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Bang for the buck gaming build opinions please

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XshadowfoxX

Junior Member
7-12-2012 Update:

Purchased the following parts prior to promo code expiration:

2 x G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 $93.98 Free shipping

Intel Core i5-3570 Ivy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 77W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 2500 ... $214.99 -$15 Promo code = $199.99 Free shipping

ASRock Z77 Pro3 $94.99 Limited Promo for 1 yr replacement plan free. + $7.33 Shipping

COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus RR-B10-212P-G1 "Heatpipe Direct Contact" Long Life Sleeve 120mm $29.99 -$10 MIR if it comes back

Unfortunately I missed the window on the MSI R7850 for $209 So I will have to keep a lookout for a good GPU deal.

6-27-2012 Update:

Purchased the following parts prior to promo code expiration:

Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 64-bit $79.99
Crucial M4 128GB $109.99
SAMSUNG EcoGreen F4 2TB 3.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Internal Hard Drive $119.99
Corsair CMPSU-650TXV2 $79.99 -$20 MIR if it comes back.

( Prices do not include tax )
------------------------------

1. What YOUR PC will be used for. That means what types of tasks you'll be performing.

-- gaming: Example Guild Wars 2 / Video Editing, (the real use being enough to run GW2 at high settings.)

2. What YOUR budget is. A price range is acceptable as long as it's not more than a 20% spread

-- $900 - $1100 Before any rebates ( I have a huge problem with Rebates - Upwards of 50% of the time they don't come back. )

3. What country YOU will be buying YOUR parts from.

-- USA - California

4. IF YOU have a brand preference. That means, are you an Intel-Fanboy, AMD-Fanboy, ATI-Fanboy, nVidia-Fanboy, Seagate-Fanboy, WD-Fanboy, etc.

-- Intel CPU and ATI Video card preferred

5. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts, and if so, what those parts are.

-- No major parts other than a dvd drive

7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds.

-- Default speeds

8. What resolution will you be using?

-- Widescreen

9. WHEN do you plan to build it?
Note that it is usually not cost or time effective to choose your build more than a month before you actually plan to be using it.

-- I will plan to make my purchase by Friday 6/29

10. Preferred hardware?

-- I like the Raidmax Dirt tooth case but looking to get at least a 700w PSU

X. Do you need to purchase any software to go with the system, such as Windows or Blu Ray playback software?

-- Windows 7 x64

NOTE: If you all have time, it would also be appreciated to find a comparable laptop with similar specs given the cost will increase obviously.

Throw together build I made up @newegg:
SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 6850 100315L Video Card with Eyefinity $139.99
ASRock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3 ATX Intel Motherboard $119.99
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 $46.99
Intel Core i7-3770 3.4GHz (3.9GHz Turbo) LGA 1155 Quad-Core $319.99
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 64-bit $79.99
COOLER MASTER HAF 912 RC-912-KKN1 Black Computer Case $59.99
SAMSUNG EcoGreen F4 2TB 3.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Internal Hard Drive $119.99
OCZ ModXStream Pro 700W PSU $89.99
SanDisk Extreme SDSSDX-120G-G25 2.5" Internal SSD $118.99
 
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Why buy a Z series motherboard if you won't be overclocking? An H61 board costs around $50 less than yours (though it may not support a 3770 without a BIOS update so ehhh).

For the SSD I say just spend a few extra dollars and get the Crucial M4 as its extremely well known for its reliability. Your PSU is overkill, I'd say get the Corsair TX 650 since its got a good deal going now but a large chunk is a MIR so I'll have to look up another. Also where do you see Windows 7 Home Premium for $80?

For the PSU: Corsair CX 500 $60 - $20 MIR - $10 promo (EMCNDHD77) = $30, not a hugely powerful PSU or anything but it should be sufficient for your system and intended uses.
 
