Best Buy calls 911 on customer asking for refund

[Golgatha]

Interesting...learn something new every day. Regarding contract law.

I purchased an entertainment center at a local furniture store. All sales final, no exchanges, no refunds. It's due to be delivered in two days and now they are telling me they sold it at the wrong price. It will be $500 more. Don't they have to honor the sales invoice at the price they sold it to me?

The quick answer is "Yes". "All sales are final" are the store's written terms of sale. Did they accept your check, cash, or put through a credit card charge? If so, you have a completed written contract.

If they continue to pursue the issue, send a certified letter, explaining that you will sue them in small claims court, for the "benefit of the bargain", meaning that you want what the unit was worth, not what you paid. Also mention that you will claim general and punitive damages for fraud up to the limit of the small claims court. Then do exactly what you said you would do. They are totally out of line.

 

[Jeeebus]

Originally posted by: daniel1113

Originally posted by: Jeeebus

Originally posted by: daniel1113

I am 99% sure that only applies to goods that met the requirements of the original contract (ie, non-faulty goods). In the case of faulty goods, US contract law applies.

wtf is "US" contract law?

US = United States

:hint: there is no such thing as what you're advocating... in other words, there is no "US contract law."

 

[termac50]

Well, they do have a policy against refunds for cd's, movies, software, etc. They only exchange an open item for the same exact one. So the customer was wrong. Manager was right in a sense, but wrong to be so quick to call 911. Why didn't the customer just take the replacement copy? Just look on the wall above customer service in any Best Buy, there's a BIG *SS sign up there with their return policy. And it's only been up there for YEARS.

I can see it both ways. Managers deal with people like this all day calling them names, etc. Clearly he overreacted. Both he and the customer now look like idiots. Calling 911 for something like this, and making a scene for a cd because you can't read the return policy.

 

[Aimster]

uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

 

[ElFenix]

they used to allow returns for defective items. i remember that because i wanted to return a copy of 'the wall 2000,' which was in with the pink floyd, that i had bought thinking it was pink floyd (it's not pink floyd, it's some horrific new age cover of pink floyd). CSR asked if it was defective, i said no. she said they only take returns for defective CDs. so i asked about deceptive items. she didn't like that so much.

 

[brxndxn]

Originally posted by: Aimster
uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

I bought X3 Reunion last year.. DOH HUGE MISTAKE

I only have an external DVDR drive and no internal optical drives since I like it to be right up on my desk and my computer is on the floor. Well, X3 would not work with my external drive no matter what.. so I had to go back in my closet and stick an old optical drive in my computer and reach down for each of the 6 discs that came with the game and stick them in the drive.

I believe I should've been able to return the defective X3 Reunion for a refund. A replacement would merely get me another defective set of discs that have copyright protection up the wazooo.

 

[JS80]

remember that guy who paid with $2 bills? haha

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: brxndxn

Originally posted by: Aimster
uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

I bought X3 Reunion last year.. DOH HUGE MISTAKE

I only have an external DVDR drive and no internal optical drives since I like it to be right up on my desk and my computer is on the floor. Well, X3 would not work with my external drive no matter what.. so I had to go back in my closet and stick an old optical drive in my computer and reach down for each of the 6 discs that came with the game and stick them in the drive.

I believe I should've been able to return the defective X3 Reunion for a refund. A replacement would merely get me another defective set of discs that have copyright protection up the wazooo.

You don't seem to understand what defective means. A disc that works as intended is not defective, even if it does not work the way you think it should. A lot of customers seem to think "defective" and "does not meet expectations" mean the same thing. When I'm buying something that I know I can' return (like a game), I do sufficient research ahead of time to decided whether to buy it.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Aimster
uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

Where did that come from? To use your own words - "wtf is the point of insulting him?"

 

[Aimster]

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: Aimster
uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

Where did that come from? To use your own words - "wtf is the point of insulting him?"

Im insulting him on the Internet.. I dont think the guy is going to care or find out?

& that was a semi-joke. I have no idea what his financial situation is. I am simply pointing out that the guy is missing something in his life so he feels the need to pick on someone.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: brxndxn

Originally posted by: Aimster
uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

I bought X3 Reunion last year.. DOH HUGE MISTAKE

I only have an external DVDR drive and no internal optical drives since I like it to be right up on my desk and my computer is on the floor. Well, X3 would not work with my external drive no matter what.. so I had to go back in my closet and stick an old optical drive in my computer and reach down for each of the 6 discs that came with the game and stick them in the drive.

