Belgium - First country to ban burqa?

[shira]

The Europeans refuse to understand that they have a choice: Jesus or Allah.

Well, us Jews have the rational belief that Jesus was a phony and "Allah" is a huge misnomer. Perhaps that's the happy medium.

 

[irishScott]

Belgium makes good chocolate. I like chocolate.

Mmmmmm chocolate pie.

 

[evident]

Belgium makes good beer. I like beer.

Mmmmmm beer pie.

fixed

 

[Jaskalas]

Countries that have allowed supposed tolerance and diversity to trump rational thought and common sense are starting to see the problems that having a big portion of the population adhere to beliefs that simply do not gel with a free society bring. They're starting to react (France, Switzerland, Netherlands, Belgium etc). It's about time.

Too little too late.

 

[hal2kilo]

Not quite sure where you are going with this, but the reason it is illegal in many states for anyone ""to wear clothing that covers all or most of the face in any public place"" is because of the KKKluckers.




--

This. You win a cupie doll.

 

[shira]

Even if burqa-wearing were found to be a barrier to integration into American society and caused strained relations between Muslims and non-Muslims, what in practice could be done about it? You'd basically need to gut the U.S. Constitution to prevent women from hiding their faces. Even creating school dress codes that barred burqas would have a "disparate impact" on just one group.

I don't think you can get there from here.

 

[Albatross]

There is also the huge difference in the quality of muslim immigration:in the US you get the best and brightest,in fact the iranian and the arabs are ,on the whole ,better educated than most americans while in Europe there are, mostly,poor trash.
Most muslim in the US woudn`t want to live near recent arrived European muslims.

 

[Kadarin]

I detest the burqa because I detest the culture that it stands for. It is a culture that is hostile to pretty much everything that the United States was founded on, it does nothing to improve the human condition, and the world would be a better place without it.

 

[ShawnD1]

Even if burqa-wearing were found to be a barrier to integration into American society and caused strained relations between Muslims and non-Muslims, what in practice could be done about it? You'd basically need to gut the U.S. Constitution to prevent women from hiding their faces.

Or you could enforce the laws already on the books. We went over this on the first page. Covering your face is illegal in many places. In my last post I linked to stories in West Virginia and Florida. By random googling, it looks like it's also illegal in North Carolina.

If you think religion can get special exemptions from safety laws, think again. Wearing a Sikh kirpan is not allowed in many places. You can't take them to school, you can't take them onto a plane, you can't take them in court. It doesn't matter that your little knife is a religious knife. It's still a knife.


If for some reason I'm on the run from police, I'll wear a full length burqa. I could fly a kite, go for a walk in the park, go to the movies, and the po po would never catch me 😀

 

[PJABBER]

If for some reason I'm on the run from police, I'll wear a full length burqa. I could fly a kite, go for a walk in the park, go to the movies, and the po po would never catch me 😀

That is only until the po po install full body scanners with DNA identifiers in more public places.

If not Total Recall, then certainly it will be a Brave New World after all.

:awe:

 

[theflyingpig]

I don't agree with the banning of the burqa. It is a symbol of religious stupidity, and thus lets me know at a glance which women are too stupid to talk to. It's quite convenient. Everyone knows this.

 

[CanOWorms]

Okay, all I have to say to this thread is WTF at many of the posters.

Look, I have no problem as an American to what any European country wants to do as long as it doesn't involve killing people. It's their country and if the people there want to ban an article of clothing, prevent immigration from certain areas of the world, or force everyone to wear a purple shirt on Tuesdays then more power to them I suppose.

The problem is that their decision affects us in the United States. These countries are not isolated. Their decision may lead to the deaths of thousands of Americans.

As for Belgium and aniti-Americanism... WTF??? The person that made that statement, have you ever been there? Holy crap, I have and a few good friends of mine took a nice European trip to there, Denmark, and Prague. During my visit and people I know, they are all very polite, nice, and never once did I see or hear about any anti-Americanism. Now, if you are talking about the French, that is something completely different. But the Belgium people still love us. Unlike the French, they remember that we saved their bacon in WW2 and don't resent us for that.

Your personal experiences may not reflect the reality. Also, governments don't necessarily follow views of the people. They may love you personally, but they may hate your government and support its destruction.

As for European countries, if they want to ban them, so be it.

Yes, they can ban it. But then they will suffer the consequences.

 

[shadow9d9]

Christians vs Muslims. How fun! Both are a bunch of backwards fools.

Would be cool if they banned crosses too, right? This is totally not one religion against another religion. Nah.

Just more fear and anger.

 

[ShawnD1]

Yes, they can ban it. But then they will suffer the consequences.

I don't know. Iranian women are often a lot cuter than we give them credit for.

Now here are some without photoshop magic

Rawr. Those are some women I'd love to abuse and treat as second class citizens 😉

 

[Joepublic2]

Should a freedom-loving society allow a freedom-hating society use that freedom to take over and in the end destroy the freedom-loving society from within? Is it the freedom-loving society's duty to ensure freedom *now* at any cost, or is it to ensure the longest lasting balance of freedom for the most people?

From what I understand as an American there are large communities of Muslim immigrants immigrating into these primarily Christian nations that aren't integrating due to a number of reasons (no common language, no shared religion, racism and nationalism on both sides, lack of job opportunities that would help people interact on a daily basis in a personal manner etc.) I am also aware that there were large, segregated racial/cultural groups inside the US less than 50 years ago and that's it's only recently gotten better regarding rates of assimilation. One of the main things that aids integration in my opinion is common religious ideals and legal protection against racism w/r/t hiring; I believe one of the reason ex-Mexican nationals integrate so rapidly into US culture (within one generation a lot of the time which is faster than my Irish ancestors integrated into the primarily British/German communities they hail from) is because they're predominately Catholic and they work and live alongside whites that are doing the same jobs, for example.

