BD + AM3 boards a go ?

[drizek]

is JFAMD being a clever wordsmith, and we're meant to read between the lines here?

My impression is that JFAMD is a clever wordsmith, but he doesn't want you reading in between the lines.

@soulkeeper, the problem is that the leaks show there isn't much to get excited about in 9xx, and it's not like 8xx is bad or anything. if they can bring improved SATA/USB/Whatever performance though, that would be nice, but as it stands it seems like there will be no new features whatsoever. For the first time, Intel will offer something compelling (SSD Cache) that AMD lacks.

 

[dorion]

For the first time, Intel will offer something compelling (SSD Cache) that AMD lacks.

Who's to say SSD cache isn't a purely software solution? Solaris has a similar idea with the ZFS l2arc, minus the optional write cache. I don't even remember Tom's preview mentioning bios or hardware setup for the SSD cache. Wait, it says:

The system has to be RAID-ready with the Accelerate bit enabled

Sounds like a software lock to me... probably can't throw it on an AMD board but some hacker will give it to other Intel chipsets if Intel doesn't.

 

[dawp]

hum, the according to the link, the 2 M4A89GTD PRO/USB3 I bought last month should work with BD with just a bios update. kinda wish that I had gotten a 3rd one now instead of the x58 sabertooth i did get. now where do I get the beta bios?

edit:

For testing AM3+ CPU Function only, do no update this BIOS while using AM3 or previous type CPUs. For the clever one's:................T E S T I N G AM3++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

nudge, nudge, wink, wink

http://vip.asus.com/forum/view.aspx...M4A89TD+PRO%2fUSB3&page=1&SLanguage=en-us

 

[Idontcare]

Ok, I get that. But that's not quite the same thing as saying "BD does not *work* on AM3 sockets."

So...is JFAMD being a clever wordsmith, and we're meant to read between the lines here? For example, I don't recall AMD specifically supporting the unlocking of cores...yet a lot of us have done it and it works great. Guess we'll wait and see.

That is my take on it too...not supporting it may mean it voids your warranty.

Mobo guys could care less if you are voiding your CPU warranty by using their mobo, that's not their problem.

They have the same attitude about overclocking and your CPU warranty, they make the mobo capable of doing it so they get mobo sales even though you using the feature negates your warranty.

 

[busydude]

Sandorski, just click on the link provided in my previous post. It only shows AM3+ support for revision 3.1.. in their product overview. All previous revisions are not being advertised as AM3+ compatible.

 

[busydude]

You are right Sandorski, I misread your previous post.

 

[Elixer]

Scuttlebutt is that the listed Asus board (and some MSI?) do have all the connections needed for BD...
Seems that AM3 CPUs use 938 of 941 pins, and (first gen?) AM3+ CPUs use 940 of 942 pins.

That means, those mobo makers that have the full 940 connections on AM3 boards will work, and those that don't, won't.

 

[podspi]

Scuttlebutt is that the listed Asus board (and some MSI?) do have all the connections needed for BD...
Seems that AM3 CPUs use 938 of 941 pins, and (first gen?) AM3+ CPUs use 940 of 942 pins.

That means, those mobo makers that have the full 940 connections on AM3 boards will work, and those that don't, won't.

Is there any source for this?
:awe:

(Edit)

Also... why would AMD bother to do this and not introduce physical incompatibility? Doesn't that defeat the entire purpose...?

 

[SickBeast]

I'm thinking AMD is doing this for two reasons:

1. Marketing. The new chipset is probably 5% faster than the existing ones, so AMD wants the Bulldozer to look as good as possible in reviews.

2. To sell more Bulldozer CPUs. People with existing AM3 motherboards will be more likely to simply drop in a new BD CPU as opposed to swapping out their motherboard for a new Intel chip.

 

[nonameo]

I'm thinking AMD is doing this for two reasons:

1. Marketing. The new chipset is probably 5% faster than the existing ones, so AMD wants the Bulldozer to look as good as possible in reviews.

2. To sell more Bulldozer CPUs. People with existing AM3 motherboards will be more likely to simply drop in a new BD CPU as opposed to swapping out their motherboard for a new Intel chip.

5% is a lot of performance from a chipset, especially considering that the memory controller no longer resides in the northbridge.

 

[SickBeast]

5% is a lot of performance from a chipset, especially considering that the memory controller no longer resides in the northbridge.

I agree, however I assume that JFAMD is saying it for a reason. There must be some sort of performance or functionality that the new chipsets are going to provide.

 

[Vesku]

It was said it wouldn't be backward compatible because they decided to focus on performance. I doubt you'll be seeing "unlock 100% of Bulldozer performance" on any of these motherboard's packaging.

