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Beyond what we know as the "Universe"????

D

Darien

Platinum Member
Ok, if the universe is said to be expanding, where exactly is it expanding into?

What exists beyond what we know as spacetime?

And, if there were to be a wormhole from some place in spacetime at any given time, connecting to the end of the universe, making the wormhole constantly expand (if possible), what would happen if you were to travel through it?

Also, if there were to be "holes" in spacetime, would they ever be fixed?

...Not sure if this fits in "Highly Technical" (if not, I'm sorry), but these are just a few questions that I can't exactly answer with my limited knowledge in the many branches of physics.

Thanks 🙂

Darien
 


<< Ok, if the universe is said to be expanding, where exactly is it expanding into? >>

Into 'nothing'.



<< What exists beyond what we know as spacetime? >>

'nothing' 😉

No matter, no energy, no dimensions. 'nothing' 😉



<< And, if there were to be a wormhole from some place in spacetime at any given time, connecting to the end of the universe, making the wormhole constantly expand (if possible), what would happen if you were to travel through it? >>


- the existance of wormholes is still doubtful

- end of the universe? If space-time is curved, then there is no 'end of the universe', just as there is no 'end of the Earth'.



<< Also, if there were to be "holes" in spacetime, would they ever be fixed? >>

Holes? Black holes, wormholes, ....?



<< ...Not sure if this fits in "Highly Technical" (if not, I'm sorry), but these are just a few questions that I can't exactly answer with my limited knowledge in the many branches of physics. >>

Nah, this is probably the best place for this type of questions.
The guys in Off Topic would probably blow up their minds when reading about this subject 😉
 
your kidding right??
what book or movie did you hash??
in order to even realy think about that you have to have
studied quantum machanice and quantum physics and
astronimy
(spelling not included)
then a degree in pholisphy and religon might be helpful.
and if you consider ,that we are,was,will be.
and that space and time are NOT seperate things
then you will realize that those questionns can only be answered later,now and before.

lol
only what 95% of the world considers GOD, could answer those questions
 
LOL at Elledan 😀

I did take it seriously and I do come to the same conclusion as Elledan.

Definitely the questions for HT
 
Hm... the Universe is everything. Asking what is beyond it/outside has no meaning. It's like asking "what is the shape of blue," ie ascribing qualities to an object that it doesn't have. So it's the "un-askable" question 🙂.
 
It doesn't make sense to talk about something outside of the universe. It's just not applicable. Try not to think of it as someone (like God?) on the outside looking in. In order to fully understand anything within the universe, you must totally abandon the perception of something existing outside of it.

Holes in spacetime are analogous to black holes. They aren't 'broken,' they appear naturally, so how can they be fixed? No such thing as broken holes in spacetime. That would imply looking at something outside of the universe.

The universe isn't defined as 'end-to-end' like conventional length. Spacetime is curved, so who knows exactly where end to end is over a span of millions of light years. Wormholes are still theoretical, black holes are not. Until the theory of quantum gravity is complete, it's anyone's guess what happens if you get sucked into a black hole/worm hole.

 
funny how the HT forum goes in cycles. a bunch of new hardware comes out and isnt to intresting (read: KT333) and people start popping up asking theoretical physics q's =).
 
Beyond the "Universe"? We all know that the universe is a marble and there are giant aliens playing a game with us as we speak. *nod nod*

Hardware doesn't help define the meaning of life. (privately laughing head off at that statement)

erhem, anyway.

Never seen Antz or Bug's life. I tend to eradicate the life of all invertebrates I come across.

As for what exists beyond spacetime, I have no clue, but I think if there was something beyond, it would imply the addition of yet another dimension to the, what, eleven already in place? Talk about your headaches.

If the universe is expanding, I think it has more to do with our interpretation of space. If spacetime is relative (see Einstein and Lorentz contractions), then our measurement of space is relative and it just so happens that we're speeding up or slowing down relative to space or something and we're seeing its effect as the expansion of the universe.

If wormholes did exist (doubt it, but you never know) then the length of the wormhole (aka like driving through a tunnel) should stay the same regardless of how far apart the openings are in "normal" spacetime.

Rips in spacetime do occur. Spacetime will tear, but it repairs itself. I doubt you could try hitching a ride and flying through the tear, considering it's only supposed to occur at a scale smaller than the smallest fundamental particle. (Go figure)
This was proven mathematically and backed up by simulation by three physicists a few years ago, but has yet to be cemented solidly into the annals of science. Who knows, maybe it'll be disproven or has been disproven and I haven't heard about it. I think these guys or one of them was the one who said black holes were fundamental particles. *shrug*
 
The universe is NOT expanding into NOTHING, because NOTHING is something.