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I agree krnmastersgt that PSU may be overkill. Rather than Corsair CX 500 $60 - $20 MIR - $10 promo (EMCNDHD77) = $30 + COOLER MASTER HAF 912 RC-912-KKN1 Black Computer Case $59.99 Free shipping.
How about just getting a Raidmax ATX-612WBP $89.99 Free Shipping that includes a 500W PSU? Currently I have one and it seems to work fine. I don't mind that its large and heavy - I like the look and the multiple included fans are very quiet and keep it cool - no tools needed for this case. My largest concern is that it is a bit older design and may not have all the proper power connectors / PSU may not be as reliable as Corsair CX 500.

Raidmax has a cheaper case Raidmax ATX-295WBP $59.99 + $14.99 Shipping that includes a 500W PSU but the PSU seems to have bad reviews.

Thanks for the Crucial M4 idea - will update to my build.

mfenn: Looking at your build and mine and the specs on the CPUs etc.

Intel Xeon X3440 Lynfiled has a benchmark of 5308 ranks 130.

Intel I7 3770 Ivy bridge has a benchmark of 10,427 ranks 12.
It also comes with a number of new features that can be seen in at:
http://hothardware.com/Reviews/Intel-Core-i53470-QuadCore-CPU-Review/

CPU at over $300 does seem like a lot and from the reading I did it seems like hyperthreading does not make much difference for gaming and may not make much difference for awhile. I'm also not enthused with built in graphics ability I probably won't use. I am thrilled with the power saving though.

Since power saving is one of the Ivy bridge line of CPUs features I looked at the Intel Core i5 line of CPUs:

Intel Core i5-3550 has a benchmark of 7617 ranks 61.
Intel BX80637I53550 $209.99 - $10 off w/ promo code EMCNDHJ25, ends 6/27 & free shipping. Lacks hyper threading. 2MB less onboard cash but 3.3GHz ( 3.7 GHz Turbo ) vs 2.53 GHz for the Lynnfield.

Intel Core i5-3570 has a benchmark of 7753 ranks 60.
Intel BX80637i53570 $214.99 free shipping. Like the 3550 but has 3.4 GHz ( 3.8 GHz Turbo ) vs 3.3 GHz ( 3.7 GHz Turbo ).

The more I look seems to create more questions:

What is more important for a CPU? High GHz vs high onboard cash vs features like hyperthreading or Ivy bridges powersaving, etc.?

How well does the Ivy bridges turbo mode work?

Anyone have thoughts on this?

A friend of mine and I also have the general philosophy that CPUs tend to outlive GPUs by a long shot so I'm more inclined to put an extra $100 into a CPU and leave myself open to upgrading the card later than to put it in the GPU. Does this make the GPU a bottleneck in the system until I upgrade though? I noticed that the i7 I originally listed with motherboard supports a PCI 3.0 GPU but I had selected a PCI 2.1 GPU.
 
Clock to clock is when you're comparing different architectures to each other, doesn't actually mean anything when you're just looking at 1 processor/processors of the same generation and architecture.

And for CPU's, all of those matter. For the most part, as long as you're not purchasing a budget CPU you shouldn't be focused too much on the cache for the most part (unless you're specifically doing extremely CPU intensive tasks). Higher clocks (GHz) typically translates to better performance although often times you'll find that the program you're running can't/doesn't fully utilize all of your CPU power so you won't always notice the increase in speed.

As for hyperthreading, what it effectively does is make your computer act as though it has twice as many cores (twice the threads, 2 logical threads per physical core) and this helps with many compute heavy tasks such as video editing/encoding and such. Is it worth the cost increase over the non-hyperthreading CPUs? Well that depends on how much/often you do the editing/encoding as if its rarely then the few extra seconds/minutes might not be all that annoying. If you do it regularly as a hobby or something then I'd say hyperthreading is very much worth it even with the extra cost.