I believe I should've been able to return the defective X3 Reunion for a refund. A replacement would merely get me another defective set of discs that have copyright protection up the wazooo.

You don't seem to understand what defective means. A disc that works as intended is not defective, even if it does not work the way you think it should. A lot of customers seem to think "defective" and "does not meet expectations" mean the same thing. When I'm buying something that I know I can' return (like a game), I do sufficient research ahead of time to decided whether to buy it.

when you buy a DVD you (rightfully) expect it to work in EVERY DVD player. you do not expect that copy protection would cause it to not work in some of them.

if it does not work in some players then yes it is defective. they should have written the copy protection better.

 

[imported_Imp]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: brxndxn

Originally posted by: Aimster
uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

I bought X3 Reunion last year.. DOH HUGE MISTAKE

I only have an external DVDR drive and no internal optical drives since I like it to be right up on my desk and my computer is on the floor. Well, X3 would not work with my external drive no matter what.. so I had to go back in my closet and stick an old optical drive in my computer and reach down for each of the 6 discs that came with the game and stick them in the drive.

I believe I should've been able to return the defective X3 Reunion for a refund. A replacement would merely get me another defective set of discs that have copyright protection up the wazooo.

You don't seem to understand what defective means. A disc that works as intended is not defective, even if it does not work the way you think it should. A lot of customers seem to think "defective" and "does not meet expectations" mean the same thing. When I'm buying something that I know I can' return (like a game), I do sufficient research ahead of time to decided whether to buy it.

when you buy a DVD you (rightfully) expect it to work in EVERY DVD player. you do not expect that copy protection would cause it to not work in some of them.

if it does not work in some players then yes it is defective. they should have written the copy protection better.

Umm.. no you shouldn't. You sound like my parents who know the least about DVDs, and keep complaining about the crappy DVD discs that don't work in the player. By that logic, half of my DVD collection was broken because they didn't work in my POS Lite-On DVD-RW drive. Only thing that prevented me from going back to the store was having the knowledge that it's the drive's fault due to firmware/drivers. Just last week, slipped in a new LG, and presto, all my discs work. So, I guess because they don't work in one drive with outdated/flawed firmware that does NOT enable them to recognize the copy protection/format type, the disc must be defective? Don't throw out the 'defective' claim based on ignorance.

 

[slayer202]

this guy needs to learn how to write

 

[jumpr]

Originally posted by: Imp
So, I guess because they don't work in one drive with outdated/flawed firmware that does NOT enable them to recognize the copy protection/format type, the disc must be defective? Don't throw out the 'defective' claim based on ignorance.

The average person has no idea what firmware is. They will put a disc into their player and if it doesn't work they'll return it and say it was defective. Your point is moot because in making it, you assume that everyone who buys DVDs has extensive technical knowledge of the inner workings of optical drives. They don't. DVDs purchased at a retail outlet should work in all DVD players. One that doesn't is one that I'd call defective. There's a manufacturing/design defect that prevents its proper use in the customer's equipment.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Imp

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: brxndxn

Originally posted by: Aimster
uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

I bought X3 Reunion last year.. DOH HUGE MISTAKE

I only have an external DVDR drive and no internal optical drives since I like it to be right up on my desk and my computer is on the floor. Well, X3 would not work with my external drive no matter what.. so I had to go back in my closet and stick an old optical drive in my computer and reach down for each of the 6 discs that came with the game and stick them in the drive.

I believe I should've been able to return the defective X3 Reunion for a refund. A replacement would merely get me another defective set of discs that have copyright protection up the wazooo.

You don't seem to understand what defective means. A disc that works as intended is not defective, even if it does not work the way you think it should. A lot of customers seem to think "defective" and "does not meet expectations" mean the same thing. When I'm buying something that I know I can' return (like a game), I do sufficient research ahead of time to decided whether to buy it.

when you buy a DVD you (rightfully) expect it to work in EVERY DVD player. you do not expect that copy protection would cause it to not work in some of them.

if it does not work in some players then yes it is defective. they should have written the copy protection better.