So, I can understand why your average Belgian Christian would be worried about a large immigrating population of Muslims. They (the Muslims) have a cultural identity and concept of governance that is tightly interwoven with their religious identity, where as your average Belgian's vision of ideal governance is more secular and less tied to any popular (Christian) religious ideals.

With that being my analysis of the situation, I'll turn a historical eye to the situation. History has shown, over and over again, that a culture that tightly integrates its religious ideals with it's ideals regarding culture and general governance will out compete less unified/more diverse/liberal/permissive cultures. Anyone who wants to argue this point with me could begin by pointing out why there's only a handful of religious trains of thought in the world these days with regards to practicing followers and why the number of spoken languages falls rapidly every year.

http://www.adherents.com/Religions_By_Adherents.html

Top four are dominating the charts. The rest are more of an afterthought on a #s basis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_number_of_native_speakers

Compare the number of languages that are spoken by 100 mil or more to everything else, and with a little bit of thought you'll realize that many of those languages are effectively dead (the below 1000 bracket that is probably made up exclusively of very old speakers) or dying (IMO everything not in the 100 mil or more bracket).

So ultimately yes, European countries should be worried about having their cultural identity superseded by the Muslim immigrants that they are allowing into their counties, but banning burqas is dancing around (and limiting their options due to antagonism) the more important issue of: what they're going to/can do to increase integration of different demographics into their societies and if they are able to maintain their cultural identity with their current rates of immigration.

Lots of words but most of my friends are in church or working tonight so I'm bored. 😀

 

[Noobtastic]

It is true Muslims in America are far more assimilated than Muslims in Europe.

I think this is consistent with history. For those who don't remember Muslims once conquered and owned much of Europe. Reading through the philosophies of Osama Bin Laden - who some say is the modern Saladin - it is clear many Muslim leaders are calling for the re-capture of Europe.

Islam has no history in America, and thus there is less of a campaign to "take it back." I think this explains the major contrast between our Muslim population and Europe's.

I also think Europe is an historically racist and xenophobic continent, and its treatment towards Muslims is consistent with its policies towards Jews and other ethnic minorities.

Though it must be known that there is a special breed of Islam infecting Europe. In Norway for example, there are over 100,000 Muslims, opposed to 1,000 Jews.

The Muslims and the Leftists collaborate, and now anitsemitism has become legitimized and condoned by the government and elected officials because the muslim vote demands antisemitism.

According to this article, Norway is the most antisemitism state in Europe, followed by Sweden. This sudden surge in antisemitism and bigotry correlates with the surge in Arab and North african immigration, who import their rabid hatred of Jews and Israel into the country.

http://www.jpost.com/JewishWorld/JewishNews/Article.aspx?ID=172283

I think Europe's reaction to Islamic "sensibilities" is one half legitimate and one half hateful.

Islam poses a serious threat to Europe's status as a Western continent, but the way governments are responding will simply exacerbate the problem.

I can tell you 100% that the Muslim population in Europe is far more segregated and ostracized than the Muslim population in the USA or Israel.

It's only a matter of time before something bad happens...

 

[obamanation]

I don't know. Iranian women are often a lot cuter than we give them credit for.

do everyone a favor and tell us who that is!!!!!

 

[ShawnD1]

do everyone a favor and tell us who that is!!!!!

I went to google and searched for "persian women" and that was one of the results. I don't know who it is.

 

[theflyingpig]

I'd like to slaughter her innocence.

 

[Zorkorist]

I don't agree with the banning of the burqa. It is a symbol of religious stupidity, and thus lets me know at a glance which women are too stupid to talk to. It's quite convenient. Everyone knows this.

I get angry at old ladies driving cars, until I realize that one of them could be my grand-mother; Is, someone's Grand-Mother.

These women in Burqas aren't to be scorned or pitied. They are simply women, doing the best they can.

-John

 

[theflyingpig]

I get angry at old ladies driving cars, until I realize that one of them could be my grand-mother; Is, someone's Grand-Mother.

These women in Burqas aren't to be scorned or pitied. They are simply women, doing the best they can.

-John

Nothing can stop a woman from getting old. Adhering to the ridiculous teachings of a foolish religion is a sure sign of stupidity. Everyone knows this.

 

[ShawnD1]

These women in Burqas aren't to be scorned or pitied. They are simply women, doing the best they can.

The best they can with the restrictions they are forced to have. If you see a woman in a burqa, there's a very good chance her husband is an abusive piece of shit.

Hardcore Islamic culture has a lot of other whacked out problems. In Saudi Arabia, women are not allowed to drive. The average 16 year old American girl is treated with more respect than any woman in Saudi Arabia. Isn't that weird? Islam hates women more than I hate 16 year olds. That's unbelievable.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Not a surprise that Belgium is doing this...it's one of the worst and most intolerant countries in the entire world. I've never met a Belgian who wasn't a tremendous racist.

 

[Zorkorist]

The best they can with the restrictions they are forced to have. If you see a woman in a burqa, there's a very good chance her husband is an abusive piece of shit.

Hardcore Islamic culture has a lot of other whacked out problems. In Saudi Arabia, women are not allowed to drive. The average 16 year old American girl is treated with more respect than any woman in Saudi Arabia. Isn't that weird? Islam hates women more than I hate 16 year olds. That's unbelievable.

There's a great Documentary on a Woman Taxi Driver in a North-African State. I forget it's name (sorry), but you may be able to google it.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

http://dla.library.upenn.edu/dla/vcat/record.html?id=VCAT_3120811

-John