 

[Elixer]

This is getting very confusing, it was said that BD will need new AM3+ boards, then we see this:

http://event.asus.com/2011/mb/AM3_PLUS_Ready/

However, there is a extra pin on BD CPUs, so how can this work ?
Perhaps AMD is making a version of BD that will work on AM3 boards after all ?
:sneaky:

*cough*
http://www.presence-pc.com/actualite/Bulldozer-AM3-43003/
(translated)

The manufacturer told us that the processors Bulldozer possession today do not have the extra leg that would prevent them from getting stuck in a socket AM3.
The current chipsets are compatible, Asus has just had a new BIOS code to support the Bulldozer. The owners of motherboards AMD may therefore rejoice: they can update their configuration with processor technology cheaply. . AMD had offered the same gift to its loyal customers during the transition to socket AM2 AM2 + .
However, it is very strange that the manufacturer refuses to connect on this point as it is a key advantage against Intel introduced almost a new socket for each new CPU.

Strange indeed.
Would AMD ship CPUs to their partners with the missing pin, and then release 'actual product' with the pin ?
Would that make any sense to do that ?

 

[darkswordsman17]

5% is a lot of performance from a chipset, especially considering that the memory controller no longer resides in the northbridge.

I agree, however I assume that JFAMD is saying it for a reason. There must be some sort of performance or functionality that the new chipsets are going to provide.

Well, this is something that I think might need to understand that he's probably doing it to cover himself and AMD. They've already openly said its not compatible with AM3 and I don't think he wants to stir up confusion by saying its technically possible, as that'll get spread like wildfire that someone working for AMD said it'll work.

I expect it will be possible, and my guess is, the biggest issue will be the new turbo core stuff, as didn't they have slides showing that it could speed up and offer an extra 5% or so performance, even when fully loaded if the chip isn't having any issues (i.e., if you've got good cooling, under load it'll clock itself higher than even the rated turbo speed on its own).

I could see Bulldozer working but not being able to scale its clocks like it will in the newer chipset, so you might be locked at whatever speed you have it set at. I think this might mean no overclocking on AM3 as it might try to run the turbo core and exceed its limits if you overclock it. Likewise, unless you've got a good board with good power setup, you might not be able to run BD at all (so AMD doesn't want there to be a lot of confusion on what boards do support BD and what ones don't).

One last thing, is the new chipset going to UEFI? I wonder if that might not be another reason, they're wanting every last bit of extra performance they can get (and UEFI cutting down on boot times will help give an impression of better speed).

All just speculation on my part.

 

[GlacierFreeze]

asdf

 

[Wanescotting]

I have an Asus Crosshair IV Formula......color me confused? pincount? BD features? BUT Asus does say it will work......

 

[Aznboy1993]

It seems like AM3 will be compatible with AM3+, but then again who knows until the CPU is officially released.

 

[dennilfloss]

If BD were to work in an 890 mobo, what difference in the chipset might make this impossible in a 790 mobo?

*Dennil wants to keep his current motherboard but is feeling the Bulldozer itch for Skyrim*

 

[Edgy]

Could be the new power saving mode and possibly the new "turbo" function that AMD cooked up for BD will only be enabled with AM3+ socket boards and may not function properly on current AM3 boards.

I remember some existing boards having issues with new power saving tech (I think it was something like turning off unnecessary individual CPU core to save power or some such) put into 3rd gen Opterons due to base design of the boards and such while back...

 

[drizek]

if bd were to work in an 890 mobo, what difference in the chipset might make this impossible in a 790 mobo?

*dennil wants to keep his current motherboard but is feeling the bulldozer itch for skyrim*

ddr 2

 

[lifeblood]

Hmm, decisions, decisions.

I have an AM3 CPU (Athlon II) in a AM2+ motherboard with DDR2. When AM3+ comes out I can step up to it and DDR3 while keeping my CPU (until I can afford Bulldozer). Simple, except...

My CPU is an X3 which is unlocked via ACC to an X4. If I use a new AM3+ chipset, will it support unlocking the fourth core? The work I do actually benefits from the fourth core so I don't want to lose it.

 

[drizek]

No one can say for sure, but I would say that there is a good chance that you will find at least one board with core unlocker tech.

What would be more interesting is one that can unlock a BD-6, or, better yet, a BD-4 with 8MB L3.

 

[toolbag]

No one can say for sure, but I would say that there is a good chance that you will find at least one board with core unlocker tech.

What would be more interesting is one that can unlock a BD-6, or, better yet, a BD-4 with 8MB L3.

I would bet AMD full proofs against unlocking this time around.

 

[dennilfloss]

ddr 2

I'm already using DDR3. Just checked again with CPU-Z.

 

[LoneNinja]

I would bet AMD full proofs against unlocking this time around.

I would bet the 4 core is a native 4 core and not a crippled 8 core, however the 6 core could very well be a crippled 8 core.