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Benefit of AM2

R

royalk4

Member
My buddy has an old Dell 8200 p4 and is looking for a new build. I told him I would help him set up a new rig. HE DOES NOT WANT TO OC, but I'm working on him doing it anyways. We are thinking that we will wait until august when we have more time to devote to the rig. Before we do though I wanted to ask a couple of questions that I've had since I've been out of the computer scene for about 7 months.

1. I know Conroe is coming out, and that AMD and Intel price drops are going to be significant (fingers crossed), Would it be better to go with the Conroe for Gaming or get an X2?
2. What are the benefits of AM2? I've been looking into this and the only major difference I've noticed is that you can use DDR2 RAM with higher latencies and obviously higher speeds.
3. When are the DX10 cards expected to come out. He's heard about them and wants to wait for them to come out before he does a 2K new build.
4. Monitors: I've seen the LCD monitor thread on AT but I wasn't sure how old/outdated it was. He watches a lot of movies and plays games like CS, HL2, BF2 (the last 2 on my comp not on his current set up) He doesn't like my Dell 1703 because it has ghosting. So I was thinking about the Viewsonic 2ms 19'' Monitor on newegg. it's like 240 right now.

Otherwise the build I was planning for him looks like:

AMD X2 3800+
ASUS/MSI (No DFI Mobo since I can't find an AM2 version)
Antec Neo 500W PS with modular cables and SLI
250 WD 16mb HD
19'' ViewSonic 2ms LCD
Evga 7900GT or the x1900x_ _ (xt or xtx)
GSkill 2x1GB DDR2 800 RAM, maybe a lower speed if there is not a significant difference
probably no sound cards since he has weak speakers
Mouse and keyboard will be his preference
 
1. since you are waiting til August anyways, check the price for an AM2 X2 setup and a Core2 Duo setup and see what gives you the best bang for your buck.

2. The benefit of AM2 is that it is future socket for AMD processors. Buying a 754 or 939 board will basically limit you to what is currently out now. With AM2, you will have a CPU upgrade path for a while (I believe the new architecture K8L will be using AM2 as well). But there is no real benefit to upgrade from a 949 X2 3800+ to an AM2 X2 3800+ for example.

3. ?

4. Most LCD's with 8ms or less refresh should be fine. I have a Samsung 730B (8ms) and I experience 0 ghosting.
 
Thnaks Morkman. Also has this site been getting less hits recently? I've noticed that a lot of gen hardware questions have been staying on pg 1 for multiple hours at a time, which it didn't used to do?
 
2. AM2 mostly just moves to DDR2. The heatsink mounting mechanism is a bit different. It's more "future proof", as they say.

3. When Vista launches.
 
Originally posted by: royalk4
My buddy has an old Dell 8200 p4 and is looking for a new build. I told him I would help him set up a new rig. HE DOES NOT WANT TO OC, but I'm working on him doing it anyways. We are thinking that we will wait until august when we have more time to devote to the rig. Before we do though I wanted to ask a couple of questions that I've had since I've been out of the computer scene for about 7 months.

1. I know Conroe is coming out, and that AMD and Intel price drops are going to be significant (fingers crossed), Would it be better to go with the Conroe for Gaming or get an X2?
2. What are the benefits of AM2? I've been looking into this and the only major difference I've noticed is that you can use DDR2 RAM with higher latencies and obviously higher speeds.
3. When are the DX10 cards expected to come out. He's heard about them and wants to wait for them to come out before he does a 2K new build.
4. Monitors: I've seen the LCD monitor thread on AT but I wasn't sure how old/outdated it was. He watches a lot of movies and plays games like CS, HL2, BF2 (the last 2 on my comp not on his current set up) He doesn't like my Dell 1703 because it has ghosting. So I was thinking about the Viewsonic 2ms 19'' Monitor on newegg. it's like 240 right now.

