barton @ 2.2GHZ vs Venice @ 2.2GHZ

[felony]

Hey guys.

Its the end of summer and im heading back to school and trying to figure out what im doing for my computer for the year.

I am currently running a barton @ 2.2ghz but have been thinking about jumping to a64s which leads to a new mobo, vid card, and basically a new computer.

Are these new purchases worth it? If I went to a64, i would go pciE, and so on and the prices just keep adding up.

I really only play CSS so maybe a ATI card is a good idea and I could get rid of my 6600gt as source players a mini bit better on ATI....

I really dont mind waiting if there are better options. It is just that the jump to A64 requires many things to fall in place.

any suggestions?

 

[kyparrish]

I'd honestly keep what you have.

A 2.2ghz Barton/6600GT is still a decent gaming rig.

 

[Elfear]

Ya, my brother's 2.25Ghz Barton and oced 6800nu cook along pretty nicely. Your 6600GT is in the same ballpark as a 6800nu so I'd say stick with what you have. Unless of course you have money to spend.

 

[chinkgai]

if you want to compare the performance, without considering practicality...then the venice blows the barton away in every sense. heck, my venice even blew away my socket 754 a64 cpu which was running over 100mhz faster! i am a geek who likes to overclock and try new things though, so i dont consider things in a practical sense.

conclusion: if money isnt a huge factor, upgrade...but most likely money WILL be a factor, so i suggest AGAINST upgrading since like u said, one thing leads to another and it gets addicting. too many things going on at the moment to upgrade right now. let things calm a bit first.

 

[phaxmohdem]

Yeah, unless you are going to be doing lots of video editing, 3D rendering, hardcore gaming or the like, I'd just keep what you have for another year or so. Unless you plan to overclock the living sh*t out of your new venice, in which case it would be uber faster than what you have now 🙂... In all seriousness I'd only upgrade if:

- Your current system will be inadequate for what you plan on doing in the next year at school (read above examples)

- You REALLY need to show off and show your school bros whats up.

 

[felony]

thanks for the info and suggestions guys, i appreciate it.

I just kinda wanna get started in the upgrades, but not only is it just not worth it, but there is so much i would need to buy.

one option is to stay with AGP, which either:

1)lets me upgrade gpu to maybe 6800gt or of the sorts, but keep processor. Next summer buy a64 and AGP mobo.

2)wait

How much would I bottleneck a gpu of say 6800gt AGP 8x, with my barton, is it even worth it?

thanks again for the suggestions

dan

 

[RussianSensation]

Originally posted by: kyparrish
I'd honestly keep what you have.

A 2.2ghz Barton/6600GT is still a decent gaming rig.

Plus if anything....you can sell the 6600GT and upgrade to a faster agp videocard like 6800gt. After you can keep it for 1 year and buy everything new when amd shifts to a new socket and DDR2 in Q2 2006 or so. 6800GT would be a good match for your 2.2ghz cpu. Just crank up the settings. Also given 6800GT is $280, I'd say $280 yearly cost for upgrades is acceptable even if you buy a PCIe board in 1 year and get rid of 6800GT altogether.

 

[sbuckler]

754 is a really good deal right now if you want a cheap upgrade and too stay with agp - the A64's are much cheaper for 754 then 939 (3700 is a complete bargain). However if you want upgradability then with an eye on the dual core future obviously a 939 Nforce 4 setup is the way to go. The other option is wait a few months for those new motherboards just previewed on anandtech which have pci-e and full speed AGP.

No point getting a 6800gt with your setup - you'd be able to run with anti-aliasing and anisotropic filtering but your fps wouldn't really improve as that's being limited by your cpu.

 

[DuceGT]

These guys are a little off the ball. In the last two weeks I went from a Barton XP-M 2500 @ 2.4ghz to a venice 3200+. If all you play is CSS your probably running a competitive config like the rest of us so your 6800GT is overkill and is bottle necked. I only had a 6800NU and I still stuck AGP out one more upgrade. I kept everything I had and gotta MSI Neo2 Plat/3200+ Combo for $325. On retail cooling I'm at 2.5ghz with low temps and plenty of room to get up to 2.7. Even if you've never overclocked before, if he sit down and read how it works for the A64, you will be able to do it. My FPS Drops in CSS use to be down in the 30s like looking at all the models at spawm, but now It is very rare to see a dip into the 60s. I have it capped at 100fps and in normal 1v1,2v2 situtations...its a constant 90+. Plus on some areas of contra I get over 400fps 😱 ... I always told myself I'd wait for the right cpu/price and the Venice core is what I was hoping for. The 6800GT is just fine if you play with all eye candy as well. You will hands down love the new feel of games with a venice. Keep us posted.

 

[JBird7986]

Felony:

You may just want to wait until the ULi board Anandtech reviewed yesterday are released. Then you can keep your AGP card and be ready for a future PCIe upgrade.

