Asians and Blacks........why the animosity?

[iamme]

My parents were small business owners in predominantly Black areas in the Detroit area for a long time. Here in Michigan MANY 1st generation Korean families establish small businesses (dry cleaners, beauty supplies, clothing, jewelry) in Black areas. I'm not sure of the economics behind it, but many of these Korean families (I'm just using Koreans as an example, since I am one) earn a very good living from these businesses...many earn six figure incomes. To Blacks, it is a given that these businesses are run by Asians.

My question is, why is there so much animosity from Blacks towards Asian business owners?

I recently had a chance to discuss this with a coworker, while I was interning at one the the Big Three auto companies. He was, obivously Black, and mentioned that alot had to do with ignorance and jealousy. I guess there was a rumour that Asians didn't have to pay for any taxes since they were minority business owners (I laughed at this so hard). He also mentioned that there was the mentality of Asians "getting rich" from Blacks, which leads to jealousy. We did concur that you had to seperate the issue of race and the issue of under educated. Many of the Blacks in the Detroit area are near the poverty line and don't have a high school education, which leads to ignorant thinking. I also believe that the ignorance is on the business owner's side to. Many believe that Blacks are always out to cheat them and steal from them. This obivously leads to tensin.

I talked with some 2nd and 3rd generation Koreans about this issue and it doesn't look promising. When I was younger, I really had a poor opinion of Black people. I would go to my parents work and see them be berated, teased, and threatened on a daily basis. My parents came to America under the assumption that there was more opportunity here and their kids would have better education. I honestly hated Blacks for what they put my parents through. My mom has had a gun pointed at her. My parents' cars have been broken into a number of times. Our store has been vandalized and broken into. They had thicker skin than I could ever develop. I've worked many years at my parent's and other relatives' stores. I've heard my share of comments and racial remarks. The one thing that most business owners have learned is that retaliation is utterly worthless. Snap back and you'll be worrying about closing the store at night. I personally know 2 fathers who were killed at their stores from either robbery or an altercation. As I've grown older, my despise turned into more of a confusion.

I'd love to hear opinions and experiences from both perspectives. I hope this doesn't turn into an igorant flame war, because I'd really love to do something about it in my area. I want to pursue the small business from my parents, but I don't want worry about hate and violence forever.....

 

[Ameesh]

it probably has to do with the fact that african americans dont own the businesses, they dont like the fact that asians are making money off of them. Its mostly ignorance and a lack of drive.

 

[Red Dawn]

<< Its mostly ignorance and a lack of drive. >>

I haven't any comment about that but I will say that from my observation as a Property Manager for 10 years in the Bay Area I was amazed by the drive and work ethic of Asian Imigrants. Even if they were given a helping hand they made the best out of it and any money used to help them get started was a good investment for America.

 

[XZeroII]

It's because the blacks you seen wanted everything, but didn't want to do anything to get it. They see Asians who are doing well and they get jelous. They wonder why Asians have things so nice and they are bums. They don't understand the concept of working harder and working smarter. Probably because they just arn't very smart. So they just complain and think everyone else is getting along just fine while they are struggling. It's just ignorance.

 

[Fausto]

<< It's because the blacks you seen wanted everything, but didn't want to do anything to get it. They see Asians who are doing well and they get jelous. They wonder why Asians have things so nice and they are bums. They don't understand the concept of working harder and working smarter. Probably because they just arn't very smart. So they just complain and think everyone else is getting along just fine while they are struggling. It's just ignorance. >>


Congratulations, you have just summed up what racist asians think about african-americans. I heard (daily) the same spewage from a Korean associate of mine. I especially liked the "not very smart" bit...very insightful.

Fausto

 

[Ameesh]

<< It's because the blacks you seen wanted everything, but didn't want to do anything to get it. They see Asians who are doing well and they get jelous. They wonder why Asians have things so nice and they are bums. They don't understand the concept of working harder and working smarter. Probably because they just arn't very smart. So they just complain and think everyone else is getting along just fine while they are struggling. It's just ignorance. >>



woah i think we are stepping in the wrong direction there.

its just a question of ambition in most cases, and it can happen to any community, Asians have agood work and family ethic, it makes them as a community successful.

 

[LuDaCriS66]

This is BS.... I don't think it has anything to do with them being Asian or Black.. why does everyone have to play the race card all the time? It doesn't have anything to do with them being Black.. have you ever thought it was just a bad area of the city?

 

[Ameesh]

<<

<< It's because the blacks you seen wanted everything, but didn't want to do anything to get it. They see Asians who are doing well and they get jelous. They wonder why Asians have things so nice and they are bums. They don't understand the concept of working harder and working smarter. Probably because they just arn't very smart. So they just complain and think everyone else is getting along just fine while they are struggling. It's just ignorance. >>


Congratulations, you have just summed up what racist asians think about african-americans. I heard (daily) the same spewage from a Korean associate of mine. I especially liked the "not very smart" bit...very insightful.

