framrate is high enough to sutain the effect and with no preformace hit at all.

I dont mind VSYNC. For some reason i have to keep it on or my screen is unreadable and almost scrolling all over the place. While in some games TAA can be a very nice addition. In another part of todays games, you are not going to be able to pull 60fps; more specifically to fit this thread, tomorrows games (ie 1-3years down the road) will not be running at a nice happy 60fps. TAA remains a nice feature, thats about all you can say about it.
Who cares if you don't get a constant 60fps? Even when shooting for a minimum of 30fps your framerate will break 60 quite a bit of the time; at which point TAA kicks in and makes things look that much nicer. It doesn't hurt performance, it just falls back to standard AA when the action gets too heavy, but it is still a free AA improvement whenever your framerate can manage it.
 
Originally posted by: TheSnowman
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
That doesn't make it a gimick. Sure it is dissabled when your framerate drops below 60 but it comes right back on when the framerate picks back up again. If you don't like vsync then TAA is pointless, but for people like me who insist on vsync it provides a notable improvment in image quality whenever the framrate is high enough to sutain the effect and with no preformace hit at all.

I dont mind VSYNC. For some reason i have to keep it on or my screen is unreadable and almost scrolling all over the place. While in some games TAA can be a very nice addition. In another part of todays games, you are not going to be able to pull 60fps; more specifically to fit this thread, tomorrows games (ie 1-3years down the road) will not be running at a nice happy 60fps. TAA remains a nice feature, thats about all you can say about it.
Who cares if you don't get a constant 60fps? Even when shooting for a minimum of 30fps your framerate will break 60 quite a bit of the time; at which point TAA kicks in and makes things look that much nicer. It doesn't hurt performance, it just falls back to standard AA when the action gets too heavy, but it is still a free AA improvement whenever your framerate can manage it.

I already knew all that. Also, I just retracted my previous statement and said it was a nice feature. What more do you want me to say about it? It isn't a groundbreaking feature, and it shouldn't sway your opinion in choosing video cards. Once again, it is a nice feature!

-Kevin
 
Originally posted by: Gamingphreek
It isn't a groundbreaking feature, and it shouldn't sway your opinion in choosing video cards. Once again, it is a nice feature!

-Kevin

The same could be said about "soft shadows", HDR and other GF6/GF7-only features.
 
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