I keep hearing . . . "Arnold fits my views" . . . but his campaign has been anything but explicit . . . well his sex stories are explicit. I did not read his WSJ piece. Granted, we all know Arnold didn't write it. Regardless, California is better served by a conservative (and informed) governor than Arnold. Schwarzenegger will either be an uninformed figurehead where unelected handlers control policy (ala Bush regime) or he gets manhandled by the unwieldy CA legislature. Neither scenario is in the best interests of CA.
*Arnold interrupts Arianna*
Arianna: "Let me finish, let me finish, let me finish... now we know how arnold treats women..."
*Audience laffs*
Moderator says that comment was a personal attack so he gives Arnold a chance for direct response.
Arnold: "I have the perfect part for you in terminator 4..."
Arianna: "Let me finish, let me finish, let me finish... now we know how arnold treats women..."
*Audience laffs*
Moderator says that comment was a personal attack so he gives Arnold a chance for direct response.
Arnold: "I have the perfect part for you in terminator 4..."
GoodRevrnd
Diamond Member
- Dec 27, 2001
- 6,801
- 581
- 126
Actually, the audience booed her.
I'd say McClintock was the clear winner to the debate. I agree with him on pretty much everything, but he was really screwing himself over with that pro-life comment at the end and it added absolutely nothing. The Republican party as a whole would dominate the country if they'd just drop the Bible-thumping BS.
Arnold... He was okay, I strongly believe he will act more conservatively than he spoke, he's just being a little wishy washy to pander to a wider audience (as Aryianna pointed out). However if you've been watching him up until this point, he really doesn't differ from McClintock on the main campaign issues AT ALL.
Camejo spoke well... better than everyone but McClintock I'd say, but it's obvious how he stands on the issues (and he doesn't hide it) so the whole socialism thing is just a joke.
Bustamante was seriously a joke. The guy is a total wuss, didn't have a strong opinion on anything, and even had a rolling-eyes Al Gore approach to responding to the other candidates. For those of you (not necessarily in this thread) who cry 'puppet' about Arnold, I think Bustamante reigns eternal king in the puppet category. I could pull a more eloquent gubernatorial candidate out of my ass. And Tough Love Plan for California? Over my dead body. This guy is worse than Davis.
And finally the delightful Aryianna. To whomever was requesting it, I think I got some spare staple guns you can borrow. She was also a joke, as always. We're campaigning for California here, not against Bush and Wilson. Let's try to stay on topic.
GoodRevrnd
Diamond Member
- Dec 27, 2001
- 6,801
- 581
- 126
Kadarin
Lifer
- Nov 23, 2001
- 44,296
- 16
- 81
I didn't expect Arnold to waffle on the illegal alien issue, but he did, and I'm disappointed. I liked McClintock's position there, but otherwise consider him too conservative. Camejo's a little out of touch with reality, Arianna is a windbag without a coherent plan, and Bustamante is slimier than, well, a can of slime.
So who to vote for? I think Arnold's problem is that he hasn't had a lot of time at this, so his positions on the various issues really aren't well defined, and that hurts him. But I think that he's a good guy who means well, and he would be a better choice than Bustamante.
Shrug.. have to think about it..
So who to vote for? I think Arnold's problem is that he hasn't had a lot of time at this, so his positions on the various issues really aren't well defined, and that hurts him. But I think that he's a good guy who means well, and he would be a better choice than Bustamante.
Shrug.. have to think about it..
I personally thought Camejo had nothing important to say, both he and Huffington seemed to worry more about national issues than California...and aside from that, Huffington seemed pleased just to throw mud all over the place. I really was impressed by Mcclintock, and dissapointed with Arnold's performance...still a little too big on "one liners" and generalities for me. As of now, I'd vote for Mcclintock, but I don't know what I'll do if he pulls out due to GOP pressure.
i have posted my opinions on the canadiates in my other posts. his views are closest to mine and that's why i support him. i believe my statements on the canadiates are correct. did you even watch the debate to see why i labeled camejo as a hippie? bustamonte isn't offering much different from gray davis, arianna did attack bustamonte and arnold. Arnold has never been crystal clear in his policies and i didn't expect him to.
Whats your point? I'm not a fan of Bush nor am I fan of Davis. But the major difference is that the federal budget can carry a deficit while the state cannot. Meaning Bush can get away w/ it w/o cutting services or increasing taxes, while that can't be said for California. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying either deficit is good, but politically you can get away w/ one over the other.