Otherwise the build I was planning for him looks like:

AMD X2 3800+
ASUS/MSI (No DFI Mobo since I can't find an AM2 version)
Antec Neo 500W PS with modular cables and SLI
250 WD 16mb HD
19'' ViewSonic 2ms LCD
Evga 7900GT or the x1900x_ _ (xt or xtx)
GSkill 2x1GB DDR2 800 RAM, maybe a lower speed if there is not a significant difference
probably no sound cards since he has weak speakers
Mouse and keyboard will be his preference
Click to expand...

1. The prices for the end of July / Core2 launch are in for both AMD and Intel so if you search you'll be able to see exactly what each chip will be going for.

2. AM2 is AMD's socket going forward, and will actually be compatible with AM3 CPUs. 939 is done and will actually have a shorter life span then 754.

3. As far as I know no real dates have been set on DX10 cards, but it is not at all tied to MS Vista.

4. The best LCD's still pale in comparison to the best CRTs for gaming performance.

As for your proposed build everything looks pretty solid, here are my suggestions.

Motherboard: ASUS M2N-SLI Deluxe
PSU: Seasonic S12, Enhance, or Forton-Source 350-450 watt range.
GPU: ATi 1900XT
RAM: Crucial, Corsair, or Muskin.
Case: Lian Li
 
don't convince him to o/c if he doesn't want to. regardless of why, if there is any type of failure he will assume it is your fault.

i run a samsung 730b also and have 0 ghosting, very nice lcd

don't get a xtx, i have read that with the 1900xt you are almost 100% guaranteed to be able to hit xtx speeds, not worth the $$$ if you go that route. also the 7900gt is compared to the 1800xt, the 7900gtx is compared to x1900xt

am2 vs 939 = imho just a form factor change. i know 939 is eol but you can still push the 939s pretty high, enough to be comparable with the am2s, and the memory bandwidth isn't really an issue with the a64 anyway.

dx10 cards are some time out and games won't be taking advantage for some time (besides the 1 or 2 at the beginning)

as far as hits to the site, i don't know, but i do know there have been many x's more "help me build" requests, not the same ones at the top but new people with like 5 posts posting the same question. i am not dissing you as you obviously did some research and have a plan and know what you are talking about.

you may look at the seagate 7200.10 hdds as they seem to bench a little better than other current 7.2k hdds, but more importanly they have a 5 yr warranty
 
Originally posted by: Operandi
3. As far as I know no real dates have been set on DX10 cards, but it is not at all tied to MS Vista.
Click to expand...

Well DirectX 10 will be launching with Vista, and will only be compatible with Vista... so yes, the two are tied together pretty closely.
 
Originally posted by: Aluvus
Originally posted by: Operandi
3. As far as I know no real dates have been set on DX10 cards, but it is not at all tied to MS Vista.
Click to expand...

Well DirectX 10 will be launching with Vista, and will only be compatible with Vista... so yes, the two are tied together pretty closely.
Click to expand...

DX 10 is backward compatible with DX 9 cards, and there will hardly be any games that will require DX 10 or take advantage of DX 10 features by it's launch. So there is no saying that ATI and nVidia will have there next gen chips out by DX 10 launch.
 
By the way.. the best advantage to AM2 IMO, is that AM3 CPUs will work on it. So if you get AM2 now you have a good upgrade path towards the K8L
 
August 1 2006,
1) There will be DOZENS of reviews online comparing Core 2 Duo/Athlon64 X2 performance - not by 'shady' enthusiasts/reviewers on XS (like most AMD-fanatics like to think) but real websites, who do this for a living.
2) The whole 'Conroe will have limited availability/price gouging will be through the roof' arguments will be settled - the true picture will become clear, whatever that turns out to be.
3) The price drops on the Athlon64s/Intel 8xx/9xx CPUs will have been in effect for a week or so.
4) People here will be better informed to help direct queries regarding 'the best bang-for-the-buck'.
5) If your friend doesn't want to OC, don't force him to. He will get paranoid whenever he has a random bug on his computer (it could even be a software bug)...but it won't stop him from making frantic phone calls to you. I speak from experience.

