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Best HDTV tuner for the PC

C

carage

Senior member
I was really looking forward to purchase an ATI HDTV Wonder last week, thankfually I didn't because the box was freaking huge. I just read through some of the reviews and I was especially alarmed and discouraged by the comments labeling it HDTV Blunder. I use a AMD cpu, nVidia motherboard, and nVidia videocard, seems like the combination destined for incompatibility disasters.

I am just wondering what else is out there?
Is the DVICO Fusion series or the Happauge offerings any good?
In addition to watching the over-the-air HDTV/DTV signals, I also plan to connect my cable to it, so two coaxial input seems like a must. SPDIF-out to soundcard for Dolby upmixing should be good too.
MPEG4 DivX support and remote controls are also categories to be considered.

The Fusion and the Happauge cards use the same Connexant chip that my old MSI TV@nywhere Master uses, which I am surely not impressed with the video quality.
 
The Macro Image Technology MyHD MDP-120 is considered to be one of, if not the best, PCI HDTV tuner. It's pretty pricey, especially if you get the associated daughter card. Another drawback is the fact that it's EPG (Titan TV) doesn't work everywhere, so if you're looking to do DVR, there's nothing really well-suited out there.

Link:
MyHD MDP-120
 
I own and use both the HDTV Wonder (since August) and MyHD MDP-100 (2 years)

IMHO, the HDTV Wonder is the superior product when used in MCE 2005..no contest, in MMC debateable.

The MyHD cards are good hardware but the software is pretty featureless (they are reputably about to release some better PVR functionality) If the software is improved, my assesment could change, but as it stands now, the HDTV Wonder is working very good for me and is my personal choice.

Don't get me wrong, MyHD has some feature advantages that make it attractive

*it can ouput directly to the HDTV display without having to go through the PCI bus using YPbPr or VGA..DVI with the 120 card and optional daughter card.
*The hardware Janus chip requires little CPU for decoding TS files.
*Its a mature product.
*Doesn't recognise the broadcast flag (yet)

A good share of the HDTV "Blunder" tag is somewhat deserved by installation issues and MMC software that needs polish..but for the most part it is completely overblown because it "sounds"catchy. For the price of MyHD, you can get MCE 2005 + HDTV Wonder and have a superior PVR solution. You do need a more powerful system, and output to your HDTV display requires the graphics card.

I use AMD + Nvidia Chipset MB and it works great in MCE 2005 with HDTV Wonder, I did have issues installing it with my 6800 card back in August when I first got it and just put it in my AIW rig instead where it has resided since.


I don't know much about the Fusion card except that it has its share of issues judging from some long threads on the matter. Hauppage doesn't make a decent HD solution at all.
 
What do you mean by broadcast flags (yet)?
I use a 6800 GT now, and I have no plans of switching to an ATi videocard for this matter.
Perhaps I should wait for a NVTV with HDTV support??
Is that ever coming out??
 
Originally posted by: mdahc
The Macro Image Technology MyHD MDP-120 is considered to be one of, if not the best, PCI HDTV tuner. It's pretty pricey, especially if you get the associated daughter card. Another drawback is the fact that it's EPG (Titan TV) doesn't work everywhere, so if you're looking to do DVR, there's nothing really well-suited out there.

Link:
MyHD MDP-120
Click to expand...

This product does not include a HDTV antenna, right??
 
Originally posted by: mdahc
I don't think so. I forgot you wanted to watch over-the-air HDTV.
Click to expand...

The plan is I want to watch BOTH regular cable AND over-the-air HDTV, so I think that means I can only go with a card with dual tuner inputs.
 
I have a FusionHDTV III, which would be most similar to the ATI HDTV Wonder as its also a software based cards, not a hardware decoding one like the MyHD. Which means its also on the cheaper end of the scale, around $150. I had some difficulty getting it initially set up, but after that its worked flawlessly. Some have problems with decoding QAM signals (hdtv over cable), but I'm not using it for that so can't comment. MyHD can't do that anyways.
 
