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The 30D and the D80 are very comparable cameras. If someone is teetering on the edge between brands, but is leaning more towards the Nikon, I would have no reservations towards recommending the Nikon, despite being a Canon user myself.
The Nikon probably has better ergonomics than the 30D, but the Canon has 5fps shooting speed over Nikon's 3fps. Both viewfinders are just as good, both can take great pictures, and both should make you happy, unless you hate the ergonomics of the Canon or hate the 3fps of the Nikon. The Canon will have better high-ISO performance. How often you use high ISOs depends on your own shooting style and equipment. I can't really answer this question for you. You need to decide for yourself if you really need that added ISO quality.
The thing with the kits are basically you're buying somewhat cheap and not as sharp lenses. I've never seen a kit lens that was acceptably sharp for me. They are really just there to add value to the kit and allow beginning photographers to start shooting immediately when they get their new camera. They are designed for economy, not image quality. To be honest, I don't really like any of the kit options, and it's really a toss-up between the Canon and Nikon kits. The Canon has IS whereas the Nikon does not, but the Nikon has a longer reach. You have to decide your own priorities.
If you go with the Nikon, consider getting just the body and seriously, seriously consider the Nikon 18-200mm. It is an incredibly sharp lens, and has VR (equivalent to Canon's IS) and SWM (equivalent to Canon's USM). It's a bit pricey, but it could become your most versatile lens. It was so popular at one time that Nikon supply couldn't keep up with demand. People were even going with Nikon JUST to be able to use this lens. Sure, it's more expensive, but if you buy any of the kits, you're going to need to buy a second lens to get to 200mm anyway, and this is far sharper than any of the kits plus has VR and SWM and is an all-in-one so you don't have to switch lenses.
All camera systems have their ups and downs, and you basically have to get the camera with the most pros for your shooting style and cons that you can live with.
I have a rebel xti with kit lens, havent been able to buy a decent lens yet. I will be going to a "drift" car event thingy tomorrow. Whats the best settings for me to use? I'm wondering if Ill be able to catch the action clearly. Cars will probably be zinging by at anywhere from 20-60 miles an hour.
GrantMeThePower
Platinum Member
- Jun 10, 2005
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Macro photography:
What are the plusses and minuses of 1. Macro lens, 2. Lens revers ring, 3. Extension tubes, 4. Closeup filters?
What are the plusses and minuses of 1. Macro lens, 2. Lens revers ring, 3. Extension tubes, 4. Closeup filters?
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AI servo focusing, 3FPS shooting, try to get your shutter speed around 1/200s but try not to sacrifice too much depth of field to do so. 1/200s and f/8 would be nearly perfect.
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1. Extension Tubes
Extension tubes are GREAT for an emergency macro or a portable/light macro setup. If you don't want to or don't have the space to or can't carry the extra weight of a dedicated macro lens, extension tubes are your answer. Also, they are great for decreasing the focusing distance of lenses. Say that your 50mm has a minimum focusing distance of 5 inches, but your subject that's behind glass is 4 inches in front of you. You could move back an inch, but then your magnification of the subject gets messed up. Just plop on a 13mm extension tube and you should now be able to focus to 4 inches.
http://fuzzybabybunny.smugmug.com/gallery/1645619
That day I totally forgot to bring my macro lens. Good thing I always have a set of lightweight extension tubes in my camera bag, so I just plopped them onto the 50mm and was good to go. A nice, light 50mm macro.
I personally use the Pro Optic Auto Extension tubes: http://www.adorama.com/MCAETEOS.html
I know people swear by Kenko, but I find it hard to justify the price of the Kenko's when there's Pro Optic (Adorama's house brand). These extension tubes do not work too well however when they're attached to a heavy lens (180mm+) and then rotated in the portrait orientation, as the metal contacts between the tubes sometimes tends to disconnect, giving your camera an error.
2. Dedicated Macro Lenses
ALL macro lenses are incredibly sharp. I seriously doubt you will be dissappointed by the sharpness of a macro lens, regardless of if it's from Sigma, Canon, or Tamron. You have to think about working distance though. A shorter focal length macro lens means you have to get closer to your subject to get that 1:1 magnification, which may disturb your subject or even anger it. A longer focal length macro lens means you have greater working distance.
Short focal lengths (~60mm, Canon 60mm): short working distance, but lighter and easily hand-holdable, meaning you can get more refined focus when you're handholding and manually focusing by moving your body back and forth until you get fine focus.
Medium focal lengths (~100mm, Canon 100mm, Tamron 90mm, Sigma 105mm): medium working distance, still pretty light and easy to hand-hold. Works great as a portrait lens too.
Longer focal lengths (~150mm+, Sigma 150mm, Sigma 180mm, Tamron 180mm): longest working distance, won't disturb your subjects. Handholding is hard because the lens is heavier, making hand shake more pronounced. Expensive. Doubles as a really sharp telephoto prime.
3. Reverse-mounted Wideangles
literally taking a wide-ish lens and mounting it in reverse on your camera body. Requires a cheap reverse mount adapter and possibly some cheap step up/down rings.
http://fuzzybabybunny.smugmug.com/gallery/1702772
Pros: Can get insane magnification, much more than 1:1. A reversed 50mm is actually a little less than 1x magnification. A reversed 30mm is about 2x magnification. A reversed 20mm is about 3x. A reversed 10mm is about 6x.
