Background checks at gun shows?

[Jschmuck2]

Can one of you...enthusiasts...explain to me why requiring a background check before you buy a gun at a gun show is bad? It's not required in some (all?) places as it stands now. Why is that?

 

[Kirby]

Where's the argument? Or are we just supposed to magically know what you're referring to?

 

[Jschmuck2]

When I say argument, I mean that there's a contingent of people who don't want that to happen.

 

[Fear No Evil]

First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

 

[Jschmuck2]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

Thanks for posting the facts. Beat me to it. The take away is that it has nothing to do with gun shows and everything to do with a private seller. Most all sellers at a gun show are LICENSED dealers and not private sellers that's why almost all sales will require a background check.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

why don't you explain it then troll?

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

why don't you explain it then troll?

spidey just did

 

[Jschmuck2]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

Thanks for posting the facts. Beat me to it. The take away is that it has nothing to do with gun shows and everything to do with a private seller. Most all sellers at a gun show are LICENSED dealers and not private sellers that's why almost all sales will require a background check.

Ah ha. Doing some reading, I see that there have been attempts in congress to close that loophole but they've been broken up in committee or voted down. Who would vote against that?

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

Okay, now he knows. So let's hear your argument?

BTW-I think it's absolutely ridiculous that you can sell guns privately and at a gun show without doing a background check. WTF is the point of having background checks if you can just go buy a gun at a gun show and avoid that all together?

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

why don't you explain it then troll?

spidey just did

i still don't get it.

licensed gun dealers at gun shows don't have to do background checks because they are licensed? or is it the other way around?

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

Okay, now he knows. So let's hear your argument?

BTW-I think it's absolutely ridiculous that you can sell guns privately and at a gun show without doing a background check. WTF is the point of having background checks if you can just go buy a gun at a gun show and avoid that all together?

I think you're looking at this the wrong way.

The part that folks don't like is that the government won't let people use the system to check. They will only let people they license use it.

And licensees aren't going to do the phone call for you for free (or even do it period a lot of the time).

So what you'd end up with is a people wanting to sell a product, but an artificially limited group that those products would have to go through. As with anything, there is money involved. Follow the trail.

 

[QuantumPion]

You can't "close the loophole". Attempting to do so will have no bearing on criminals getting guns for nefarious purposes. Anyone can still buy or sell a gun to another private individual whenever they want, especially with the internet. It's akin to trying to make laws to ban sharing of MP3's.

Like most gun laws, criminals ignore them and still obtain them illegally. They don't care because they are criminals anyway.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

why don't you explain it then troll?

spidey just did

i still don't get it.

licensed gun dealers at gun shows don't have to do background checks because they are licensed? or is it the other way around?

Licensed dealers have to do the check, or equivalent (depending on state law), every time. Doesn't matter where it takes place. In fact, the only place they are allowed to do business is at a gun show (or other designated area) or the address listed on the license.

Individuals aren't required to do the background check, in part because they aren't allowed to use the background check system.

 

[Jschmuck2]

Originally posted by: QuantumPion
You can't "close the loophole". Attempting to do so will have no bearing on criminals getting guns for nefarious purposes. Anyone can still buy or sell a gun to another private individual whenever they want, especially with the internet. It's akin to trying to make laws to ban sharing of MP3's.

Like most gun laws, criminals ignore them and still obtain them illegally. They don't care because they are criminals anyway.

Let's theorize that there's one murder per year committed with a gun purchased at a gun show without a background check. I don't think that's too out there. Wouldn't closing that loophole be worth it for whomever is getting shot?

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: BrunoPuntzJones

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

why don't you explain it then troll?

spidey just did

i still don't get it.

licensed gun dealers at gun shows don't have to do background checks because they are licensed? or is it the other way around?

Licensed dealers have to do the check, or equivalent (depending on state law), every time. Doesn't matter where it takes place. In fact, the only place they are allowed to do business is at a gun show (or other designated area) or the address listed on the license.

Individuals aren't required to do the background check, in part because they aren't allowed to use the background check system.

but these people are still allowed to sell guns at gun shows?

 

[Capt Caveman]

60 Minutes had a segment on how the brother of one of the killed in the VT massacre was able to go to a gun show and buy $5k worth of guns(assault rifles, pistols, etc) and ammo within a hour without a single verification/background check. He was even able to buy in the parking lot. Only one person asked for a drivers license and when he told the seller he didn't want to show it to him, the seller asked for an additional $100 and sold it to him.