Originally posted by: rbV5
I own and use both the HDTV Wonder (since August) and MyHD MDP-100 (2 years)

IMHO, the HDTV Wonder is the superior product when used in MCE 2005..no contest, in MMC debateable.

The MyHD cards are good hardware but the software is pretty featureless (they are reputably about to release some better PVR functionality) If the software is improved, my assesment could change, but as it stands now, the HDTV Wonder is working very good for me and is my personal choice.

Don't get me wrong, MyHD has some feature advantages that make it attractive

*it can ouput directly to the HDTV display without having to go through the PCI bus using YPbPr or VGA..DVI with the 120 card and optional daughter card.
*The hardware Janus chip requires little CPU for decoding TS files.
*Its a mature product.
*Doesn't recognise the broadcast flag (yet)

A good share of the HDTV "Blunder" tag is somewhat deserved by installation issues and MMC software that needs polish..but for the most part it is completely overblown because it "sounds"catchy. For the price of MyHD, you can get MCE 2005 + HDTV Wonder and have a superior PVR solution. You do need a more powerful system, and output to your HDTV display requires the graphics card.

I use AMD + Nvidia Chipset MB and it works great in MCE 2005 with HDTV Wonder, I did have issues installing it with my 6800 card back in August when I first got it and just put it in my AIW rig instead where it has resided since.


I don't know much about the Fusion card except that it has its share of issues judging from some long threads on the matter. Hauppage doesn't make a decent HD solution at all.
Click to expand...

Can you please describe the kinds of problems encountered when installing the HDTV Wonder to work with a 6800 video card? At this point, the HDTV Wonder looks like a much more viable option that I might consider jumping through the hurdles if they are not too difficult.
MyHD is extremely expensive and still doesn't include an antenna. Fusion III doesn't include an antenna either, and it seems the only model DigitalConnections is selling is a single tuner input model.
I also considered WinTV-HD, but I heard that one is pretty old and doesn't come with an antenna either.
 
In the end I got the ATi HDTV Wonder, setup was a lot easier than I thought.
However, while I can't call my situation as a complete disaster, it is also far from perfect.
There are two most notable problems.
1. I can't change channels or the volume using the remote control. The remote fired up the ATI MMC TV player so I am pretty sure both the remote and the USB reciever should be working. I looked through the Remote Wizard settings but all I found was options for setting up the 6 programmable buttons.
2. The DTV player freezes all the time. Picture is usually fine when I start it up, although I might hear some weird noises. Then the player just freezes after I try to change the channel, after about 2 or 3 minutes it gives an unknown error message then shutsdown itself and sometimes Windows XP too.
Besides, whenever I start up DTV, it says DMA is not enabled on my hard drives, but I am sure they are enabled.
 
Welcome to the ATI HDTV Blunder carage. You might want to check over at www.avsforum.com, the home theater computers forum.
There is a giant thread dedicated to problems with the card, so maybe you can find some answers in there. 🙂
 
I guess I learned it the hard way, never buy something with a zillion rants about it...
I tried calling ATi, but obviously they are observing Thanksgiving too (hey, I thought Canada's Thanksgiving was like two weeks ago), so I can't find any live person to pick up the phone.
My e-mail to techsupport came back with a canned response telling me just about everything I already know.
I'll try again Monday.
 
After installing M$ .net framework it seems DTV has slightly better performance now, but why does M$.net have anything to do with it??
 
I bought the MyHD MDP-120 today, because I was under the impression that it is the only decent card that can still record from cable. I believe that the HDTV Wonder only has support for OTA recording (at least for HDTV) due to record-blocking stuff built in to it, forced by recent legislation. Is this true? I mean, say you were watching a cable TV show, could you record it and store the MPEG or whatever indefinitely?
 
