ATI tries to downplay SLI

[SickBeast]

Originally posted by: DaveBaumann
The main thrust of the Inquirers article is correct - there is now a specific DCT test that causes ATI issues with its instancing support. There certainly was some lack of understanding of some of the technilcal details, but given the Inq is somewhat of the Online Tech equivelent of Tabloid journalism, thats kinda what you'd expect.

In the long term, though, I would expect that we'll see it, or something similar, have specific support in DX9.0d if they do another update in 6 months time. In the meantime, it seems like ATI will provide a workable solution that will provide end users the facility of using it (if their dev rel is good enough to get developers to use it) whilst effectively circumventing the DCT issues.

Well, the article went beyond mere observation and made a prediction:

If you can safely assume that the OEMs won't ship with it on, it will be off pretty much for good. If you are coding, do you spend dev time an money on that, or just go with the standards? I think this effectively kills GI for ATI in the current chips, and that is a sad thing. It is a really worthwhile feature that is there, and does work. Those pesky standards mean most will never see it though.

That's a bold and sensationalist statement IMO, and is probably not even remotely close to reality. I shouldn't expect any different from a 'tabloid', I suppose. I think they should stick to reporting 'news' and avoid making any sorts of inferences or predictions. They've proven that they lack the knowledge neccessary to make any kind of educated guess when it comes to the future of computer hardware.

 

[Pete]

Originally posted by: Klixxer
No, you phreak, even the banshees were faster than the V2 SLI soloution and the V3 were more than 300% as fast as an SLI solution with V2s and another graphic card, you do know what is the main difference wetween a V2, a banshee and a V3?

Of course you dont, and your lack of knowledge inspired the rest of your post.

I'm the one who's supposed to be clueless here?

The Banshees were a disappointment WRT gaming precisely because of their missing TMU (as noted by others), and the V3 2K (sorry, I didn't note which model) performed similarly to a V2 SLI (albeit with tack-sharp signal quality, thanks to dumping the V2's horrible RAMDACs and pass-thru cable).

I'm sure I'm mistaking some of the details, but IIRC:

V2: 1x2, 85MHz?
V2 SLI: 2x2, 85MHz?
Banshee: 1x1, no clue
V3 2K: 1x2, 140MHz?
V3 3K: 1x2, 166MHz?
V3 3.5K: 1x2, 183MHz

I'm almost postive no V3 was anywhere near 3x as fast as a V2 SLI, but not concerned enough to bother searching old AT reviews. You mention "V2s and another graphic card," but the 2D card was irrelevant to the V2(s) and the SLI implementation (which required a SLI cable inside the case, b/w the two V2s). Maybe you're confusing cables (external pass-thru vs. internal SLI)?

If you want to make me out to be the fool, you'll have to try a little harder than that. It's eminently possible, of course, but it's not that easy.

BTW, you still haven't told me what "SGPU tech" is.

 

[MemberSince97]

V3 2000 was 143MHz and ya Banshees sucked hard... if they worked at all.

 

[Pete]

For someone who keeps them two+, the 9700Pro was probably the better choice. It wasn't much of an advantage though, and still isn't.

Let's say I still had the 9700Pro and 5800Ultra and had to choose.

When I look over at my games, I see one clear victory 9700P (Far Cry). (although Painkiller put the hurts on the 5800U too, don't know how the 9700P would have fared.

So I have 1, maybe 2 games, that I would have noticed a big difference on. Woot?

Rollo, you're forgetting FX Flow-induced tinnitus.

Seriously, the 9700P wasn't a one-trick pony. Sure, 3DM03 showed early on (before nV "intervened") that it had 50% higher performance than the 5800U with basic SM2.0 shaders--but it also had clearly better AA, greatly improved (and not noticably inferior) AF, and stable drivers (which every single reviewer noted). It just seemed to outclass the FX in every way but clock speeds--typically not by a huge margin, but by a bit in a lot. The fact that it showed up practically half a year earlier probably cemented ATi's dominance of that generation in many people's minds.