Umm.. no you shouldn't. You sound like my parents who know the least about DVDs, and keep complaining about the crappy DVD discs that don't work in the player. By that logic, half of my DVD collection was broken because they didn't work in my POS Lite-On DVD-RW drive. Only thing that prevented me from going back to the store was having the knowledge that it's the drive's fault due to firmware/drivers. Just last week, slipped in a new LG, and presto, all my discs work. So, I guess because they don't work in one drive with outdated/flawed firmware that does NOT enable them to recognize the copy protection/format type, the disc must be defective? Don't throw out the 'defective' claim based on ignorance.

luhmm yes. the avarage person has very little knowledge of firmware, DRM etc etc.

they expect that when they buy a CD or DVD it will work in EVERY CD or DVD player. And rightfully so.

the avarage person should not be required to read up and see if a CD/DVD will work whith said player. it should just work.

The manufacture should be able to write DRM/Protection that will work on Any DVD player. if it does not then it is defective. If they can't write one that will work on any DVD player they should keep the DRM off it or not sale it.

 

[chambersc]

Originally posted by: mugs
Why didn't he just take a replacement disc?

Because he didn't want to take the replacement disk or he wanted the money back or it became much more than a Tony Bennet disk when a peon said there are state and federal laws barring refunds.

 

[mjrpes3]

All you people complaining the guy is in the wrong because of Best Buy policy that software/media cannot be returned... shouldn't/doesn't that only apply to working media (although not explicitly stated)? In this case, the guy had a defective disc, meaning there could be no attempt at piracy. Normal return policies should apply in this case. For this reason, I am on the side of the guy.

Except for the fact that, in the course of his dialog with the BB employee, he implied the guy was a fool. Pretty silly thing to do if you're trying to look 'professional' and have everyone reading your story be on your side. But then mebbe the police wouldn't have come.... meaning no big story to write up that everyone will read. What to do? Such a dilemma.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: mjrpes3
All you people complaining the guy is in the wrong because of Best Buy policy that software/media cannot be returned... shouldn't/doesn't that only apply to working media (although not explicitly stated)? In this case, the guy had a defective disc, meaning there could be no attempt at piracy. Normal return policies should apply in this case. For this reason, I am on the side of the guy.

Except for the fact that, in the course of his dialog with the BB employee, he implied the guy was a fool. Pretty silly thing to do if you're trying to look 'professional' and have everyone reading your story be on your side. But then mebbe the police wouldn't have come.... meaning no big story to write up that everyone will read. What to do? Such a dilemma.

As I said before, if they allowed returns of open defective media, there would be nothing stopping a person from opening a product, copying it, causing it to become "defective," and returning it.

Originally posted by: chambersc

Originally posted by: mugs
Why didn't he just take a replacement disc?

Because he didn't want to take the replacement disk or he wanted the money back or it became much more than a Tony Bennet disk when a peon said there are state and federal laws barring refunds.

He said he went in to swap it out, then changed his mind when he got to the front of the line. If it "became much more than a Tony Bennet disk [sic]" when an employee made an inaccurate statement, the guy has issues and probably had an axe to grind when he went in. He got exactly what he wanted - a story to tell on the Internet abou thow evil Best Buy is.

Originally posted by: waggy
luhmm yes. the avarage person has very little knowledge of firmware, DRM etc etc.

they expect that when they buy a CD or DVD it will work in EVERY CD or DVD player. And rightfully so.

the avarage person should not be required to read up and see if a CD/DVD will work whith said player. it should just work.

The manufacture should be able to write DRM/Protection that will work on Any DVD player. if it does not then it is defective. If they can't write one that will work on any DVD player they should keep the DRM off it or not sale it.

I don't know how you guys got on the topic of CDs and DVDs. X3: Reunion is a video game. Every game has certain requirements, you can't expect it to work on just any PC.

 

[mjrpes3]

Originally posted by: mugs

As I said before, if they allowed returns of open defective media, there would be nothing stopping a person from opening a product, copying it, causing it to become "defective," and returning it.

So it's possible to make a CD defective without there being any visible evidence on the CD that would show this? Even if it is so, and easy enough to get away with, a consumer would be entering more 'criminal' territory by trying to return merchandise that they have destroyed. This is territory that applies to all electronic merchandise, not just CDs. A consumer could use a camcorder once, carefully break something on the inside, then return it to the store to get a full refund.

But does this really matter? From the guy's writeup, Best Buy policy is already on his side: "The first question that corporate asked me was if they actually checked the CD to see if it was bad." If Best Buy corporate policy allows for full refunds on returned media that is defective, then the Best Buy store was in the wrong by not giving him a full refund. End of story.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: mjrpes3

Originally posted by: mugs

As I said before, if they allowed returns of open defective media, there would be nothing stopping a person from opening a product, copying it, causing it to become "defective," and returning it.

