Best way to handle an eBay dispute

[daniel1113]

I purchased a relatively high-value keyboard on ebay which finally arrived today. Here is the listing.

The keyboard arrived today and appears to have been damaged in transit (there's a large indentation which causes four of the keys to stick when pressed, so it's not just cosmetic damage). I immediately took photos of the packaging and damage and sent it to the seller and am now in the process of figuring out how the deal with the situation. The keyboard was insured via UPS, but I don't think this is a situation where UPS was negligent, so I fully expect my claim to be denied.

Assuming that UPS denies my claim, I'm curious to see how you would handle the situation, either in my shoes as the buyer, or as the seller.

If I as the buyer offered to find a local repair shop to pay for the costs up to the amount it would cost me to return the keyboard to the seller, but asked the seller to pay for any additional costs, would that be fair?

While I really think the damage should be paid for by the seller because of improper packing, I think we can both get what we want if each of us pay a small amount for the damage.

 

[Leros]

the damage should be paid for by the seller because of improper packing

ding ding ding

When you ship a $725 item, you package it really well.

 

[daniel1113]

ding ding ding

Yes yes! However, I suppose that what I was driving at is that if given an option between paying the shipping fee to return the item back to shipper and paying for repairs, I'd prefer to pay for repairs so that I could keep the keyboard. Otherwise, I'm out the shipping fees with no keyboard to show for it.

 

[Leros]

Yes yes! However, I suppose that what I was driving at is that if given an option between paying the shipping fee to return the item back to shipper and paying for repairs, I'd prefer to pay for repairs so that I could keep the keyboard. Otherwise, I'm out the shipping fees with no keyboard to show for it.

Sure. Its the sellers responsibility to fix it, but if you can save money and have it be more convenient then go for it.

 

[Zorkorist]

You and he made a bargain, and he shipped it in the agreed upon way.

Your beef is not with the seller, but with the shipper.

His obligation was done when he shipped.

 

[Mike Gayner]

You and he made a bargain, and he shipped it in the agreed upon way.

Your beef is not with the seller, but with the shipper.

His obligation was done when he shipped.

Wrong. If it was no adequately packaged, which seems to be the case, then it's the seller's responsibility.

 

[octopus41092]

Try to work out something you're both satisfied with. If the seller is being unreasonable you can always open up a claim on eBay and they pretty much always side with the buyer.

 

[Zorkorist]

Wrong. If it was no adequately packaged, which seems to be the case, then it's the seller's responsibility.

Wrong. UPS/Shipper can decline to receive the package if they feel it is inadequtely packed.

Once they accept the package, it is on them.

 

[buzzsaw13]

Wrong. UPS/Shipper can decline to receive the package if they feel it is inadequtely packed.

Once they accept the package, it is on them.

I think you have too high expectations from UPS, they don't give a crap if packages are poorly packed. I have never heard of anyone being turned away because they didn't package something properly

 

[Zorkorist]

You've heard the phrase "Free on Board?" That means that I will get it "on board" but then it is up yo you.

As soon as the shipper leaves with your package, it is on you...

unless I committed fraud, etc., of course.

But you own that package, dameaged in shipping, or not.

I have no resposibility, once I ship it.

 

[Zorkorist]

I think you have too high expectations from UPS, they don't give a crap if packages are poorly packed. I have never heard of anyone being turned away because they didn't package something properly

I'm just saying, that is the buyers problem, not the sellers.

 

[Leros]

I'm just saying, that is the buyers problem, not the sellers.

So if I mail you a vase and it breaks because I shipped it in a plastic bag, that would be your problem?

 

[Zorkorist]

If I paid you for the Vase, and asked you to ship it... absolutely my problem.

 

[Zorkorist]

It boils down to "free on board." Once I give a Vase to a shipper, and they accept it... I am done.

Unless, I say "free on board, your house, your hands." Then I own it, untill I put it in your hands, at your house.

But, in general, for ebay transactions, etc., you own it the second I ship it in our mutually agreed apon way. With or without insurance.