To answer Acanthus' post, I don't think it's nearly the same with this gen. The X800P/XTPE and 6800GT/U are much closer in terms of performance, IQ, and features than the 9700/P and 5800/U were. It was also easier to see the promise of SM2.0 vs. SM1.0 with all the HDR and other demos, whereas I haven't seen much in the way of SM3.0 demos outclassing SM2.0 ones.

But whatever, the 9700P and 5800U--and their promise and reality--are long gone, and this thread is mainly about SLI. Surely there's enough cannon fodder in there for us to limit our flaming to that topic?

 

[Steeplerot]

Originally posted by: CaiNaM
quote:
with a GT requiring a molex on it's own line - so would an Ultra require 4, and what psu would support THAT?

As far as I have seen it would be a non issue as SLI capable PCI X cards do not need any molex connectors at all the PCI X slot provides juice.

 

[nRollo]

Sigh. The 5800U is my cross to bear as the one man on the planet who defended it.

OK Pete, even though I've pretty much begged in this thread to let the 5800U R.I.P.

, here goes:

Rollo, you're forgetting FX Flow-induced tinnitus

1. Not all 5800Us had FlowFX: Leadtek was quiet, Gainward close to quiet, and Gainward Water Cooled dead silent.
2. The FlowFX itself was nowhere near as loud as it was playing those MP3s of it recorded through your speakers. It sounded like a travel size blow dryer would if it was 1/3 as big. It wasn't much louder than the big OCer HSF on my son's Athlon XP.

that it had 50% higher performance than the 5800U with basic SM2.0 shaders

Of course, there weren't but a couple SM2 games out then and now for that matter, and the 9700P just sucks less at them. Within a 2 month's of Far Cry's release, my <$300 6800NU was making the 9700Pro look like a V5 at SM2?

but it also had clearly better AA,

Woot?

and stable drivers

Of course, my rev.1 9700P had rolling gray bars falling through the 2d, and pretty choppy performance in some games for several driver revisions, but hey, why consider the facts when we can bash the 5800U, the card everyone loves to hate?

It just seemed to outclass the FX in every way but clock speeds--typically not by a huge margin, but by a bit in a lot.

It got beat in as many benches as it won, and people like you who support all things ATI yelled,"The benches it wins don't matter! It's 50% at 16X12 4X8X because it's at 16fps and the 5800U is at 8!" And at 12X10 4X8X it would be a difference of like 42 vs 39 and guys like would yell "Those 3 fps OWN! Gotta have'm! A win is a win!" :roll:

The fact that it showed up practically half a year earlier probably cemented ATi's dominance of that generation in many people's minds.

The fact that it came out half a year earlier has nothing to do with nVidia at all. They did their part, TSMC dropped the ball, much like Samsung did with the memory for X800XT PEs.

and this thread is mainly about SLI. Surely there's enough cannon fodder in there for us to limit our flaming to that topic?

Well, Ive asked for that twice in this thread already, and you're the one who came out flaming the 5800U, so I guess you can't take your own advice?

Man, some of you are SO narrow minded. You think every piddly decision you make in life is a direct reflection on your intellect or the length of your unit.:roll:

I've got news for you: what kind of video card you own won't get you laid, earn you more money, or make you popular at parties.

You can have some fun with the hardware and not act like you're defending your wife from Visigoths if someone has a different point of view?


<steps off soap box>

 

[BFG10K]

Hmmm. What a mean spirited, hostile thing to say. Not long on manners, are you BFG10K?

Do you really think your appeal to emotion fallacies will get you anywhere?

Rollo: 1+1=3.
Everyone: no it doesn't.
Rollo: But I'm a family man! I have a son! I have a wife!

Just what do you think such ridiculous comments will accomplish?

I'm "child-like"?

Yes, you are.

Again I'll ask, what is your response to your first claim that the 9700 Pro was too slow to run any AA and AF but then suddenly the slower 5800U allowed you to run 4xAA and 4xAF?