This segment occurred in VA where I guess folks from all over the eastern seaboard (based on the license plates in the parking lot) come b/c the ease to purchase guns.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

but these people are still allowed to sell guns at gun shows?

You can sell it anywhere (private seller), that's what makes a gun show completely irrelevant.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: BrunoPuntzJones

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
First, explain what you think this means.. because I have a sincere doubt you truly understand what the "loophole" is.

I don't - that's why I'm asking. There's a loophole?

Well, educate yourself then. Its 100% illegal for firearms dealers to sell people guns at gunshows without background checks etc. Now, if you go and do a little research you will find out what the 'loophole' is, and how it doesn't really apply to gunshows specifically but ALL private sales of firearms. Why would I argue with you why it should be allowed when you don't even know what it is?

why don't you explain it then troll?

spidey just did

i still don't get it.

licensed gun dealers at gun shows don't have to do background checks because they are licensed? or is it the other way around?

Licensed dealers have to do the check, or equivalent (depending on state law), every time. Doesn't matter where it takes place. In fact, the only place they are allowed to do business is at a gun show (or other designated area) or the address listed on the license.

Individuals aren't required to do the background check, in part because they aren't allowed to use the background check system.

but these people are still allowed to sell guns at gun shows?

Who are you referring to as "these people?" The individuals?

The location doesn't matter on individuals (well, anything like on school campus anyway). The "gunshow loophole" is just a phrase, same as "cop-killer" bullets. It doesn't mean anything.

I can meet you behind Wal-Mart just as much as a gun show.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
60 Minutes had a segment on how the brother of one of the killed in the VT massacre was able to go to a gun show and buy $5k worth of guns(assault rifles, pistols, etc) and ammo within a hour without a single verification/background check. He was even able to buy in the parking lot. Only one person asked for a drivers license and when he told the seller he didn't want to show it to him, the seller asked for an additional $100 and sold it to him.

This segment occurred in VA where I guess folks from all over the eastern seaboard (based on the license plates in the parking lot) come b/c the ease to purchase guns.

I thought all that was proven to be a lie? Yeah, that 60 minutes segment was full of bullshit and misinformation.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
60 Minutes had a segment on how the brother of one of the killed in the VT massacre was able to go to a gun show and buy $5k worth of guns(assault rifles, pistols, etc) and ammo within a hour without a single verification/background check. He was even able to buy in the parking lot. Only one person asked for a drivers license and when he told the seller he didn't want to show it to him, the seller asked for an additional $100 and sold it to him.

This segment occurred in VA where I guess folks from all over the eastern seaboard (based on the license plates in the parking lot) come b/c the ease to purchase guns.

I thought all that was proven to be a lie? Yeah, that 60 minutes segment was full of bullshit and misinformation.

How?

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: QuantumPion
You can't "close the loophole". Attempting to do so will have no bearing on criminals getting guns for nefarious purposes. Anyone can still buy or sell a gun to another private individual whenever they want, especially with the internet. It's akin to trying to make laws to ban sharing of MP3's.

Like most gun laws, criminals ignore them and still obtain them illegally. They don't care because they are criminals anyway.

Let's theorize that there's one murder per year committed with a gun purchased at a gun show without a background check. I don't think that's too out there. Wouldn't closing that loophole be worth it for whomever is getting shot?

What if we assume that 1 person protects his property or family each year with a gun purchased from a gunshow with no background check?

 

[Jschmuck2]

Originally posted by: OCguy

Originally posted by: Jschmuck2

Originally posted by: QuantumPion
You can't "close the loophole". Attempting to do so will have no bearing on criminals getting guns for nefarious purposes. Anyone can still buy or sell a gun to another private individual whenever they want, especially with the internet. It's akin to trying to make laws to ban sharing of MP3's.

Like most gun laws, criminals ignore them and still obtain them illegally. They don't care because they are criminals anyway.

Let's theorize that there's one murder per year committed with a gun purchased at a gun show without a background check. I don't think that's too out there. Wouldn't closing that loophole be worth it for whomever is getting shot?

What if we assume that 1 person protects his property or family each year with a gun purchased from a gunshow with no background check?

Why couldn't he submit to a background check?

 

[Fear No Evil]

People just have no clue what this stuff means.. they just hear gunshow loophole and scream OMG!!! STOP IT!!! WHY DON'T WE SAVE JUST ONE LIFE. Yet they have no idea what it means, and how it doesn't really relate to gunshows AT ALL other than a lot of private sales occur there just like a lot of art sales happen at craft sales.