Heh. I'll do my best, I promise. It will definitely be an idiot's guide, since I'm a real newbie at this stuff. It's my first TV tuner card.
 
It would be great to hear more solid reviews with detailed information regarding HDTV tuner cards. I am curious to hear about MyHD from MIT. Or if anyone has any good (descriptive) news about ATI's HDTV Wonder, I'd be happy to hear that too.

Here is my situation, I just bought a ATI HDTV Wonder at Comp USA for $150 (after rebate). Initially, I installed the ATI card on a version of Windows XP Serivice Pack 2, and I had some success getting the TV to work under ATI's software MMC (Multi-Media Center). It froze from time to time when trying to change channels in HD mode.

I then opted to try loading Windows MCE 2005 and see if I could get things cooking. I had recently read that HDTV Wonder was compatible with Windows MCE 2005 on some website. However, I did not read the fine print that you find when downloading the drivers on ATI's site. Basically, there appears to be a Catch-22, using the MCE 2005 drivers that ATI provides, as a side-effect, disables the Analog functionality of the card, so you are stuck with OTA (over-the-air) HD channels only. Wait a minute, that stinks!!

So some people on various forums were talking about having to use 2 TV tuner/capture cards together (one for analog cable, and one for OTA HD). This might be a decent solution if I already had an old Analog tuner/capture card, but I don't really feel like going out and buying one. So I was hoping to find a solution. Either, I need to ditch the whole MCE 2005 platform, or I need a new card that can work both modes. I wouldn't mind just using ATI's MMC software, but it seems to be a little glitchy, maybe this is because I still have the MCE 2005 drivers installed to support the HDTV Wonder.

Sasha
 
I don't own an HD card yet, but I've been doing extensive research for about a week now.
It seems that software HD cards (Fusion and HDWonder) are best with video cards supporting WORKING DxVA (i.e. ATI). Also, with the HDWonder, there are exact installation instructions on the ATI website you must follow for it to work right (e.g. .Net Framework, DX9, and Windows Media Encoder 9.0...). Alot of the problems I have seen also stem from having a previous TV cards installed, and not completely uninstalling the old software first. And then there is the problem of Hyperthreading causing MMC lockups.... large topic, not going to regurgitate it all..

For people doing a fresh install of OS and following the instructions precisely, the HDWonder is not a blunder except some of the MMC bugs. Also, software dev from ATI will progress speedily once demand gets large, and that will happen soon. However, since ATI is a high profile company, I doubt they will ever enable QAM support. For those that don't know, QAM support is needed to pickup HD over your cable connection, but only unencrypted. Most cable HD is encrypted, and NO HD cards will decode that. For this reason, I'm less enthusiastic about QAM than others.

The fusion is in a slightly different situation from the HDwonder. DVICO (producers of the Fusion cards) are really listening to HTPC enthusiasts, have enabled some QAM support, and respond to bugs more vigorously. They also just recently implemented time-shifting functionality which brings them up to where everyone else is. The software seems less buggy.

Overall I hope that ATI will soon improve MMC. They will have more industry support by virtue of their industry leading status. OTOH, Fusion is the more solid solution today. OTOH, Remote Wonder is a nice remote. OTOH, DVICO is less likely to doom the Fusion to obsolescence.

LOL, nevermind. I'll just flip a coin.
 
I bought the HDTV Wonder the day after Thanksgiving at the MicroCenter ($100, $150 with a $50 rebate). So I figured the investement wasn't to great.

I have an Athlon XP 3200+, ASUS A7N8X-E, Corsair Memory 1 gig, ATI 9600 Pro, Dell 17" HD Ready TV/Monitor.

I had read the rips about the HDTV Wonder but tried it anyway. The install was perfectly smooth and I was impressed with the reception of the little antenna but I knew I needed more. After connecting the Wonder to my antenna in the attic I had wonderful reception but I too had problems with the picture stopping and restarting, a real jerky motion. This is the same thing I had encountered with my digital television when the signal was poor. I downloaded and installed the latest software from ATI (not knowing that I should install in any particular order).