What is your response to your tune going from "features mean nothing as long as the cards are the same speed" to your new tune "SM 3.0 is a must-have?

What is your response to "there are not many SM 2.0 games" to "SM 3.0 means everything even though there's only one game that runs under it and you need a recalled patch to run it"?

if my benchmarks are cpu limited as you say, why does the performance on the cards substantially decrease with each level of resolution?

So why aren't you running 1024x768x4x4 on your GT Rollo? Why have you been sneaking upwards in resolutions ever since you started using the 6800 series?

Following your ludicrous logic we can conclude the 6800 series is equal to the 5xxx series, right? So why aren't you starting a thread "I just went from a 6800 GT to a 5800 U and at 1024x768 it kicks ass and both cards are the same speed" like you did with the 9800 Pro and the 5800?

I'm amazed you can even come in here and post with a straight face. Again, it's like dealing with a child.

Gee, right here on this site, 10X7 4X8X, 12X104X8X, 16X12 4x8x. I use these in every response I make on every board where someone says "Teh 5800 suxorz! Teh 9700Pro ownz it's sorry azz".

Of course you did. First everyone needs SM 3.0 but when the 5800U is discussed you're quite happy to use DirectX 6/7 titles and claim shaders are irrelevant.

Nobody needs "Wallet Raider", eh Rollo? Features are irrelevant as long as the cards are the same speed, or if the feature is SM 3.0, eh Rollo? Smack smack smack, oooh, shiney pipes. Tell me Rollo, what shiney pipes does SM 3.0 give you?

Why are there significantly different levels of performance at each setting if the cards are cpu limited at the settings on the benchmarks I post?

So if I run 640x480 and then 1600x1200 using your reasoning 640x480 is not CPU limirted because there are different levels of performance at 1600x1200? ROFL. Do you understand anything about benchmarking? Do you have even the slightest clue how ludicrious your stance is?

Didn't you see the post above where BFG10K implies there were lots of PS2 games out over the last two years?

Didn't you see the post where SM 2.0 means nothing but SM 3.0 means everything?

Wavey! I'll get you!

Just be sure you don't drop your nappy while you're "getting him".

 

[reever]

I've got news for you: what kind of video card you own won't get you laid

So why do you go on and on about your buying decisions and you being a "collector" of sorts?

 

[BFG10K]

SplinterCell is still being used by B3D which also can't utilize AA,

I think these days the bare minimum is AF; you're really wasting your time benching modern cards without it.

Actually, there were no shader intensive titles when Dave started his big PR push,

Some of the later Quake III engined games like SOF2, Jedi Academy, COD and Elite Force 2 were using shaders reasonably extensively.

DooM3 is the only game I have that requires some level of shader functionality to play(and you could argue that calling register combiners shaders is stretching it)- which titles are you talking about?

Doom III will actually run on DX7 parts and have most IQ present. OTOH a game built around shaders like Far Cry looks nothing it should on a DX7 part and games like Deus Ex2 and Thief 3 will not launch on hardware that doesn't support DirectX 8.0 shaders or higher.

 

[nRollo]

Sigh. Poor BFG, always the misanthrope.

Do you really think your appeal to emotion fallacies will get you anywhere?

Rollo: 1+1=3.
Everyone: no it doesn't.
Rollo: But I'm a family man! I have a son! I have a wife!

Just what do you think such ridiculous comments will accomplish?

Errr, BFG, the person I was replying to had said something as ludicrous as that I am "proud of my video cards" (which would be pretty cheap among my toys actually). I told him what I am proud of:education, family, helping people at career in an effort to show how trivial video cards are in the scheme of things, how you wouldn't normally be "proud" of a cheap material possession? I'm sorry if my post was hard for you to understand, it seemed pretty straightforward to me?

Again I'll ask, what is your response to your first claim that the 9700 Pro was too slow to run any AA and AF but then suddenly the slower 5800U allowed you to run 4xAA and 4xAF?