Fausto >>




Yeah i dont think you can comment on a group/community's intelligence without being somewhat prejudice. I dont want toassociate myself with that comment at all.

 

[SuperCyrix]

Haven't you people heard?
It's now ok to be black but still wrong to be asian.

 

[Dually]

It's a good question.

 

[Jimbo]

<< Congratulations, you have just summed up what racist asians think about african-americans. I heard (daily) the same spewage from a Korean associate of mine. I especially liked the "not very smart" bit...very insightful. >>


It?s probably not as ?insightful? as you would want to make it out to be. Sure, racists exist all over the ethnic spectrum. However, I saw his comment more along the lines that the predominant ?ghetto? think precludes the possibility that success is result of hard work. Many people see ?outsiders? or those of different ethnic backgrounds than themselves as taking away what they consider theirs when others are successful. Also there is a pervasive belief in the black community that they are owed something for past injustices. So when they see others that are not black (but in their community) making a good living they assume that it is because of some form of racism that helps others and leaves them behind. There is also much less of a work ethic in these communities (as a whole) due to the lack of experience in the job market. This also goes back to differences in perceived value of education. If you never studied, never went to school on a regular basis and never had pressure from your parents to excel academically, then these factors become more pronounced later in life because you are not as marketable of an employee and tend only to get hired doing menial and dead-end jobs that increase the level of frustration and resentment even further when viewing the success of others.

 

[Nitemare]

in my opinion

Blacks feel envy and greed that another minority is succeeding as well as resentment for Asians thinking they are better than Blacks

Asians feel intimidated because Blacks tend to be larger physically(ok 99% of Blacks are larger than Asians) and that Blacks are alot more out going(not reserved like the Asians) plus they will speak their mind sometimes in an unpleasant manner(whereas the typical Asian does not like to make waves). Personally I think Blacks sense this and it fuels the fire.

 

[iamme]

<< This is BS.... I don't think it has anything to do with them being Asian or Black.. why does everyone have to play the race card all the time? It doesn't have anything to do with them being Black.. have you ever thought it was just a bad area of the city? >>



If it's just that it's a bad part of the city, why don't black owned businesses suffer from the same tension? There's obviously a racial issue here. I'm just wondering what the opposing viewpoints are. Talking to my Black coworker about some of his thoughts was really a eye opening experience.

 

[mithrandir2001]

From my own experience living in a community that is 97% white (meaning, limited), Asians don't seem to like Blacks because of the huge canyon in education goals. Unfortunately, I'll have to degrade to stereotyping, but it seems Asian parents drive their kids into the ground studying, learing and getting ahead, whereas Black kids often don't have a solid family foundation that can push them to success. I suppose this is where the comments about ambition and drive come from.

 

[PlatinumGold]

It's all cause of spike lee and some of his earlier movies.

here is a scenario, local grocery store owner, employees about 5 neighborhood kids to do various tasks. he sells to korean, korean fires all the kids, brings relatives over from korea and relatives do all the work. does he have this right? yes. does it foster ill will w/ neighbors? yes.

there you have it.

 

[Unsickle]

Welcome to Atlanta.

 

[Laguna]

That, and typical Asian American parents are prone to sacrificing everything for their kid's education. And by everything, I mean EVERY possible thing.

 

[toant103]

I can relate to this. Left Vietnam when I was 5 on a BOAT with my dad but he was left behind. That's right, i'm an FOB. So now my uncle in law have to take care of me on the boat. It took us 13 days to reach
an Island in the philippines. But before that, we ran out of food and water for 6 days. Many people died, include my uncle son. He died when we saw land.
We stay in the philippines for a year then went to America. We didn't know anyone here. WE don't have much. Our apartment have 6 people with 2 bedroom in it.
NO AC. It was bad but we're used to the hot weather in Vietnam. My uncle first job is a cleaner. Clean office building, bathroom. Stuff like that. Then he became a carpenter, Janitor........
5 years ago, he work for a bakery company delivering bread. He's still working at the bakery company. He work from 9PM till 2PM 6 days a week. HE manage to save money to send
back to Vietnam and save some also. Just 2 months ago, he just bought a brand new house for $320k. Being build right now. I don't know how he manage to save that much
money to down payment the house but he did. I guess asian people work harder because they see oppertunity here in the state.

 

[abc]

i didn't read everybody's post that appeared as I wrote this but,

iamme, you ask why do blacks have animosity towards Asians -business owners that is, but there's a general theme: Black animosity towards Asians period.

But, it goes the other way as well: Asian animosity towards Blacks.

But, it's the general TYPE of animosity that differs, in my opinion, and IMHO it's significant to shed light on.