I guess I was fortunate because that fixed the "jerky" digital tv problem. All is not perfect. I am using MMC 9.03 and it freezes periodically while I am using it. Usually the "right click" is the killer.

Frankly the documentation really bites and I figure things out by trial and error. All and all I like the quality of the picture. With some work this will be a great product for the price.
 
Originally posted by: bigblue
I bought the HDTV Wonder the day after Thanksgiving at the MicroCenter ($100, $150 with a $50 rebate). So I figured the investement wasn't to great.

I have an Athlon XP 3200+, ASUS A7N8X-E, Corsair Memory 1 gig, ATI 9600 Pro, Dell 17" HD Ready TV/Monitor.

I had read the rips about the HDTV Wonder but tried it anyway. The install was perfectly smooth and I was impressed with the reception of the little antenna but I knew I needed more. After connecting the Wonder to my antenna in the attic I had wonderful reception but I too had problems with the picture stopping and restarting, a real jerky motion. This is the same thing I had encountered with my digital television when the signal was poor. I downloaded and installed the latest software from ATI (not knowing that I should install in any particular order).

I guess I was fortunate because that fixed the "jerky" digital tv problem. All is not perfect. I am using MMC 9.03 and it freezes periodically while I am using it. Usually the "right click" is the killer.

Frankly the documentation really bites and I figure things out by trial and error. All and all I like the quality of the picture. With some work this will be a great product for the price.
Click to expand...

It is good to hear that 9.03 works for you.
Unfortunately, it doesn't fix my problems and I do agree the HDTV Wonder delivers excellent video quality, that is when it is working.


 
Well I guess I spoke a little too soon. I am having lots of failures in MMC when I am trying to record programs both scheduled and on demand but especially scheduled. So far I guess I will have to happy with having paid just $100 for a solid HDTV tuner and someday maybe a viable DVR. Does anyone know what ATI has to say about all of these issues?
 
I have a question for rbV5.

You stated that the ATI HDTV card works will with MCE 2005. I am having problems with MMC. What seems to be the benefits of MCE 2005 with the ATI card? Do you believe acquiring MCE 2005 and installing (or reinstalling everything) would be beneficial? I really want the DVR functionality to work better.
 
What seems to be the benefits of MCE 2005 with the ATI card? Do you believe acquiring MCE 2005 and installing (or reinstalling everything) would be beneficial? I really want the DVR functionality to work better.
Click to expand...

The "main" benefit is the integration of the PVR into the OS, MCE 2005 is a very stable Front-end for the HTPC.

Others;

*The EPG seemlessly integrates the DTV and SDTV listings, and the PVR functions are the same for digital and analog.

*Scheduled recordings are "MUCH" better. I can't stress enough how much better scheduled recordings work with MCE. The GUI doesn't need to load for recording, and no stupid "test" for DMA to keep your recording from starting.

*Multiple tuner support. Another area that shines with MCE, I use dual analog tuners + a Digtal tuner, and recording multiple shows works great, it would be extremely rare to have a recording conflict.

*Hardware Tuner support. I use eHome Wonder analog tuners, they're cheap, they sport 12bit ADC's and Theater 200 VIVO chip (just like my AIW 9700pro) what they lack in format support, they make up for in ease of use...I just pick High Quality settings and done....recordings look great.

* Fully featured and polished. MCE has a ton of features, and the family can use it right out of the box. The MCE remote is great, the 10' GUI is pleasant. There is a SDK and a good userbase already. Third party developers, extenders and portable units. Microsoft is putting a huge amount of resources into MCE and it shows.

That briefly touches some of the things. I am an MCE convert now that the general public can get ahold of it through legit channels. I am also a long time MMC user and fan, but it falls short when compared to MCE at this point.
 
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