I'm glad you remember what settings I used last year, I sure don't? Do you keep a diary of my doings?

What is your response to your tune going from "features mean nothing as long as the cards are the same speed" to your new tune "SM 3.0 is a must-have?

That was my answer last year, no PS2 games I cared about were out then. In the year after the release of the nV40 cards, there will likely be SM3 games out that it may make a difference on. SLI will for sure make a difference, and I may well get it.

What is your response to "there are not many SM 2.0 games" to "SM 3.0 means everything even though there's only one game that runs under it and you need a recalled patch to run it"?

See above. Nothing came out before the nV40 that was a compelling enough argument for me to pick one over the other. Besides, unlike certain, "I am loyal to one card only" types, I bought both.

So why aren't you running 1024x768x4x4 on your GT Rollo? Why have you been sneaking upwards in resolutions ever since you started using the 6800 series?

Err, why would I? That doesn't excuse you from dodging the question about you always saying the only benchmarks I note are cpu limited and then side stepping when I point out they're clearly not?

Nobody needs "Wallet Raider", eh Rollo?

Nobody does. It was pretty much universally reviled, like Ben noted. LOTR and Stalker might be different though?

So if I run 640x480 and then 1600x1200 using your reasoning 640x480 is not CPU limirted because there are different levels of performance at 1600x1200? ROFL. Do you understand anything about benchmarking? Do you have even the slightest clue how ludicrious your stance is?

I don't know, let's see:

I didn't say anything about 640X480 vs 16X12. I pointed at benchmarks at 10X7 4X8X, 12X10 4X8X, and 16X12 4X8X and stated that the declining performance might be due to limitations of the cards. (e.g. fillrate, memory bandwidth, geometry processing)

If any of the staff here at AT, Wavey Dave, or Ben tell me this can't possibly be the case, that the decline in performance on all these games at these settings can only be due to cpu limitation, I'll apologize to you for wasting your time with the question BFG. And admit my error. Will you do the same? Or start rambling about my family some more?

Didn't you see the post above where BFG10K implies there were lots of PS2 games out over the last two years?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Didn't you see the post where SM 2.0 means nothing but SM 3.0 means everything?

There were barely any games, and you still can't admit that. LOL Like a little terrier guarding his yard. "My video knowledge ownz you all! Especially you, hated Rollo!" LOL

Just be sure you don't drop your nappy while you're "getting him".

My "nappy"?! LOL, Why BFG, I always thought you were a kid in some suburb pounding away your hate speech. I see you're in New Zealand in your profile. No wonder you don't try more cards- they probably cost a month's pay where you are. It must kind of burn your ass that here in the states we can get this stuff really cheap and trade cards as we please for little money. (seeing as how dear you hold this stuff?)
Tough luck there ol buddy.

 

[nRollo]

BTW- don't construe the above as me having anything against New Zealand. I definitely want to visit, looks like one of the most beautiful places on the planet in the movies.

I was just postulating that BFGs getting angry when I switch video cards all the time, and his keeping them 2 years, makes a lot more sense when you add the "New Zealand cost" factor into the equation.

 

[BFG10K]

I'm sorry if my post was hard for you to understand, it seemed pretty straightforward to me?

Whenever you're proven wrong talking about your family or how much money you've spent on ATi cards will not help your cause like you appear to think it will.

I'm glad you remember what settings I used last year, I sure don't? Do you keep a diary of my doings?

So what is your answer? How is it that the faster 9700 Pro was too slow for AA+AF (your words) but the slower 5800U could manage 4x+4x? Answer the question.

That was my answer last year, no PS2 games I cared about were out then. In the year after the release of the nV40 cards, there will likely be SM3 games out that it may make a difference on. SLI will for sure make a difference, and I may well get it.

So last year there were SM 2.0 games out but you didn't care. Now there might be SM 3.0 titles and that makes the feature a must-have?