I believe if you place 100 random Asians in a room and then ask them, if you have ill feelings toward Blacks, HOW did this come about? And I believe the responses would generally lean towards such things as: some have harrassed me, mocked me, friends, family, threatened us, all out of the blue any given day.

Conversely if you place 100 random Blacks into a room and then ask them if you have ill feelings towards Asians, HOW did this come about? IMHO their responses would NOT be because they harrass me, mock me, my friends, family, threaten us, all out of the blue any given day.

I'm sorry you had to experience those things that you wrote, that sucks big time. for me, when i see people minding their own matters, obeying the law, then leave them the hell alone. Life will bring enough problems naturally, i hate seeing/hearing people who mind their own business and go about their lives without criminally harming anybody GET harmed by schmucks.


In all, it's a tough call, but in my life experiences, people who are in position to have some opportunities in life, have gone farther in education, read the newspapers, have households where there's mom and dad with somewhat stable jobs and lives, and a network of friends who are similar, don't turn out being lowlife thugs where they live day to day and their 'world' scales only to their neighborhood, rather than say those of us who care to see what's on CNN, the financial markets, politics, social security... etc.

Again, tough call and i haven't worded it too well.

And as hard and as much as America suggests we are 1, it is hard when you grow up and have to experience certain things which mold you a certain way, but on the other hand every next person you meet is NOT the person that gave you a bad experience, I always try to keep that in mind.

What other country besides US has had to deal with so many different ethnicities though.
If you go to Germany hey it's pretty much all Germans, if you go to Japan like I came back from hey it's pretty much all Japanese, I wonder why they have a cemetary called "Foreigners Cemetary"?

As far apart as we seem to be in US, we're probably closer together than if other countries had to handle multi ethnicities.

 

[Fausto]

<< Welcome to Atlanta >>


That is so very, very true. EVERYTHING is a race issue here. This is compounded by the fact that we have a rather unique power structure here....many members of city government are black, most of the money is white and concentrated on the north end of town, toss in a huge hispanic/asian/other population and you've got chaos. It didn't help that we had a mayor (Bill Campbell) who would scream "racism!!" whenever criticized.

But back to the thread, I'm kinda stumped by this issue. The one bit I've never understood is that if both groups are minorities (specifically: neither group is able to actively repress or discriminate against the other by throwing weight around politically or otherwise) why bother hating each other so vehemently? Surely it has to run deeper than just "envy of success in business ownership" and "distain for those who can't/won't help themselves"? (That's a semi-glib summation of feelings on both sides by the way...not my own personal feelings.)

Fausto

 

[gopunk]

there most certainly is black animosity towards asians... in my entire life, the few times i have ever been called racist names is by black people. well, what are considered racist names at least... i still don't get why "chinaman" is offensive. i think it's because they're jealous.

 

[gopunk]

But back to the thread, I'm kinda stumped by this issue. The one bit I've never understood is that if both groups are minorities (specifically: neither group is able to actively repress or discriminate against the other by throwing weight around politically or otherwise) why bother hating each other so vehemently? Surely it has to run deeper than just "envy of success in business ownership" and "distain for those who can't/won't help themselves"? (That's a semi-glib summation of feelings on both sides by the way...not my own personal feelings.)

i really don't think asians hate blacks... some asians might not like blacks, and even discriminate against them, but i don't think there is any hate. you will almost never see an asian person calling blacks some racial slur, or trying to lynch them or something.

note: by asian, i mean the larger country ones... china, japan, korea, etc...

 

[Fausto]

<< i really don't think asians hate blacks... some asians might not like blacks, and even discriminate against them, but i don't think there is any hate. you will almost never see an asian person calling blacks some racial slur, or trying to lynch them or something. >>


Well, ok..but I wasn't getting at the definition of how they feel....more why they feel that way and vice versa. Again, I don't know....I'm just hoping someone could shed some light on the matter. I mean it's easy to see where the animosity between blacks and whites started, but the asian/black thing eludes me (maybe because I'm neither?)

fausto

 

[MoMeanMugs]

It makes ya wonder what Tiger Woods would do if a fight broke out.

 

[iamme]

If I had to guess, I would think it always boils down to money. I think that the Blacks in poorer areas are under the impression that every Asian business owner makes a ton of money from poor Black neighborhoods. I think the misunderstanding is that many of these Asians come to America with not much in their pockets. My parents literally came with $250 in their pockets and then worked 70-80 hours per week. My parents had a high school education when they came.

When an irrate customer would begin with the racial slurs and comments, I always want to blurt out, "If you hate Asians so much, why not have some f***ing integrity and shop elsewhere?!?!" Of course, that's just my anger speaking. I always wonder, couldn't some Black guy capitalize with a chain of "Black Owned" stores? I've seen like 1 or 2 being advertised. If I were a Black guy with an entrepenurial spirit, I think I could really cash in on that. Does it boil down to lack of work ethics and drive, then?