You are absolutely right (and sane) to want to wait till August.

I can't help you about the monitors because me (and all my friends) are stuck with CRTs. I've only seen LCDs at work and stuff...and I never tried to install FEAR on a work computer:wink;

The DirectX 10 cards: some people on this forum are certain nVidia will launch G80 in September (thanks to an Inquirer 'article').
The problem is, ATi will launch a refresh of the X1900XT sometime August (or so goes the general feeling). Since nVidia has the 7950GX2 to give ATi nightmares at the high-end, I doubt they need G80 out there in September - it would hurt sales of their current cards, which are doing perfectly fine for now. G80 would cause them to drop prices on G71...which is totally unnecessary considering the sales they are registering now. ATi has been dropping prices significantly on the X1900/X1800 cards while pricing on nVidia's 7900GTX hasn't taken much of a hit. THIS IS MY HUMBLE OPINION: G71 is doing GREAT...G80 isn't necessary now at all.

I would be really, really, really surprised to see any next-generation cards out before December 2006. Even then, the competition will still be about DX9 performance: there will be no real way to tell what card will be the better performer in DX10. While logic does state that the better DX9 card will have better DX10 performance...well, I won't bet money on it.
 
Originally posted by: Tsuwamono
By the way.. the best advantage to AM2 IMO, is that AM3 CPUs will work on it. So if you get AM2 now you have a good upgrade path towards the K8L
Click to expand...

that is unless am3 is using ddr3 or something else.....unless you have specifics i haven't seen i wouldn't buy a platform because another family in the future may be able ot use it
 
ya but man, you can buy the mobo and am2 cpu.. then when am3 cpus come out buy that.. AM3 has both DDR2 and DDR3 controllers so it will work on AM2 mobo or a "AM3" mobo which is just a AM2 with a DDR3 slot
 
Originally posted by: Tsuwamono
ya but man, you can buy the mobo and am2 cpu.. then when am3 cpus come out buy that.. AM3 has both DDR2 and DDR3 controllers so it will work on AM2 mobo or a "AM3" mobo which is just a AM2 with a DDR3 slot
Click to expand...

do you have actual specs on this? also thing change, just like all the people who bought the intel 975 boards early because they were suppose to support conroe, only to find out after the compudex show that they didn't...

it is just a personal preference for me as i don't need any more cpu power, so i am more than likely going to sit the whole am2/conroe thing out unless i start doing a lot of video editing again, but i have enough oomph now and my pick up a 3800x2 when they drop in $$$ 🙂
 
Originally posted by: bob4432
as far as hits to the site, i don't know, but i do know there have been many x's more "help me build" requests, not the same ones at the top but new people with like 5 posts posting the same question. i am not dissing you as you obviously did some research and have a plan and know what you are talking about.

you may look at the seagate 7200.10 hdds as they seem to bench a little better than other current 7.2k hdds, but more importanly they have a 5 yr warranty
Click to expand...

I agree about the Help me build threads. On another forums 90% of the topics are the same thread and they do no research before hand. I normally try to research what I am talking about has when I made my build, I was stupid (hence s754) and wish I woulda researched more before hand. But I will mention the above HDD's and also all the other comments posted by the peeps of AT.


Thanks for the info all.
 
Morkman:

Maybe more people have done what I did. I stopped participating in AnandTech forums because it was just too infuriating to deal with that portion of the teenage population that are focused only on themselves, are rude beyond belief, and though inexperienced, know the answer to everything. While I like AnandTech in general terms, I think they do not police their forums anywhere near enough. I even saw one of the teeny boppper outrages, where the recipient of their humor must have been just outraged, and a moderator joined in to tell them how cool they were. Too many bad scenes and the good ones seemed too far apart.

BobM
 
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