Cons: Limited aperture control. There is no electronic contact between the lens and body, so you have to stop down the lens to the desired aperture before reverse mounting. Looking through a stopped down lens means a dimmer viewfinder image and greater difficulting in determining when something's in focus. The depth of field is also razor thin. Expect a lot of attempts to get a subject in focus. Working distance is about an inch or less. It's also difficult even finding your subject in the viewfinder when you're at such high magnifications.
4. Shorter lens reverse mounted on a longer lens and then mounted on the camera
Ex. Reversed 50mm + Sigma 150mm + camera body
Will need to buy the coupler for the two lenses. Large, unwieldy, but can get great results with the right combination. Magnification is determined by the longer focal length divided by the shorter focal length, so in the above setup it would be 150mm / 50mm = 3x. I personally have no had success with this, but others have.
Search for Jody Melanson on the Fred Miranda Macro forums. He uses the above setup. He is a macro god. So is Tom Hicks.
5. Close Up Filters
Pros: Relatively cheap, hardly any loss of image quality, light, portable, can be used on my lenses, can be stacked onto existing macro setups for even more magnification, good working distance on longer lenses.
Cons: May have vignetting if you're using a 62mm filter on a lens with 77mm thread. Magnification depends on lens' minimum focusing distance. If the lens has a very long minimum focusing distance, you may not be able to get the magnification you want.
Why do people on this forum have this idea that the more focus points a camera viewfinder has, the better the camera?
I have an XT and I think it has 7. I never would need any more than that. I posses this skill where I can focus on anything with the center point, hold down the shutter button, move the camera and then shoot. The object you are trying to focus on will still be in focus unless it is way off to the side.
I have an XT and I think it has 7. I never would need any more than that. I posses this skill where I can focus on anything with the center point, hold down the shutter button, move the camera and then shoot. The object you are trying to focus on will still be in focus unless it is way off to the side.
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Say that you're trying to focus on something and want to frame the subject off-center. It's kind of a pain to have to center it, focus lock, de-center it, and then shoot the shot each time, especially if it's a tough subject and you need to repeat this movement multiple times, and especially if it causes you to miss the shot, and even more especially if you're locked into position on your tripod and ballhead. In the latter you'd have to release the ballhead, center it, focus lock, de-center it, lock the ballhead (there will be additional wobble and such depending on the size of your lens and design of your ballhead), shoot the shot, and if you need to repeat the shot, do this all over again. In this case seven or so AF points spaced intelligently so you can select the one closest to the subject and still have it be in its final framing spot would be quite convenient.
Another reason is action shots. Cameras designed for fast action and many professional cameras literally have an entire grid of AF points. It's very hard tracking objects like diving/flying birds, airplanes, hummingbirds, fast moving cars, running people, etc. with only one center AF point and still try to frame it at the same time.
1. It's hard to keep the AF point always aimed on the subject, or a specific part of the subject.
2. When the AF point leaves the subject, the focus will be changed, and will take time to lock back only to subject, and by this time you might have missed the shot.
3. You want to frame the subject a certain way but doing so would mean pulling it away from an AF point, which you can't do. You're stuck.
Of course, if your shooting style doesn't require the above, then one AF point should be sufficient. But for those who do require the above, more AF points is hardly a wasteful feature.
GrantMeThePower
Platinum Member
- Jun 10, 2005
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Thanks for all the macro info!!!! That was GREAT stuff.
What kind of magnification do you get with the extension tubes? They seem like a great option for my 50mm. Your pics looked great
What kind of magnification do you get with the extension tubes? They seem like a great option for my 50mm. Your pics looked great
I hope I'm not asking a repeat, but what is a good value point and shooty digital? I tried getting into some basic nice photography a few years ago, but the camera i bought was defective and I had to return it and then spend the refund on rent. I'm planning a trip to Ireland in a few months and currently do not own a camera. Not looking to spend much. Any favorites for photo-idiots?
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Extension tube magnification is calculated by
magnification = Extension Tube Length / Lens Focal Length
So if you put 50mm of extension tubes on a 50mm lens, you'll get 1:1 magnification. 80mm extension tubes will get you 1.6x
Thanks!
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All Nikon lenses will work on all Nikon bodies, including Sigma, Tamron, or Tokina lenses made in Nikon mounts.
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Canon S2IS or S3IS. I'd be afraid to take a 3x zoom camera on a big trip for fear of not being able to get close enough to some things.
Thanks for the info on why more focus points are better. I never thought about how much of a PITA it would be using a tripod but that is because I shot handheld 98% of the time and never have run into that problem. I have so far left the focus point in the center, get a focus lock and then pan the camera to frame the shot. Doing this handheld is faster and easier than setting the focus point however with a tripod, setting the focus point will save you 100x the time it would take to shoot multiple shots using my technique.
What tripod would you recommend for a Rebel XT/XTi with a 70-200mm zoom, taking price, weight and sturdiness into account?
fuzzybabybunny could you tell me whats the best 10mp+ point and shoot camera. need to get it for my grandma. thanks
virtuamike
Diamond Member
- Oct 13, 2000
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Woah careful on that. Some non-AI lenses can't be mounted on AI and AF bodies, and not all current Nikon DSLR bodies will meter with older AI lenses (D1 series, D2 series, and D200 only). But if we're talking just AF lenses then yah, they'll all work.
And as far as the original question, the 50/1.4 AF-D will work fine on the D80. Good lens.
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