Being a hiring manager is interesting

[purbeast0]

Yep. They want to keep all the negotiating power.

You can still do that with a salary range. Even if the range is broad as hell, put $60k - $200k. I would rather not waste my time or a companies time about a job posting that looks enticing if they are only going to max offer something that is like $40k less than I will take. I fail to see how anything positive comes from it. If anything I'd say a negative would come from that, because there is a chance I would spread the word that they pay crap salaries and wasted my time, especially with things like Glassdoor now a days where you can post on companies pages how interviews there went.

 

[deadlyapp]

You can still do that with a salary range. Even if the range is broad as hell, put $60k - $200k. I would rather not waste my time or a companies time about a job posting that looks enticing if they are only going to max offer something that is like $40k less than I will take. I fail to see how anything positive comes from it. If anything I'd say a negative would come from that, because there is a chance I would spread the word that they pay crap salaries and wasted my time, especially with things like Glassdoor now a days where you can post on companies pages how interviews there went.

Had a scheduled interview with a company that up-front told me the pay scale, way below what I was looking for and what the market was providing. I informed them of this and they tried to get the pay bumped, but couldn't and I ended up not interviewing. So much less time wasted on mine and their side. Wish more companies were like this.

 

[Darwin333]

Have you ever been unemployed? They make you fill out a form that mentions interview activities/attempts to get a new job. In theory they could contact the person mentioned to see if this actually happened.

Not for more than a day or so and I've never even considered filing for unemployment, hell I don't even know how or where. Has your wife ever gotten a call to confirm someone showed up? If they were one of the idiot complete timewasters I think I'd lie.

 

[fenrir]

The unemployment rate is "3.8%" but it's pretty fake and the "shortage" only really applies to crap min wage retail jobs. I know I've done phone interviews with companies who weren't serious about filling a position. I'd be willing to bet at the average Fortune 500 company a large portion of the job postings are 100% fake.

Really? You need to step out into the real world. There are tons of jobs that are out there available for someone that can show up everyday. I live in west central Wisconsin and there are tons of manufacturing jobs that start from $13 - $17 per hour that companies can not find warm bodies for. That is far from minimum wage for jobs that are pretty basic and require no schooling.

 

[sourceninja]

Heh I was filling a helpdesk\network admin role 14 months ago. Found a good candidate already doing much of the same. I asked him what his salary range was and he tells me he is currently making 95k with the county. So something at that or a little higher. I am almost asked him if there were any openings with the county.

This happens a lot in my area. I work remotely and get a much higher salary than any local company would ever provide. The recruiters won't stop though so I eventually just tell them my salary requirement and most of them probably think I'm insane as it's 20-40k higher than local companies are paying.

You can still do that with a salary range. Even if the range is broad as hell, put $60k - $200k. I would rather not waste my time or a companies time about a job posting that looks enticing if they are only going to max offer something that is like $40k less than I will take. I fail to see how anything positive comes from it. If anything I'd say a negative would come from that, because there is a chance I would spread the word that they pay crap salaries and wasted my time, especially with things like Glassdoor now a days where you can post on companies pages how interviews there went.

I won't even interview without a real salary range. I've got a great job, why would I look at anything without them selling me on it first?

 

[purbeast0]

This happens a lot in my area. I work remotely and get a much higher salary than any local company would ever provide. The recruiters won't stop though so I eventually just tell them my salary requirement and most of them probably think I'm insane as it's 20-40k higher than local companies are paying.



I won't even interview without a real salary range. I've got a great job, why would I look at anything without them selling me on it first?

I've been looking at trying to land a fully remote position and when there aren't salary ranges and it's a job that looks of interest to me, I will first see if they have a glassdoor listing and see the ranges there. Typically they don't have any on there, then I'll next see where the company HQ is located. I will pretty much only show interest if they are located in NorCal or LA, NYC, Seattle, Boston, or the DMV area. If they are located elsewhere, for the most part, I know that they won't pay high enough for me to realistically take a position.

I've seen some listing for bumfuck Indiana for developers and no chance in hell I'd apply there. Chances are they pay probably around what I made when I graduated.

 

[jpiniero]

I've been looking at trying to land a fully remote position and when there aren't salary ranges and it's a job that looks of interest to me, I will first see if they have a glassdoor listing and see the ranges there. .

Don't bother. Remote work almost has to be dead these days anyway since if you can be fully remote you can be remote in Chennai.

 

[ultimatebob]

I mean, is it really that complicated in how to answer an interviewer?

No matter what it is - any subject - It's FUCKING EXCITING.

No matter what "hardships" you might experience, you LOVE working CHALLENGES!

You're EXCITED to learn and coordinate with coworkers all the time - Even if it means working into the night.

You LOVE the work culture of X and find the Y industry fascinating! You've been studying the company in your free time over the last 5+ years and following along on social media.

Don't these fucking retarded millennial know how to bullshit? What morons.

Wow... just reading those statements made me vomit in my mouth a little. I think that I would tag you a "suckup" and cross you off my my shortlist right away with answers like that

 

[Midwayman]

Same reason companies tell you not to discuss salary with your fellow coworkers... knowledge is power - and they don't want you to have power.

If they won't give you a range as part of the phone screen, etc it means they either know they are below market or going to try and lowball you. It probably works out well if they want to hire people who don't have a lot of options. If you're a high performer its a good sign that the company isn't for you.

 

[purbeast0]

Don't bother. Remote work almost has to be dead these days anyway since if you can be fully remote you can be remote in Chennai.

You clearly have no clue what you are talking about lol.