The shipper, can always yell, if I am shipping a vase in a plastic bag... if it's insured etc., they WILL yell...

otherwise, the buyer can claim against the shipper company for $100, or whatever... but they can't claim against the seller as he shipped them their product.

 

[daniel1113]

Thanks for everyone's input.

The whole difference in opinion regarding shipping is one the reasons I am curious what other buyers/sellers think of these situations. I generally agree that once a package is handed to a courier, any problems with mishandling should be between the buyer and courier simply because the buyer will be possession of the damaged box, item, etc. and therefore in a better position to file a claim. However, if the item was not properly packed in the first place, the responsibility immediately returns to the seller since 1) the courier will not pay for damage to improperly packed items and 2) the buyer generally has no control over packing. All this assumes, of course, that the buyer paid for insurance.

 

[Kelemvor]

Pics of the packing, box, etc?

 

[daniel1113]

I usually don't side with UPS, but I gotta admit, I don't think they did anything wrong with this one.

Box 1

Box 2

Packing

Damage 1

Damage 2

I also just discovered that even though the seller packed the box himself, he used a third-party for the postage (like a UPS Store). That makes the whole UPS claim process a huge PITA because the third-party usually becomes the shipper of record instead of the actual seller.

 

[Kelemvor]

Did the damaged part line up with that packing part in the middle? It doesn't look like it was. Looks like it was damaged before it was shipped. If it got dented that far in you should see damage to the box itself if it got ran into or dropped or something like that.

 

[daniel1113]

Did the damaged part line up with that packing part in the middle? It doesn't look like it was. Looks like it was damaged before it was shipped. If it got dented that far in you should see damage to the box itself if it got ran into or dropped or something like that.

No, the damaged part is closer to the 1/3 point, kinda between the side packing and middle packing. There is no damage to the box itself in the area where the keyboard was damaged, which is why I'm not jumping to blame UPS.

 

[T9D]

...

 

[dud]

I don't know what you mean by the shipper packed it or someone else packed it wrong. All I'm seeing is the original boxing from the factory. He just put it in there and sent it off. I don't see what more you could expect from him. Unless you paid extra and told him to double box it and he didn't. The factory boxing is fine for shipping. This is totally a UPS problem with being to rough. UPS should be paying for it. And I think they will. Especially since it's a factory certified original box.

Agreed. that looks like he shipped it well. You can always do better ... but that looks more than adequate.

Any chance that the keyboard is not "new"? That box looks a bit aged.

 

[daniel1113]

I don't know what you mean by the shipper packed it or someone else packed it wrong. All I'm seeing is the original boxing from the factory. He just put it in there and sent it off. I don't see what more you could expect from him. Unless you paid extra and told him to double box it and he didn't. The factory boxing is fine for shipping. This is totally a UPS problem with being to rough. UPS should be paying for it. And I think they will. Especially since it's a factory certified original box.

Yes, it is all the factory packing, so that should help when dealing with UPS. However, just because he used the factory packaging doesn't mean it was packaged properly (at least, if I represented UPS, that's would I would argue). This is probably why a lot of online retailers double box expensive electronics... the factory packaging isn't always designed for individual shipping.

I am going to press UPS to pay for the damage, as that would be ideal for both the shipper and me. I appreciate the feedback.

 

[sswingle]

Since it was in its original box, which was intended to be used as a shipping box, its on UPS to cover it. How it happened isn't really relevant.

 

[daniel1113]

Agreed. that looks like he shipped it well. You can always do better ... but that looks more than adequate.

Any chance that the keyboard is not "new"? That box looks a bit aged.

Certainly possible, but there is nothing I can point to that suggests that it isn't new. The rest of the keyboard is flawless.

And I should be clear, I am not faulting the shipper in any way for the packing, as I probably would have packed it up the same way. I just don't think that I, as a buyer, have any responsibility to for damaged goods. Either the seller packed the item incorrectly or the courier mishandled the box. I had no control over either.

 

[compman25]

Did you use paypal? If so, just file a claim against him. Get your money back and make him eat shipping costs to return it to him.