Republican, Democrat. I really don't give a fsck.
HeroOfPellinor
Lifer
- Dec 27, 2001
- 11,272
- 1
- 0
There's a reason why. Cause they're raving loonies!
"Latinos pay a higher tax rate in California"
*boggle*
Really, Pete?
camejo kept saying that the tax rate is lower for rich people than it is for the poor people. given that he is a financial analyst, he should know that we have a progressive tax rate here in the US. it's funny that he spouts outright lies and people dont really give a sh-t.
If I lived out there I would vote for McClintock. He was the clear winner IMO. It wasn't even close. He was head and shoulders above Arnold (and everyone else). Anyone that votes for Arnold is not serious about government, they are voting for a celebrity, they think it would be cool to have "the terminator" as governor.
This attitude is just mind boggling to me. Why do some of you think we should *reward* people who come here illegally? It makes no sense. It's not that hard to become a citizen here. Rewarding the cheats just encourages more cheats, and devalues real immigrants.
The illegal mexicans in our country are sending up to $7 Billion back home this year while using about billions more in state services like education, welfare and health care. Yeah, let's encourage more of that.
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,795
- 84
- 91
Originally posted by: alphatarget1
yes that was funny
its also very empty of substance. which was rather dissapointing. arnolds statements were mostly like this.
mclintoh is a moron like simon, conservatives that are too extreme and make their party lose. he wont step aside for arnold for the good of his party.
i'm still no on recall, the recall is a circus that should not have happened.
then again i can't stand bustamante. grr
f*ck indian gambling with their racist business rights, and pandering to illegals. you don't reward law breaking, a guest worker program would work. you don't see the illegal immigrant advocates pushing for open boarders for all immigrants around the world who would gladly come to california do you. only south of the border, its a rather racist and unfair agenda.
I think that the debate was a weird combination between CNN crossfire and comedy central.
Arnold seems sincere but to me very scripted. You just knew he had the one-liners ready. He had some generalities but not much else. Mumbled here and there and all of that. I got from the debate that he loves jobs, children and California. In the post debate interview he talked about tv rating and all of that as the reason he was only doing one debate (?) I just don't think he is ready or qualified or knowledgeable enough to run California.
Arianna ripped both Arnold and Cruz Bustamante. She is actually a great debater with some nice sound bites but I think is becoming shrill in her attacks on Bush. I still cannot get over her transformation from an arch-conservative commentator to a neo-progressive reformer. It's weird to hear what is coming out of her mouth.
Camejo is an alternative voice in the race. I am glad that he is raising issues that the two parties don't talk about. However, I will never vote for a green candidate because of Nader and because some of their views are too liberal.
Cruz was very passive and somewhat condescending (ok Arnold, ok Arnold ... you probably don't know this but ...). It is weird because his handlers are making the decision not to engage the other candidates. He did not take post-debate questions/spin. They may think that the democrats (~43percent) will eventually consolidate around him. I dunno, the race is too close for him to be this passive or they may want to remain above the fray. I think it is a mistake. I don't think he has run a good campaign but it is too soon to tell.
McClintock. I respect him for being honest about his views and beliefs. I don't agree with him on most social issues but I think that he is mostly right fiscally. His budget cuts will be severe and I don't think gov't reforms and contracting out will solve the issues. It is a mixture of too much spending and not enough revenues coming in.
I won't vote for him but he definitely helped himself and his party. He also made the decision not to attack Arnold which shows he doesn't want to actively spoil the race for Arnold. I respect the man but when he looks crossed-eyed at the camera ... well I am petty and shallow ... it is slightly disconcerting.
I truly think the winner of this debate was Gray Davis. All this sniping and attacking is not helping the candidates. I think it will reenforce the decisions of those that have already decided on who they wanted to vote for. No one can win decisively in a 5 person debate. Everyone just looks petty by associate when the attacks or jokes fly.
Everyone says that Cruz and Arnold are the front-runners. Well, I look at it this way.
53% of the respondents of a Public Policy Institute poll are for the recall. Gray Davis is 3% behind. If he can bridge that gap, and bring that down 4% by election, he would survive. Put it another way, he needs to move 10% in 2 weeks as he only has 40% solidly "no". I dunno, it could happen.