So it's possible to make a CD defective without there being any visible evidence on the CD that would show this? Even if it is so, and easy enough to get away with, a consumer would be entering more 'criminal' territory by trying to return merchandise that they have destroyed. This is territory that applies to all electronic merchandise, not just CDs. A consumer could use a camcorder once, carefully break something on the inside, then return it to the store to get a full refund.

But does this really matter? From the guy's writeup, Best Buy policy is already on his side: "The first question that corporate asked me was if they actually checked the CD to see if it was bad." If Best Buy corporate policy allows for full refunds on returned media that is defective, then the Best Buy store was in the wrong by not giving him a full refund. End of story.

You wouldn't have to damage it in a way that is undetectable - if it's scratched, how are they going to prove that the scratch wasn't there when you bought it? They can't.

Bet Buy's store return policy (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp...e&contentId=1117177044087&id=cat12098) says:

Opened computer software, movies, music and video games can be exchanged for the identical item but cannot be returned for a refund.

It makes no exception for defective merchandise.

 

[mjrpes3]

Originally posted by: mugs

You wouldn't have to damage it in a way that is undetectable - if it's scratched, how are they going to prove that the scratch wasn't there when you bought it? They can't.

Likewise, if the camcorder is broken, how are they going to prove that it wasn't broken before you bought it? They can't. So the store is in the same boat, whether or not the product is a CD or camcorder.

As far as the quoted Best Buy policy, take what I am about say with a grain of salt... because I don't work in retail and am not familiar with Best Buy policy. But, although the policy doesn't make an exception for defective merchandise, neither does it explicitly state defective merchandise are included. Someone could come along and argue that they 'assumed' defective media were excluded from the policy. Every wonder why laws are so verbose and full of 'thus and thus and thus'? It's so the law covers all the bases and can't be interpreted as ambiguous. Here I could see someone coming along and interpreting it as such.

But that brings up the point, if Best Buy policy really does mean you can't get a refund on defective media, what gives with this guy calling up 'corporate' and them seeming to be saying that a refund is OK? Is he making the call up? Is his corporate contact clueless? Does Best Buy have an unwritten policy where they won't do full refunds unless you get really antsy, complain a lot, and attrition sets in?

 

[QED]

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: Imp

Originally posted by: waggy

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: brxndxn

Originally posted by: Aimster
uhm ... the customer in this case is wrong

calling someone a moron for no reason is uncalled for.
The "moron" was going to give the guy another CD so wtf is the point of insulting him?

the customer just wanted to feel good about his life because he couldnt afford to buy 99% of the things in that store so he wanted to stick it to the poor kid working at the returns counter.

I bought X3 Reunion last year.. DOH HUGE MISTAKE

I only have an external DVDR drive and no internal optical drives since I like it to be right up on my desk and my computer is on the floor. Well, X3 would not work with my external drive no matter what.. so I had to go back in my closet and stick an old optical drive in my computer and reach down for each of the 6 discs that came with the game and stick them in the drive.

I believe I should've been able to return the defective X3 Reunion for a refund. A replacement would merely get me another defective set of discs that have copyright protection up the wazooo.

You don't seem to understand what defective means. A disc that works as intended is not defective, even if it does not work the way you think it should. A lot of customers seem to think "defective" and "does not meet expectations" mean the same thing. When I'm buying something that I know I can' return (like a game), I do sufficient research ahead of time to decided whether to buy it.

when you buy a DVD you (rightfully) expect it to work in EVERY DVD player. you do not expect that copy protection would cause it to not work in some of them.

if it does not work in some players then yes it is defective. they should have written the copy protection better.

Umm.. no you shouldn't. You sound like my parents who know the least about DVDs, and keep complaining about the crappy DVD discs that don't work in the player. By that logic, half of my DVD collection was broken because they didn't work in my POS Lite-On DVD-RW drive. Only thing that prevented me from going back to the store was having the knowledge that it's the drive's fault due to firmware/drivers. Just last week, slipped in a new LG, and presto, all my discs work. So, I guess because they don't work in one drive with outdated/flawed firmware that does NOT enable them to recognize the copy protection/format type, the disc must be defective? Don't throw out the 'defective' claim based on ignorance.

luhmm yes. the avarage person has very little knowledge of firmware, DRM etc etc.

they expect that when they buy a CD or DVD it will work in EVERY CD or DVD player. And rightfully so.

the avarage person should not be required to read up and see if a CD/DVD will work whith said player. it should just work.

