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ATG, what can you tell me about my plugs?

SSSnail

SSSnail

Lifer
They're a bit over 60K miles, just changed them out. Doesn't look like there are any concerns, just want to see if you guys can spot other things that I didn't see. Thanks.

10908283385_8b1d279eb3_b.jpg
 
They're worn out. And they're a terrible design.

That pretty much covers it. I was unaware NGK even made those; thought that quadruple-cathode silliness was a Bosch thing.
 
phucheneh said:
They're worn out. And they're a terrible design.

That pretty much covers it. I was unaware NGK even made those; thought that quadruple-cathode silliness was a Bosch thing.
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Besides looking used, they're not much different from the new ones; they're OEM for my car. Why are they terribly designed?
 
they all seem to have the same kind of wear so that's good i guess




are they supposed to be changed every 60k or you just felt like it?
 
SSSnail said:
Besides looking used, they're not much different from the new ones; they're OEM for my car. Why are they terribly designed?
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Because the 4-electrode design shields a lot of the spark.

Remember, electricity will always take the easiest path to ground, so even with 4 electrodes you only get one spark, just like a regular plug. The difference is that the three superfluous electrodes shield the spark. The horizontal spark is also more shielded even without the extra electrodes. This makes the initial flame kernel less efficient at achieving complete combustion before the exhaust stroke begins.

The multi-electrode designs are chiefly to extend service life; as one electrode wears, the spark starts jumping to one of the others. They don't help power or efficiency, they just let manufacturers advertise a longer service interval.

ZV
 
Zenmervolt said:
Because the 4-electrode design shields a lot of the spark.

Remember, electricity will always take the easiest path to ground, so even with 4 electrodes you only get one spark, just like a regular plug. The difference is that the three superfluous electrodes shield the spark. The horizontal spark is also more shielded even without the extra electrodes. This makes the initial flame kernel less efficient at achieving complete combustion before the exhaust stroke begins.

The multi-electrode designs are chiefly to extend service life; as one electrode wears, the spark starts jumping to one of the others. They don't help power or efficiency, they just let manufacturers advertise a longer service interval.

ZV
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Too bad Bosch hasn't found that out.....

...best in platinum performance over the longest service life..... creating the most powerful spark you can buy.
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Now I know there's no direct advert. for increased power or performance, but Bosch sure does imply that the plug does that. About as bad and twisted marketing as K&N.

But, yeah, horrible spark plug design. While I'll never run most Bosch products if I can help it, I'd never let those plugs within shouting distance of my vehicles....ever. I'd put OEM right back in, except those abominations.
 
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Zenmervolt said:
Because the 4-electrode design shields a lot of the spark.

Remember, electricity will always take the easiest path to ground, so even with 4 electrodes you only get one spark, just like a regular plug. The difference is that the three superfluous electrodes shield the spark. The horizontal spark is also more shielded even without the extra electrodes. This makes the initial flame kernel less efficient at achieving complete combustion before the exhaust stroke begins.

The multi-electrode designs are chiefly to extend service life; as one electrode wears, the spark starts jumping to one of the others. They don't help power or efficiency, they just let manufacturers advertise a longer service interval.

ZV
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Seems to me the electrodes and the core is almost on a plane, looks like the horizontal spark wouldn't be shielded from the other three electrodes when the spark occurs between any of the electrode.

I think the older four-prongs design would work as you described, where the electrodes would block some of the spark. These look like they've raised the core so the spark is more horizontal than at a 45 degree which was the old design trait.

739-BKR6EUP.jpg


PottedMeat said:
they all seem to have the same kind of wear so that's good i guess

are they supposed to be changed every 60k or you just felt like it?
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I changed them out just because, it's a small preventative maintenance cost.
 
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SSSnail said:
Not according to NGK's own ratings, the lifespan bar says it sucks.
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It's longer than the lifespan bar for copper plugs. Granted, it's the same as other platinum plugs, but it should still hold a gap longer since the spark should always jump to the nearest electrode even as one wears.

ZV
 
Meghan54 said:
Too bad Bosch hasn't found that out.....


Now I know there's no direct advert. for increased power or performance, but Bosch sure does imply that the plug does that. About as bad and twisted marketing as K&N.

But, yeah, horrible spark plug design. While I'll never run most Bosch products if I can help it, I'd never let those plugs within shouting distance of my vehicles....ever. I'd put OEM right back in, except those abominations.
Click to expand...

I'll agree about the Bosch Plugs. But I think you would be surprised at how many cars in the USA have Bosch Produced items in them.

Injectors, ABS Systems, O2 Sensors, Passenger Air Bag Sensors and controls ...
 
The NGK Laser Iridiums for my Accord have a 110k mile service interval and don't have a quad prong design. They just look like normal plugs.

What's the benefit of the extra prongs?

iridium_1.jpg
 
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I just did a 105k plug maintenance and they were the NGK Plat Tipped yada yada's and the originals had another 30-50k miles life remaining (all guesstimates) they looked pretty dang good!
 
Zenmervolt said:
It's longer than the lifespan bar for copper plugs. Granted, it's the same as other platinum plugs, but it should still hold a gap longer since the spark should always jump to the nearest electrode even as one wears.

ZV
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There's still only one center electrode. They obviously put some thought into its design to try to slow its wear, but I think it's like trying to fight gravity. Whether you have a prop plane or a space shuttle, the same laws of physics still apply.

If they have actually managed to mitigate the wear of the center electrode, it looks like it causes all those ground straps to take it up the butt, based on the examples of those plugs with 50-75k that I've seen.

I know you're not arguing for them; I'm just expressing that, IMO, it seems like even their one possible redeeming factor is just not there.

You know what they really make me think about? Why have a ground strap at all? I'm sure you've seen plugs with the ground totally worn away that are just arcing to the side of the plug...if there was any validity to multiple grounds, wouldn't it figure that one circular ground would do the same thing without cluttering up the combustion chamber?

Of course, I think the answer is that it's all just reinventing the wheel. A single precision gap with the best materials available is simply always going to work the best.
 
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