So actual games is not as good as potential games? Is that what you're saying?

See above.

We've seen it everywhere not, just above. That's why poeple put a T in front of your name.

Err, why would I?

The same reason why you would downgrade from a 1024x768x0x0 9700 Pro and then move to a slower 5800U, run it a 1024x768x4x4 and also claim speed equality.

When can we expect you to downgrade your 6800GT, put in a 5800 and start a thread saying "the 5800 kicks ass at 1024x768 and it's equal to a 6800 GT!" thread? When will you posting that?

That doesn't excuse you from dodging the question about you always saying the only benchmarks I note are cpu limited and then side stepping when I point out they're clearly not?

I didn't dodge anything and you haven't pointed out anything other than yet another example of your biased view.

Nobody does. It was pretty much universally reviled, like Ben noted.

And the rest of the games? Nobody needed those either? But everyone needs Far Cry and to download the recalled patch right?

Additionally back in those days you were actually claiming Far Cry was irrelevant because you didn't have it, but now it's the pivotal game and everyone needs it along with SM 3.0? Far Cry's shiney pipes didn't matter back then but they do know?

If that isn't trolling and pro-nv bias then I don't know what is. Again, are you really surprised that people call you Trollo?

I pointed at benchmarks at 10X7 4X8X, 12X10 4X8X, and 16X12 4X8X and stated that the declining performance might be due to limitations of the cards.

It makes no difference if it's 320x240 or 1024x768 if both are CPU limited. Your claim that 1024 isn't CPU limited because 1280 is lower is quite frankly one of the most ridiculous pieces of reasoning I've ever seen.

Or start rambling about my family some more?

The only person rambling about your family is you.

There were barely any games, and you still can't admit that.

"Barely any games" is still more than one game that can only be accessed with a recalled patch, and you still can't admit that.

Tough luck there ol buddy.

Add that pre-pubescent argument to the family and collector ones you keep producing and you'll be set as the master of video card debate and nobody will ever dare question your comments again.
:roll:

I was just postulating that BFGs getting angry when I switch video cards all the time, and his keeping them 2 years, makes a lot more sense when you add the "New Zealand cost" factor into the equation.

I guess some people in the US have a retard factor that convinces them that a 9700P -> 5800 -> 9800P -> 5800 upgrade path is a viable one. Likewise these same people then turn around and claim that they refuse to go with X800s because they aren't getting anything new, even while removing the third 5800 from their system.

 

[nRollo]

LOL! Good stuff BFG.

You're right, a few here have called me Trollo for my opinions.

You've been called a few things yourself though haven't you? (e.g. "nazi")

That's the nature of public discussion BFG. Some people will agree with you, some won't, and some will call you names.

You never know BFG- I might throw in a 5800Ultra again, or who knows? I'd buy a V5 6K if they ever came down in price. LOL- I can see the chips of plastic flying off your keyboard now as you break the keys typing:

"You god damn nVidiot troll money wasting retarded Yankee S.O.B.!!!! Yeeeargggggg! It's on! I'm flying to America to smash your computers so you can't make any more bad choices of video cards! Yeeearrrgggg!"

LOL :beer: to you my friend down under!

 

[lordtyranus]

5xxx cards smacked silly.

http://graphics.tomshardware.c...unreal_tournament_2003

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: lordtyranus
5xxx cards smacked silly.

<a target=_blank class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="</blockquote>
">[url]http://graphics.tomshardware.c...ment_2003</a>[/q[/url]

LOL- Oh no! Newbie member points out some benchmarks I've seen many times wherein the 5800U doesn't do as well as you'd expect!

Please.....please...stop....Lord Tyranus.....you're ...killing .....me.....


:roll:

Errrr, LT? I can point out benchmarks all over the net that make one card look better than another, then vice versa? It's sort of the nature of things.

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: lordtyranus
5xxx cards smacked silly.

LOL- Oh no! Newbie member points out some benchmarks I've seen many times wherein the 5800U doesn't do as well as you'd expect!