The manufacture should be able to write DRM/Protection that will work on Any DVD player. if it does not then it is defective. If they can't write one that will work on any DVD player they should keep the DRM off it or not sale it.

Waggy... more often than not, when a DVD doesn't play in a particular player its usually because the DVD player is not following specifications-- and not a faulty DVD.

It would be impossible for a DVD manufacturer to put a disc out that will play flawlessly in every single piece of crap DVD player out there...

 

[imported_Imp]

Originally posted by: jumpr

Originally posted by: Imp
So, I guess because they don't work in one drive with outdated/flawed firmware that does NOT enable them to recognize the copy protection/format type, the disc must be defective? Don't throw out the 'defective' claim based on ignorance.

The average person has no idea what firmware is. They will put a disc into their player and if it doesn't work they'll return it and say it was defective. Your point is moot because in making it, you assume that everyone who buys DVDs has extensive technical knowledge of the inner workings of optical drives. They don't. DVDs purchased at a retail outlet should work in all DVD players. One that doesn't is one that I'd call defective. There's a manufacturing/design defect that prevents its proper use in the customer's equipment.

You're right, they don't need extensive knowledge nor did I ever say you needed it. And yes they definately should work in all drives. Conversely, "DVD players puchased at a retail outlet should work with all DVDs. One that doesn't is one that I'd call defective. There's a manufacturing/design defect that prevents its proper use with the customer's disc". Meanwhile, the DVD does work in a majority of all other drives. The point was that you can't always blame one thing. Think about the quality of the player in many people's homes (*cough* cheap/region free). If a consumer has a $2 or ancient player, they shouldn't expect results. If you looked at console games, you should be able to play PS1 games on a PS2, but if a PS1 game didn't work, I guess it is defective? Most people wouldn't know that there's limited support either, so instead of blaming the console which clearly claims support, it must be the disc. Also, just because they don't know or have extensive knowledge on the inner workings of a piece of equipment, it doesn't make it right to say a working product is defective. Otherwise, I didn't know putting putting bleach into people's drinks was fatal, so it's not my fault 50 people just died.

 

[imported_griffis]

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: griffis
This guy was totally in the right. I went to Best Buy to return an unopened camcorder that was bought a week before XMAS. They wanted to charge me a 15% restocking fee but I was not having it. So i go to another location and they let me return for the full amount but will not give me the cash but instead $250 in cash the rest in a freaking gift card. WTF?! I don't want a gift card, hell I don't want the camera just give me the money. Instead, I had them do the refund on the person who bought the camera. Im sorry, I used to work for BB and I quit because their policies were almost criminal.

I take it the person paid with a credit card?

Suppose the camera cost $500, and they paid with a credit card. Figuring 2% fees, that cost them $10. Then you bring it back and get $500 cash back. They're out $10, and they didn't even sell anything. Giving you a gift card forces you to spend the money there, so they're not losing anything on the fees.

And you should not have been charged a 15% restocking fee for the camera, the restocking fee only applies to opened merchandise. They weren't following BB's policies.

They paid with debit not credit but I do see where you are going with that. unfortunately, I as a consumer do not set those fees and that is therefore the cost of doing business. Trust me $10 will not put them out of business

 

[imported_griffis]

Originally posted by: Golgatha

Originally posted by: griffis
This guy was totally in the right. I went to Best Buy to return an unopened camcorder that was bought a week before XMAS. They wanted to charge me a 15% restocking fee but I was not having it. So i go to another location and they let me return for the full amount but will not give me the cash but instead $250 in cash the rest in a freaking gift card. WTF?! I don't want a gift card, hell I don't want the camera just give me the money. Instead, I had them do the refund on the person who bought the camera. Im sorry, I used to work for BB and I quit because their policies were almost criminal.

Their policy is 15% on opened camcorders only. I'd have requested a manager on that one. They're supposed to put a big blue 15% restocking fee sticker on every new box, which you'd have to cut to get at the goods. I've seen a few boxes at my local Best Buy that didn't have any stickers on them, which is why they might have tried to charge you 15%. I say if they forget the sticker, then how would they know you opened it?

I did request a manager, and she was IT!! Haha, but oh well, we ended up getting all the money back on the original debit card, just a pain for the person who bought it for us. There was no seal on the box as stated so not my problem.