As for how Turbo works, with default power settings in the BIOS, your CPU will idle at some very low multiplier and thusly require and consume much less energy. Then when you start doing tasks it will throttle the CPU multiplier and voltage up as it requires more power. If you start doing very CPU heavy tasks or there's suddenly a need for more power then the Turbo mode kicks in with an even higher multiplier to make your CPU work that much faster.

And regarding the video card, the 6850 may bottleneck your system in some games if you're playing at 1920x1080 or higher. And what your friend says does hold true, most people will go through multiple video card upgrades before they do a platform upgrade, but spending more doesn't always mean you're getting a better CPU out of it.
 
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No, clock to clock means the clock of one CPU's makeup to another CPU's, which in this case is the i5-2500k vs i5-3570k. The i5-3570k doesn't need an equal OC to get the same performance.
 
azeem40 said:
No, clock to clock means the clock of one CPU's makeup to another CPU's, which in this case is the i5-2500k vs i5-3570k. The i5-3570k doesn't need an equal OC to get the same performance.
Click to expand...
I think you guys are probably arguing from different angles about something you both understand, but neither is using the term in a very clear way.

Saying you're comparing two CPUs clock to clock is a rather ambiguous statement.

I think the point we can all agree on is that the performance of a CPU with a more efficient architecture is going to better clock for clock. In other words, a more efficient CPU gets more done per clock cycle, so it can do the same job in fewer cycles.

If you're comparing two CPUs of the same architecture you can just compare the clock speed of one to the other to see which is faster.

azeem, if that's not what you mean, I think you're misunderstanding the term.
 
DSF said:
I think you guys are probably arguing from different angles about something you both understand, but neither is using the term in a very clear way.

Saying you're comparing two CPUs clock to clock is a rather ambiguous statement.

I think the point we can all agree on is that the performance of a CPU with a more efficient architecture is going to better clock for clock. In other words, a more efficient CPU gets more done per clock cycle, so it can do the same job in fewer cycles.

If you're comparing two CPUs of the same architecture you can just compare the clock speed of one to the other to see which is faster.

azeem, if that's not what you mean, I think you're misunderstanding the term.
Click to expand...

I apologize if what I was describing didn't sound quite so clear but that's roughly the point I was trying to get across. Newer architectures are typically better with the same clock speeds of older architectures and when comparing within the same architecture its just a matter of pure clock speed.

HeianJodan said:
A good deal on a heatsink and fan to go with your build. Not required, especially if you are not OC'ing however it will keep your cpu nice and cool:
Thermaltake Frio Universal CPU Cooler CLP0564 $39.99 - $10.00 R = $29.99
Click to expand...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835103065

That's a better deal imo, $20 for the 212+.
 
XshadowfoxX said:
...... The more I look seems to create more questions:

What is more important for a CPU? High GHz vs high onboard cash vs features like hyperthreading or Ivy bridges powersaving, etc.?

How well does the Ivy bridges turbo mode work?

Anyone have thoughts on this?

A friend of mine and I also have the general philosophy that CPUs tend to outlive GPUs by a long shot so I'm more inclined to put an extra $100 into a CPU and leave myself open to upgrading the card later than to put it in the GPU. Does this make the GPU a bottleneck in the system until I upgrade though? I noticed that the i7 I originally listed with motherboard supports a PCI 3.0 GPU but I had selected a PCI 2.1 GPU.
Click to expand...

Hyperthreading makes a big difference for dual core i3s since it turns them into very good budget gaming cpus. But quad cores don't reap as much benefit games don't make full use of >4 threads with the exception of a few like BF3 in multiplayer. For an $900 (before rebate) budget gaming system I would go for a cheaper cpu like a 3550/3570 since they are already plenty powerful for gaming. Drop the SSD and get a 7850 instead of the 6850. Or go above your budget and look at Mfenn's suggestions.
 
gus6464 said:
The Frio for $30 imo is a better deal than the hyper because it already comes with 2 fans.
Click to expand...