 

[jpiniero]

You clearly have no clue what you are talking about lol.

If anything, I might know the company you are talking about in Indiana... Think about it, why would a company with offices in Seattle or NYC want a remote worker when you could put a local posting and get hundreds of candidates?

I've heard of letting people stay remote for the most part but need to be in the general area.... so they could come in easily on short notice or for meetings and such.

 

[sourceninja]

If anything, I might know the company you are talking about in Indiana... Think about it, why would a company with offices in Seattle or NYC want a remote worker when you could put a local posting and get hundreds of candidates?

I've heard of letting people stay remote for the most part but need to be in the general area.... so they could come in easily on short notice or for meetings and such.

They do when there are not enough qualified candidates. Like infosec, cloud, etc. I know because I'm doing it and getting recruiters calling all the time.

 

[purbeast0]

If anything, I might know the company you are talking about in Indiana... Think about it, why would a company with offices in Seattle or NYC want a remote worker when you could put a local posting and get hundreds of candidates?

I've heard of letting people stay remote for the most part but need to be in the general area.... so they could come in easily on short notice or for meetings and such.

They do exist and I've applied to them and talked to them multiple times. I'm not sure why this would surprise you so much.

The tough part about landing a remote job with a good company that pays well is they can be picky as shit because they get so many applicants. Why get hundreds of applicants local when you can get thousands of applicants? The ones I've gotten to final rounds of interviews with it basically boiled down to them liking me a lot but there were people who they liked more with better experience in the tech they use.

If you weren't aware, there are job boards dedicated to remote job listings and there are a decent amount of listings for companies in those areas I mentioned. A lot of companies are starting to adopt remote culture because they realize that office time isn't even necessary for many jobs.

Oh, and the Indiana one I'm talking about was just throwing out a random place, there wasn't a specific one I remember seeing. I did see a listing for a job in Iowa, I didn't even read the job description once I saw that.

 

[jpiniero]

A lot of companies are starting to adopt remote culture because they realize that office time isn't even necessary for many jobs.

This is true, but that's what I meant by the India comment - if it was truly 100% remote, they would just get the work done there. Maybe if the company was smallish like the job posting I remember seeing based in Indiana, and y'know they didn't have contacts in India and the budget for relo. Relo by the way appears to be very rare now too.

 

[DaveSimmons]

This is true, but that's what I meant by the India comment - if it was truly 100% remote, they would just get the work done there. Maybe if the company was smallish like the job posting I remember seeing based in Indiana, and y'know they didn't have contacts in India and the budget for relo. Relo by the way appears to be very rare now too.

Not always, unless you're talking phone support or large process-heavy and highly regimented teams.
- A 1-hour time difference is much more convenient than 12 hours.
- Sharing the same culture and first language makes communication easier
- For many kinds of development work, North American CS/CE college graduates in general have a better skill set than Indian tech school graduates in general. Also not always of course.

 

[purbeast0]

This is true, but that's what I meant by the India comment - if it was truly 100% remote, they would just get the work done there. Maybe if the company was smallish like the job posting I remember seeing based in Indiana, and y'know they didn't have contacts in India and the budget for relo. Relo by the way appears to be very rare now too.

With development, there has never been a more true statement than "you get what you pay for".

 

[jpiniero]

With development, there has never been a more true statement than "you get what you pay for".

True but if you were truly looking for quality you would hire local or pony up the cash for relo. You wouldn't bother with remote.

 

[DaveSimmons]

True but if you were truly looking for quality you would hire local or pony up the cash for relo. You wouldn't bother with remote.

There are a lot of good developers that have no interest in relocating, and have reasons for working from home. One of ours lives on a farm and raises horses with his wife.

With email, IM chat, phone and conference calls people don't need to work in the same building to get things done.

When my previous employer here in the Seattle area was bought by a larger company in Silicon Valley they offered me a job there but I had no interest in moving, I like it here. I did some weekend consulting for them for awhile (with the OK from my new employer) until they finally hired someone to replace me.

 

[sourceninja]

Exactly, find someone as qualified as I am who lives in SF and works for my pay? I'm rich where I live, and would never move out of this area for under $200k a year. Instead I live in a area where a 3000sq foot home costs <300k and make in the $150s. I work my ass of for my employer. They interviewed 20 people to find me. Remote wasn't even what they wanted, but my boss told me he was very happy I'm on board.

 

[purbeast0]

True but if you were truly looking for quality you would hire local or pony up the cash for relo. You wouldn't bother with remote.

Ummm that makes absolutely no sense.

I get contacted like once every 2-3 months by Amazon about relocating to Seattle, Boston, or somewhere else (I forget) and I don't care what company it is, I have absolutely no interest in relocating to any of those places.

 

[jpiniero]

I get contacted like once every 2-3 months by Amazon about relocating to Seattle, Boston, or somewhere else (I forget) and I don't care what company it is, I have absolutely no interest in relocating to any of those places.

So they will hire somebody else. It's not that complicated.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I'm a software developer at a small company, and fortunately the people I work with want a decent work-life balance too. We'll answer an email or even fix some little server problem after normal hours if we happen to be online and checking mail, but people don't work late just to show how "dedicated" they are.

I was a software developer at a startup, in my 20s, and the company more-or-less REQUIRED us to stay up for 24hrs doing dev work, before the investors showed up. Crazy stuff.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

I was a software developer at a startup, in my 20s, and the company more-or-less REQUIRED us to stay up for 24hrs doing dev work, before the investors showed up. Crazy stuff.

That's rare, unsustainable, and kinda fucked up.