The universe is simply traveling across a larger entity we do not know of yet, probably the plane of dimensions, which goes up & up & up & up. The largest thing would simply be energy in and of itself. So basically, the universe is expanding into pure energy.
 
Sorry, I really do not have any references being as it is a theory I thought up myself...

I am currently seeking people who have the same theory ( they have to exist ) and try to find them, but to no avail.
 
Well, the latest edition of Scientific American had something about how the Universe was a 3d "brane" wrapped onto a 4d object and that there was a corresponding 3d brane almost infitesmally close to ours. Whenever they touched, another big bang would happen apparently.

Dont know where they come up with this stuff.
 
"Space" and "time" (rather "distance" and "time") are ideas quantified and described using phenomena composed and ruled by them. This makes them directly or indirectly self-referential.

The idea that the universe is expanding is based on the assumption that the "normal" state of space and time or their relationship to each other should be constant, linear, etc....

The word "expanding" makes one think that there must be a medium for the expanding thing to expand into.

The fact of the matter is that nobody knows what is "outside" of this universe. It is possible that there is no "outside" to our universe. It is possible that the expansion that we think we have theorized or measured is not expansion, but is actually anything or nothing that causes our perception to change.

Thus we wind back to the two subjects that all threads devolve into: religion or politics.
 


<< Thus we wind back to the two subjects that all threads devolve into: religion or politics. >>


Fact: religions are based on the absence of evidence.

Fact: many theads eventually devolve into religious or political debates.

Conclusion: politics is based on the absence of evidence?

Hmm....
 


<< LOL @ Elladen!

Undeniable fact 😛 >>



😛



<< So basically, the universe is expanding into pure energy. >>



Interesting idea, since the amount of energy is finite (currently according to Einstein), then I view this as a balloon (sp ) in a box. Here is my go at it, there is some sort of barrier exists and the universe in contained within the barrier. Now the 'free' energy in the in the universe want to get out, but some how the universe is gapless, the 'free' energy caused the universe to expand.

The analogy is, the barrier as box (there is a finite amount of energy contain within), universe as balloon, 'free' energy as packets, or air particles (for a balloon) with kinetic energy.
 


<< there is some sort of barrier exists and the universe in contained within the barrier >>



But then, what's outside the barrier? 😛

And btw, all knowledge at some level is based on absense of evidence.
 


<< And btw, all knowledge at some level is based on absense of evidence. >>


Uhm, no. Knowledge is based on evidence, information. You can't derive knowledge from a void.
 


<<

<<

<< But then, what's outside the barrier? >>



Nothing 😉 >>


Then why have a barrier in the first place? 😉 >>



Well that because there is a finite size in the box for the balloon (universe) to expand into, taking someone idea of expanding into pure energy (finite amount of energy, accord to Ein ). So in other words, the universe would expand as big as the box (energy ) allows.

As for why have a barrier a the first place, well that is the same as energy, why have energy in the first place (I know conservation of energy, but by the same analogy 😉 ). It is just 'there' 😛
 
I think you're saying like:

The energy would expand until it is "used up" or it requires that much energy to remain in it's current position and thus cannot expand...

What happens when there's no more energy for expansion? Will the energy's "desire" for expansion start to suck up other energy? AHHH!!

/me runs from evil energy!

Seriously though, I think it's an interesting concept. See, I never really regarded energy to be finite in amount, but it adds an interesting twist to my theory i posted below. That would mean your "box" theory would be correct and thus the universal expansion is limited.

Cross that to my time theory ( time = distance from origin basically ) and you'll get an interesting new idea 🙂
 


<< The energy would expand until it is "used up" or it requires that much energy to remain in it's current position and thus cannot expand... >>



I preferred the term 'absorbed' 😉 to keep inline with Ein for now 😛




<< What happens when there's no more energy for expansion? Will the energy's "desire" for expansion start to suck up other energy? AHHH!! >>



I guess it will start to form more matters, masses, big crunch anyone ( I know I am contradicting myself in the other topic, but it's fun to look both ways 😉 ) ? The universe is shrinking here. You can think the rest 😛

Or the 'free' energy is absorbed by the matter that already exists, universes starts to shrink again. The massive increase in energy I matter (mass, planets and etc ) results in another big bang?


Anyone up for a game of heads or tails 😛
 
You can't derive knowledge from a void
Click to expand...

Yes you can... that's what a definition is. Or alternatively, in the same way it takes faith to believe that a God is present, it takes faith to believe that the laws of physics will not change tomorrow - since there has been no credible evidence to the contrary, we believe the laws are immutable. You can assert anything you want, and it's credible so long as there is no evidence to disprove it. In fact, I may just be the first sentient gerbil to ever post on ATHT. 😉
 
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