They could give me 3 fans, if the heat sink design isn't up to par it won't be a better cooler. Not to mention with a price difference of $10 you could buy a pretty decent fan to add in conjunction to the 212+ since you get an extra pair of brackets if you want to do push-pull.
 
XshadowfoxX said:
I agree krnmastersgt that PSU may be overkill. Rather than Corsair CX 500 $60 - $20 MIR - $10 promo (EMCNDHD77) = $30 + COOLER MASTER HAF 912 RC-912-KKN1 Black Computer Case $59.99 Free shipping.
How about just getting a Raidmax ATX-612WBP $89.99 Free Shipping that includes a 500W PSU? Currently I have one and it seems to work fine. I don't mind that its large and heavy - I like the look and the multiple included fans are very quiet and keep it cool - no tools needed for this case. My largest concern is that it is a bit older design and may not have all the proper power connectors / PSU may not be as reliable as Corsair CX 500.

Raidmax has a cheaper case Raidmax ATX-295WBP $59.99 + $14.99 Shipping that includes a 500W PSU but the PSU seems to have bad reviews.
Click to expand...

Just say no to Raidmax PSUs, they are absolute junk.


XshadowfoxX said:
mfenn: Looking at your build and mine and the specs on the CPUs etc.

Intel Xeon X3440 Lynfiled has a benchmark of 5308 ranks 130.
Click to expand...

Huh? Who's talking about two year old Xeons????

Anyway, unless your video editing is extremely important to you (more important than gaming), then you should get the i5 that I recommended and the 7850 GPU that I recommended.

Balance is extremely important in a gaming rig, and you should 95% of the time be spending at least as much on a GPU as you are on a CPU.
 
smiley22432 said:
I have had a modular 700W OCZ stream-pro going for while and its still running strong.
Click to expand...

And this anecdotal evidence is supposed to prove something? I have some noname OEM PSU in a decade old office rig still "going strong".

However, I wouldn't say OCZ is bad. It's OK. The new ZS, ZT and ZX are pretty good units, better than the earlier "XStream" branded units. But those weren't bad either, just OK.
 
XshadowfoxX said:
The ASRock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3 ATX Intel Motherboard has 2 PCI Express 3.0 x16 slots so if I wanted to go with twin graphics cards in the future it would be a possibility.
Click to expand...

Unless you plan on playing at something beyond 1920x1080, you're usually much better off just buying one of the stronger cards of the current generations instead of thinking you'll turn to SLI or this case Crossfire, especially since you're not even targeting a very high end card with your initial build.
 
There is no difference really, likewise you won't see any actual performance differences with just this set of G.SKILL Value 8 GB for a gaming rig. You might score higher with the Ripjaws in some benchmarks, but for actual gaming experience they'll be more or less identical.

Also bear in mind that Z68 can support 3rd gen i5/i7's but if you have an older BIOS from ordering that board, you'll need an older generation CPU to flash the BIOS to support the 3570K properly.

Actually I don't see why you'd grab that board when you can grab the ASRock Z75 Pro3 for quite a bit less. And if you want a full ATX board for some reason, even the ASRock Z77 Pro3 is cheaper as well, and both will natively support the 3570K.
 
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krnmastersgt said:
There is no difference really, likewise you won't see any actual performance differences with just this set of G.SKILL Value 8 GB for a gaming rig. You might score higher with the Ripjaws in some benchmarks, but for actual gaming experience they'll be more or less identical.
Click to expand...

Agree.

krnmastersgt said:
Also bear in mind that Z68 can support 3rd gen i5/i7's but if you have an older from ordering that board, you'll need an older generation CPU to flash the BIOS to support the 3570K properly.
Click to expand...

As a clarification, I'm assuming you meant "but if you get an older stock board, you'll need an older generation CPU to flash the BIOS".

But yeah, I agree that given the prices of Z77 and Z75 boards, there is really no reason to pick up the older chipset at this point.
 
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