 

[JDCentral]

Originally posted by: JBird7986
Felony:

You may just want to wait until the ULi board Anandtech reviewed yesterday are released. Then you can keep your AGP card and be ready for a future PCIe upgrade.

^^^^^^^

 

[felony]

i posted a while back about a mobo that could do that, apparently the have done it.

ill definatly look into that.

thanks for thei nfo guys, keep any suggestions rolling!

dan

 

[coomar]

a64's kill cs:s, i used a mobile at 2.2 and 2.6 with a 9600xt, it drops down at times and got choppy, with the venice and an x700le (which is not that much faster than a 9600xt), the fps don't drop noticebly

 

[Fern]

How much would I bottleneck a gpu of say 6800gt AGP 8x, with my barton, is it even worth it?

Don't wory about cpu bottlenecking. That's usually way overstated on these boards.

I once ran, by accident, my mobile at 1.8ghz instead of over 2.2ghz when playing FarCry, D3 etc. I didn't notice any diff really.

The Barton at 2.2 ghz matches up quite nicely with the 6800GT.

The vid scores in 3D Mark 05 weren't even all that far off. The diff I mostly attribute to the cpu test section at the end of the benchie.

Fern

 

[crimson117]

Originally posted by: felony
thanks for the info and suggestions guys, i appreciate it.

I just kinda wanna get started in the upgrades, but not only is it just not worth it, but there is so much i would need to buy.

one option is to stay with AGP, which either:

1)lets me upgrade gpu to maybe 6800gt or of the sorts, but keep processor. Next summer buy a64 and AGP mobo.

2)wait

How much would I bottleneck a gpu of say 6800gt AGP 8x, with my barton, is it even worth it?

thanks again for the suggestions

dan

Depends on the game. If it's World of Warcraft, a barton 2.2ghz is a significant bottleneck when compared to even an Athlon 64 3000+.

"The Athlon XP is clearly behind the times here, but given its age, it is not too surprising to see it at the bottom of the charts. Athlon XP owners will probably want to upgrade to an Athlon 64 or Pentium 4 before seeking out a faster video card in order to maximize their upgrade dollars."

 

[DuceGT]

Originally posted by: Fern

How much would I bottleneck a gpu of say 6800gt AGP 8x, with my barton, is it even worth it?

Don't wory about cpu bottlenecking. That's usually way overstated on these boards.

I once ran, by accident, my mobile at 1.8ghz instead of over 2.2ghz when playing FarCry, D3 etc. I didn't notice any diff really.

The Barton at 2.2 ghz matches up quite nicely with the 6800GT.

The vid scores in 3D Mark 05 weren't even all that far off. The diff I mostly attribute to the cpu test section at the end of the benchie.

Fern

The Farcry and Doom 3 engines are no where near as CPU intense as the source engine and 3DMark05 is obviously a GPU loaded program. I dont know how many times I've said this, but I will again. Your better off playing CSS with a FX-55 paired with a Geforce 4MX then a X850XTPE on a Barton 3200+.

 

[Fern]

Your better off playing CSS with a FX-55 paired with a Geforce 4MX then a X850XTPE on a Barton 3200+.

Never played CSS, from the above it sounds like the graphics must be really really weak.

But I do play HL2 on the rig in my sig, plays great. Now I have 17" monitor so the rez isn't very high (11 x 8, any higher and I'm down a RR of 60hz which I can't tolerate). But at lower rez's you're stressing the CPU more than the gfx card. My mobile running at 3200+ speeds handles HL2 just fine. But that's single player, maybe it's tougher in online gaming?

Fern

 

[Concillian]

Originally posted by: crimson117

Depends on the game. If it's World of Warcraft, a barton 2.2ghz is a significant bottleneck when compared to even an Athlon 64 3000+.

Yeah, It can only maintain 50 FPS. Oh Noes!

I run in a video card limited scenario that puts me around 50FPS average just fine. Yes, the Barton is certainly worse than the other CPUs, but you have to put the absolute values into perspective too. 50FPS average isn't horrible.

I'm not saying that 50 FPS is ideal, just that it's not a situation that calls for some kind of dire need to upgrading the processor. As was said earlier, people seem to blow CPU bottlenecking out of proportion.

That being said, CS:S / HL2 is about the most CPU intensive game around that I know of, so there may be a more valid point if you pointed out CS:S or HL2 benchmarks with a Barton. Just that from the WoW comparison, I don't see the Barton as all that bad. Compared to other CPUs, of course, but I could certainly live with that kind of performance just fine if I was in college and didn't have a lot of spending money.

 

[blckgrffn]

CS:S loves CPU, I think that has been stated here enough. If I were you, get $100 out of your barton/mobo combo on the forums, and pick up a used S754 (any A64, any speed, the higher the better, I just say a 3000+ a while ago for $90, wowza!) and this mobo, or something similar. For minimal investment I bet you pick up 20+ fps, all the time. Plus, it will age pretty well as it is very obvious that A64's are not bandwidth limited.