Two wildcard I think in all of this is ... 1). Indian gaming interest. Arnold has attacked Cruz (and to a lesser extent McClintock) on this campaign issue but for some bizzare reason has singled out the very powerful Indian gaming interests (instead of just saying special interests). I think the Indian interests will flood the airwaves in the next two weeks with a lot of mostly negative ads in response from the right and from the left probably.
2). The large influx of newly registered voters. Lots come from San Diego. Lots from the Bay Area and LA. We don't know how they will vote, who is most motivated to vote and their opinions won't be know until election deal because they won't necessarily be sampled by poll takers as they are "not likely voters."
Last thing for sure, this is a political junkie?s SuperBowl!
Arnold seems sincere but to me very scripted. You just knew he had the one-liners ready. He had some generalities but not much else. Mumbled here and there and all of that. I got from the debate that he loves jobs, children and California. In the post debate interview he talked about tv rating and all of that as the reason he was only doing one debate (?) I just don't think he is ready or qualified or knowledgeable enough to run California.
Arianna ripped both Arnold and Cruz Bustamante. She is actually a great debater with some nice sound bites but I think is becoming shrill in her attacks on Bush. I still cannot get over her transformation from an arch-conservative commentator to a neo-progressive reformer. It's weird to hear what is coming out of her mouth.
Camejo is an alternative voice in the race. I am glad that he is raising issues that the two parties don't talk about. However, I will never vote for a green candidate because of Nader and because some of their views are too liberal.
Cruz was very passive and somewhat condescending (ok Arnold, ok Arnold ... you probably don't know this but ...). It is weird because his handlers are making the decision not to engage the other candidates. He did not take post-debate questions/spin. They may think that the democrats (~43percent) will eventually consolidate around him. I dunno, the race is too close for him to be this passive or they may want to remain above the fray. I think it is a mistake. I don't think he has run a good campaign but it is too soon to tell.
McClintock. I respect him for being honest about his views and beliefs. I don't agree with him on most social issues but I think that he is mostly right fiscally. His budget cuts will be severe and I don't think gov't reforms and contracting out will solve the issues. It is a mixture of too much spending and not enough revenues coming in.
I won't vote for him but he definitely helped himself and his party. He also made the decision not to attack Arnold which shows he doesn't want to actively spoil the race for Arnold. I respect the man but when he looks crossed-eyed at the camera ... well I am petty and shallow ... it is slightly disconcerting.
I truly think the winner of this debate was Gray Davis. All this sniping and attacking is not helping the candidates. I think it will reenforce the decisions of those that have already decided on who they wanted to vote for. No one can win decisively in a 5 person debate. Everyone just looks petty by associate when the attacks or jokes fly.
Everyone says that Cruz and Arnold are the front-runners. Well, I look at it this way.
53% of the respondents of a Public Policy Institute poll are for the recall. Gray Davis is 3% behind. If he can bridge that gap, and bring that down 4% by election, he would survive. Put it another way, he needs to move 10% in 2 weeks as he only has 40% solidly "no". I dunno, it could happen.
Two wildcard I think in all of this is ... 1). Indian gaming interest. Arnold has attacked Cruz (and to a lesser extent McClintock) on this campaign issue but for some bizzare reason has singled out the very powerful Indian gaming interests (instead of just saying special interests). I think the Indian interests will flood the airwaves in the next two weeks with a lot of mostly negative ads in response from the right and from the left probably.
2). The large influx of newly registered voters. Lots come from San Diego. Lots from the Bay Area and LA. We don't know how they will vote, who is most motivated to vote and their opinions won't be know until election deal because they won't necessarily be sampled by poll takers as they are "not likely voters."
Last thing for sure, this is a political junkie?s SuperBowl!
HeroOfPellinor
Lifer
- Dec 27, 2001
- 11,272
- 1
- 0
Arnold lacks experience and knowledge on specifics and would be a tenth the governor McClintock would be. BUT, his philosphy and ideals are sound enough that, provided with accurate info, he'll probably make the right decisions. This is opposed to Davis who willfully and maliciously makes decisions that are BAD for California and Californians. Before the recall you never heard any Democrat use the two words "worker's" and "comp" in the same sentence. I saw on the news this morning that 51% of businesses in California have been offered incentives to move out of state and many are. MANY more will next year when their WCI rates increase anywhere from 20% - 100%.
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