Please.....please...stop....Lord Tyranus.....you're ...killing .....me.....

Come on, Trollo - discrediting someone for their low post count... What's next? Skirting every question asked by saying that you don't remember what you posted a year ago? Lame.

[/quote]
Errrr, LT? I can point out benchmarks all over the net that make one card look better than another, then vice versa? It's sort of the nature of things.
[/quote]

So go for it.

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Tough luck there ol buddy.

Add that pre-pubescent argument to the family and collector ones you keep producing and you'll be set as the master of video card debate and nobody will ever dare question your comments again.

I was just postulating that BFGs getting angry when I switch video cards all the time, and his keeping them 2 years, makes a lot more sense when you add the "New Zealand cost" factor into the equation.

I guess some people in the US have a retard factor that convinces them that a 9700P -> 5800 -> 9800P -> 5800 upgrade path is a viable one. Likewise these same people then turn around and claim that they refuse to go with X800s because they aren't getting anything new, even while removing the third 5800 from their system.

Priceless! Absolutely priceless.

 

[Drayvn]

Does the Unreal 2 Engine support SM2?

 

[Creig]

Originally posted by: Rollo
I see you're in New Zealand in your profile. No wonder you don't try more cards- they probably cost a month's pay where you are. It must kind of burn your ass that here in the states we can get this stuff really cheap and trade cards as we please for little money. (seeing as how dear you hold this stuff?)
Tough luck there ol buddy.

I see you're still teasing people who can't afford to purchase every single video card released.


Sad.

 

[lordtyranus]

LOL- Oh no! Newbie member points out some benchmarks I've seen many times wherein the 5800U doesn't do as well as you'd expect!

Do so. As the 9700 nonpro beats the 5950, by that comparison the 5800 nu should beat the 9800 XT 3/3 times. And this was the prime of the 9xxx/5xxx cards as well. If you can find a benchmark where the 5800 U beats the 9800 XT close to 100% of the time with AA/AF enabled and I'll tip my hat to you.

After all, why choose low IQ or speed when you can have both? Apparently it wasn't a tough decision for you. "Shader hacks don't matter if you get remotely comparable IQ".....

All Nvidia has is the (excellent performing) 6800 series at this time. ATI dominates the mainsteam $80 - $250 market.

I looked through your posts in this thread and apparently you say that the R420 sucks because you refuse to buy the "same" core a 3rd time in 2 years. Yet, rolly, you have bought 2 NV40s in at most 3 months??!?!?!???

How much does Nvidia pay you? I'd like a job, and could probably pimp Nvidia cards better than you can. And before you use your hapless, moronic ooh I bought so many ATI cards argument, your nonsense utterly biased idiotic rhetoric on various forums throughout the internet has likely swayed some hapless souls into a poor video card purchase.

I'll direct you here.

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/

Does the Unreal 2 Engine support SM2?

Not only does it support it, it requires it. 9700 cards will likely be the absolute minimum to run that game.


Edit: Hahaha, looks like trolly is getting smacked silly in this thread. BFG10k is pwning him lolz.

 

[BFG10K]

You've been called a few things yourself though haven't you? (e.g. "nazi")

It's one thing to call me something and another to produce hard evidence to counter my claims.

You never know BFG- I might throw in a 5800Ultra again, or who knows?

Once again you've skirted around all of the questions and failed to resolve the key issues that prevent your claim of impartiality from being substantiated. The fact is that almost every anti-ATi comment you've made in the last 12 months has been reversed by you and turned into pro-nVidia.

"You god damn nVidiot troll money wasting retarded Yankee S.O.B.!!!!

I really don't understand why you keep bringing in nationality into this, I really don't. It has about as much relevance to the subject at hand as you being a collector or having a family.

 

[BFG10K]

Does the Unreal 2 Engine support SM2?

