AT epic fail in debt discussions

[werepossum]

Agree completely with the OP, but it's not just AT, it's Washington. We only bitch, they do the things about which we bitch.

I'm for pulling out of all foreign bases, ending all foreign aid, getting the US out of the UN and the UN out of the US. Put our troops to work guarding our borders, not someone else's. Restore Clinton-era tax rates on EVERYONE, and while, we're at it, let's drop back to FY2000 budget levels too. Slap a 25% tariff on every import, including oil. (Yes, I know there will be recriminations. We import FAR more than we export.)

That would be extremely painful, but cutting off a gangrenous limb is smarter than slowly dieing while comfortably stoned on morphine.

 

[KGB]

Is it just me, or are the majority of AT a bunch of moronic fucktards? .........

Yes.

 

[Fern]

-snip-
Let's find the money, because there's LOTS of it out there.

I don't think so, or at least not near as much as you seem to imply.

Even if we raise taxes up to high end of the historical norm we're only looking at an additional $700 billion in revenue. And, of course, that's $700 of reduced demand in our economy, which should reduce GDP and tax revenues, a downward spiral of sorts which has a counter productive effect.

Next end the ongoing wars and stop supporting nations that hate us. That saves a TON of cash.

Not sure what you define as "TON of cash", but the best numbers I can find indicate around $130 billion saved by immediate 100% of cessation of Iraq and Afghanistan.

See two article etc linked in this thread. Note Obama is only budgeting $50 billion per year for future years. So, it's not clear the savings would be as high as I list above.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2181314

As for foreign aid, also don't believe that is as much as you imply. I've seen requested budgeted amounts up to about $50 billion for upcoming FY (but that includes even Global warming initiatives).

Hard data here shows 2006 total at only $23 billion.

http://www.vaughns-1-pagers.com/politics/us-foreign-aid.htm

Find the programs that the nation can do without and eliminate them.

Well, that's the trillion $ question.

Sound too simple?

Yes.

I don't see any easy solution or choices, and therefore, as a practical matter it will not be simple.

Fern

 

[Fern]

-snip-
Lets be completely honest here, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and interest on the debt consumed almost ALL of our income last year. We must raise income but we also must make meaningful cuts in Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and defense for starters. The first 3 cuts are not politically feasible for either party and will not get done.

In short, we be fucked.

Social Security, at least retirement and disability are self funding (except for a small amount in this period of high unemployment). They have a surplus $2.6 billion. medicare is also collected on paycheck, however it needs to be augmented by general Funds.

SS, and to an extent Medicare, should not be included in this General Fund deficit/debt issue because they are separate and cannot be used to balance the General Fund.

Medicaid is split between states and the General Fund (no payroll deductions). it's fair game for this issue.

Fern

 

[Fern]

-snip-
The negotiations and compromise are not based on how to achieve the goal, but on how to kick the can down the road.
-snip-

That's my impression as well.

Fern

 

[fantolay]

Many people have commented that we cannot simply cut funding to other countries. That the issue is much more complex, and our money is doing something.

Our money is doing something. It is helping cure people with aids in Africa, and providing Japan with relief.

News Flash: The people here, on our homefront, matter more than those in other countries. We can continue to support the villages infested with aids and other countries that suffer from natural disasters once we can tackle our own bills. In the meantime, we simply cannot spend money on certain things.

 

[Atreus21]

:thumbsup:

Thats the problem with the tea party position, it attempts to simplify a complex problem to a couple of simple minded talking points to appeal to the masses. They try and boil down the whole argument to "the government is an uncontrolled teenager with a credit card" and all we have to do to fix the problem is to take away the credit card.

Another oversimplification that complicates any solution is lumping the problems of deficit spending, SS and medicare funding, and economic recession all together as one problem. All of these issues effect the total national debt but they are very different problems with different required solutions and should be approached totally seperately.

Take SS for example, by design SS will have long periods of positive and negative cash flow to the SS trust fund, but overall with some minor adjustments will equal out over time and be self suficient. But since we are approaching a planned period of negative cash flow at a time when we are trying to recover from the worst recession since the great depression, and have gone through a long period of deficit spending accentuated by stimulus and bailout spending to stave off a depression, SS is is unfairly targeted as a major cause for our deficit spending which is just wrong.

Disagree in part. The problem is simple to define. We spend what we have, and borrow to spend some more. To that extent it is simple.