Nat

 

[intogamer]

have you seen the prices on teh 6800's? (evga 6800GT plus zalman cooler for 250 shipped)
video cards have not used up the bandwidth of agp

AGP is still mighty powerful... while people upgrade the pcie... you can get a lot of bargains 🙂

 

[felony]

well thanks for all your opinions guys...

right now I am looking at two options..

1)selling my rig and upgrading to a64/pcie etc etc and end up spending 600 or so after my rig is sold.

2)pick up a 6800gt agp and run that with my barton 2.2ghz for the time being.. and see how things are. maybe around christmas ask for a nice a64 as the prices come down and buy myself a mobo to match it. (prolly the ULI one that is pci and agp)

one question for option two though. from what I have read, AGP has not been used to its full potential.. so whats hte big fuss about pciE. yeah it has for bandwith, but AGPs bandwith isnt used fully so is there even a point? I would assume that my 6600gt would hold me off for a year or so, so i would expect a 6800gt would last longer at which time a pciE card may be of use...

any ideas?
thanks
dan

 

[Jadow]

I've got a barton 2500 running at 2.2ghz and I thought about upgrading to A64, but I gotta tell ya, I decided to wait another 12 months at least, my AthlonXp is just running great and I don't really need any more speed ATM. BF2 plays fine so what more do I need! 🙁)

 

[Jaxidian]

Originally posted by: felony
well thanks for all your opinions guys...

right now I am looking at two options..

1)selling my rig and upgrading to a64/pcie etc etc and end up spending 600 or so after my rig is sold.

2)pick up a 6800gt agp and run that with my barton 2.2ghz for the time being.. and see how things are. maybe around christmas ask for a nice a64 as the prices come down and buy myself a mobo to match it. (prolly the ULI one that is pci and agp)

one question for option two though. from what I have read, AGP has not been used to its full potential.. so whats hte big fuss about pciE. yeah it has for bandwith, but AGPs bandwith isnt used fully so is there even a point? I would assume that my 6600gt would hold me off for a year or so, so i would expect a 6800gt would last longer at which time a pciE card may be of use...

any ideas?
thanks
dan

You're 6600GT should definitely be plenty fine for at least a year unless you're wanting to play all of the latest and greatest games at 16x12 or higher at full settings in 10 months from now.

However, if I were you I would still sell your Barton/mobo combo (let's say you get $100 out of it, I dunno), buy this mobo and this CPU and you just made a significant upgrade for $60 or so (continue to use everything else in your current box). If you do this, then the next 2 upgrades you will want to do with it is more RAM (1.5GB or 2GB is becoming pretty commonly used by gamers) or a newer video card (though, like I said, your 6600GT is plenty good enough for a while, ESPECIALLY if you play at 12x10).

Just my $0.02 worth (and I expect a paypal inc!)

 

[blckgrffn]

Originally posted by: Jaxidian

Originally posted by: felony
well thanks for all your opinions guys...

right now I am looking at two options..

1)selling my rig and upgrading to a64/pcie etc etc and end up spending 600 or so after my rig is sold.

2)pick up a 6800gt agp and run that with my barton 2.2ghz for the time being.. and see how things are. maybe around christmas ask for a nice a64 as the prices come down and buy myself a mobo to match it. (prolly the ULI one that is pci and agp)

one question for option two though. from what I have read, AGP has not been used to its full potential.. so whats hte big fuss about pciE. yeah it has for bandwith, but AGPs bandwith isnt used fully so is there even a point? I would assume that my 6600gt would hold me off for a year or so, so i would expect a 6800gt would last longer at which time a pciE card may be of use...

any ideas?
thanks
dan

You're 6600GT should definitely be plenty fine for at least a year unless you're wanting to play all of the latest and greatest games at 16x12 or higher at full settings in 10 months from now.

However, if I were you I would still sell your Barton/mobo combo (let's say you get $100 out of it, I dunno), buy this mobo and this CPU and you just made a significant upgrade for $60 or so (continue to use everything else in your current box). If you do this, then the next 2 upgrades you will want to do with it is more RAM (1.5GB or 2GB is becoming pretty commonly used by gamers) or a newer video card (though, like I said, your 6600GT is plenty good enough for a while, ESPECIALLY if you play at 12x10).

Just my $0.02 worth (and I expect a paypal inc!)

I said this earlier, apparently he doesn't like this approach, even though it will be awesome bang for the buck wise... 🙂

Nat

 

[felony]

s754 sounds like a good approach $$ wise, but if I do build new i would rather have something that good take atvantage of x2 dual core in the future.

it looks as though my friend will buy my rig for 450, leaving me with some cash for a new pc. i could spend another 700 or so on the rest of the rig, so a total of 1150 or so.

I figure i could get a nice a64, 6800gt or equivalent, gig of ocz ram, nice hdd and the rest..

any idea of a build for that cost, i would need everything but monitor and mouse and mouse pad 🙂

dan