To my knowledge it doesn't but rather it has a splash of 1.x shaders in there for certain terrain effects such as water and vegetation. OTOH the Unreal 3 engine will require SM 2.0 as a minimum (i.e. it won't run on a Direct 8.x card or lower).

I see you're still teasing people who can't afford to purchase every single video card released.

The thing is that I probably have a larger hardware budget than Rollo does, I just don't go around buying inferior cards three times in a row like he does. Yet Rollo seems to have arrived at the conclusion that I must be poor when in reality I'm just not stupid.

Yet, trolly, you have bought 2 NV40s in at most 3 months??!?!?!???

Don't forget the three 5800 cards he purchased, ditching superior ATi cards in the process. Then he turns around and claims ATi is ripping him off with the X800 series and he doesn't like paying for the same thing over and over again.

ROFL.

 

[jim1976]

When I look over at my games, I see one clear victory 9700P (Far Cry). (although Painkiller put the hurts on the 5800U too, don't know how the 9700P would have fared.

It's not only Far Cry Rollo. It will probably be HL2,STALKER and some other great dx9 titles. It might not be so important to you since you can/want to invest on new hardware but for the average gamer actually it makes alot of difference.

So much text has been devoted to this, it's got to stop. It's like arguing the GTS vs V5 all over again. Let's stick to nV40/R420?

I do agree with this,as long as we don't repeat ourselves commiting the same fallacies....

P.S : BTW it's nice to have Dave visiting our forums from time to time and share his expertees with us. :beer:

 

[hytek369]

competition is good

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: lordtyranus
<blockquote>quote:
<hr>LOL- Oh no! Newbie member points out some benchmarks I've seen many times wherein the 5800U doesn't do as well as you'd expect! <hr></blockquote>
Do so. As the 9700 nonpro beats the 5950, by that comparison the 5800 nu should beat the 9800 XT 3/3 times. And this was the prime of the 9xxx/5xxx cards as well. If you can find a benchmark where the 5800 U beats the 9800 XT close to 100% of the time with AA/AF enabled and I'll tip my hat to you.

After all, why choose low IQ or speed when you can have both? Apparently it wasn't a tough decision for you. "Shader hacks don't matter if you get remotely comparable IQ".....

All Nvidia has is the (excellent performing) 6800 series at this time. ATI dominates the mainsteam $80 - $250 market.

I looked through your posts in this thread and apparently you say that the R420 sucks because you refuse to buy the "same" core a 3rd time in 2 years. Yet, rolly, you have bought 2 NV40s in at most 3 months??!?!?!???

How much does Nvidia pay you? I'd like a job, and could probably pimp Nvidia cards better than you can. And before you use your hapless, moronic ooh I bought so many ATI cards argument, your nonsense utterly biased idiotic rhetoric on various forums throughout the internet has likely swayed some hapless souls into a poor video card purchase.

:roll:

No, I don't think I'm going to spend any time digging up 5800U vs 9700P benchmarks for you Lord Tyranus.


I guess I just don't really care enough anymore whether people think the 5800U is a good card. Not like you can go out and buy them, so it's sort of a moot point?

 

[nRollo]

BFG:
You need to get a life beyond worrying so much about which video cards other people buy?

What do you care? As long as I'm not stealing them from you, I'd think it would be a non issue for you.

Yet here you are, year in year out, complaining about the cards I buy and trying like it's your life's work to prove I'm "biased" like some latter day Salem witch hunter. Pretty pathetic.

Jiffy, LT, Creig, and BFG:
I'm not going to respond to your inane "Why did you buy the 5800 when you had a 9800?" and "These benchmarks clearly show the 9700P better at high res!" questions/accusations any more.

Why?
1. I can't win the argument, so there's no point to try. You guys said I was "nVidia biased" when I was using and liking ATI cards, so it's not likely I'll convince you when I'm not.
2. I don't particularly care if you think I'm "biased".
3. I don't really care what you think about 9700Pros and 5800Us.
4. Most of all, I don't have to "defend" my purchases. Free country, my money, you don't like it, too bad. LOL