• We should now be fully online following an overnight outage. Apologies for any inconvenience, we do not expect there to be any further issues.

Army deploying new 25mm rifle, the XM25

SAWYER

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,742
42
91
xm25.jpg


For once it seems the Army is actually turning fiction into science.

After nearly a decade in the shadows -- with billions spent on earlier versions long since abandoned -- the Army is moving quickly to field a revolutionary new weapon to Joes a lot sooner than anyone had ever imagined.

It's a weapon that can take out a bad guy behind a wall, beyond a hill or below a trench, and do it more accurately and with less collateral damage than anything on the battlefield today, officials say. It's called the XM25 Individual Air Burst Weapon, and by next month the service will have three prototypes of the precision-guided 25mm rifle ready for testing.

"We've done a lot of testing with this, and what we're seeing is the estimated increase in effectiveness is six times what we'd be getting with a 5.56mm carbine or a grenade launcher," said Rich Audette, Army Deputy Project Manager for Soldier weapons.

"What we're talking about is a true 'leap ahead' in lethality, here. This is a huge step," Audette added during a phone interview with Military.com from his office at Picatinny Arsenal in New Jersey.

Born of the much-maligned and highly-controversial Objective Individual Combat Weapon -- a 1990s program that sought a "leap ahead" battle rifle that combined a counter-defilade weapon with a carbine -- the XM25 only recently gained new momentum after the Army formalized a requirement and released a contract in June for a series of test weapons.

Current infantry weapons can shoot at or through an obstacle concealing enemy threats, but the Army has been trying for years to come up with a weapon for engaging targets behind barriers without resorting to mortars, rockets or grenades -- all of which risk greater collateral damage. After fits and starts using a 20mm rifle housed in a bulky, overweight, complicated shell, technology finally caught up to shave the XM25 from 21 pounds to a little more than 12 pounds.

If the XM25 does what its developers hope, it will be able to fire an air-bursting round at a target from 16 meters away out to 600 meters with a highly accurate, 360-degree explosive radius.

The XM25 is about as long as a collapsed M4, weighs about as much as an M16 with an M203 grenade launcher attached and has about as much kick as a 12-gauge shotgun, said Barb Muldowney, Army deputy program manager for infantry combat weapons.

The semi-auto XM25 comes with a four-round magazine, though testers are looking at whether to increase the capacity to as much as 10 rounds.

Brains are what really makes this Buck Rogers gun work -- it has them. The weapon combines a thermal optic, day-sight, laser range finder, compass and IR illuminator with a fire-control system that wirelessly transmits the exact range of the target into the 25mm round's fuse before firing.

A Soldier can aim the XM25 at a wall concealing a sniper, for example, but "dial in" or adjust the distance by an additional meter above the target. When fired, the Alliant Teksystems-built round will explode above the enemy's position, essentially going around the obstruction, Muldowney said.

"It's so accurate, that when I laze to that target I'm going to be able to explode that round close enough that I'm going to get it," Audette added.

The service hopes to field several types of 25mm rounds for the XM25 -- for breaching doors, piercing armor, even non-lethal air burst and impact rounds, and an anti-personnel round.

Testers at Picatinny plan to put the XM25 through its paces over the next several months, certifying it as safe for a Soldier to operate and tinkering with the weapon's effectiveness and durability.

The weapon costs about $25,000 each, but experts were quick to point out that a fully-loaded M4 for optics and pointers costs pretty close to $30,000. Each ATK-made 25mm round costs about $25.

As Heckler and Koch, makers of the weapon itself, and L3 Communications -- which makes the fire control system -- crank out more weapons, the Army plans to push them out to the field for testing beginning in March 2009. That could include the first use of such a weapon in combat, Cline said.

If all goes according to plan, Soldiers might have their first XM25s in hand by 2014, far sooner than the Army's small arms community had predicted even last year.

The program "came very close to ending," Audette explained. "But the Army took a look at all the work that was done -- and the testing that projected the kind of lethality increase that we could get -- and they said 'we've got to do this.' "
 

Schadenfroh

Elite Member
Mar 8, 2003
38,416
4
0
This gun is manufactured by Heckler and Koch, a German firearms manufacturer.

Where is the rage that we experienced when the Air Force selected the NG / EADS tanker over Boeing?
 

SunnyD

Belgian Waffler
Jan 2, 2001
32,675
146
106
www.neftastic.com
Brains are what really makes this Buck Rogers gun work -- it has them. The weapon combines a thermal optic, day-sight, laser range finder, compass and IR illuminator with a fire-control system that wirelessly transmits the exact range of the target into the 25mm round's fuse before firing.

New, on the black market... wirelessly "hack" your infidel oppressor's weapons and make all their rounds explode in their face before they can shoot you.

Seriously, if the US Military sees fit to leave the video channels on predator drones unencrypted, is this kind of technology REALLY a good idea?
 

vbuggy

Golden Member
Nov 13, 2005
1,610
0
71
New, on the black market... wirelessly "hack" your infidel oppressor's weapons and make all their rounds explode in their face before they can shoot you.

All you really need is a catapult and a tin of paint...
 

JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
12,035
1,134
126
Great, we spent BILLIONS on this?

It's a game changer. I played on an America's Army beta server with this weapon a while back and it broke the game. There was no hiding from it and getting into a fire fight. You fire from a window, they lase the wall add 1 foot to the range and fire. The round flies through the window and kills you. You hide around a corner and fire, the lase the corner and add a foot, it flies past the corner and explodes. You hide behind a car, you get the idea. The game had a targeting system so you could aim the arc well but it was fast enough that it wasn't like lobbing a grenade. Not sure how it works in real life.
Not sure what range they have on it but it'll probably be in the range of a few hundred yards.

New, on the black market... wirelessly "hack" your infidel oppressor's weapons and make all their rounds explode in their face before they can shoot you.

Seriously, if the US Military sees fit to leave the video channels on predator drones unencrypted, is this kind of technology REALLY a good idea?

There shouldn't be anything to hack. The gun sets the fuze on the grenade in-bore. It's just a timing fuze not a command detonate.
 
Last edited:

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,402
8,574
126
This gun is manufactured by Heckler and Koch, a German firearms manufacturer.

Where is the rage that we experienced when the Air Force selected the NG / EADS tanker over Boeing?
did the army change requirements to favor h&k's weapon at the end of the bidding process?
 

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
432
126
It's a game changer. I played on an America's Army beta server with this weapon a while back and it broke the game. There was no hiding from it and getting into a fire fight. You fire from a window, they lase the wall add 1 foot to the range and fire. The round flies through the window and kills you. You hide around a corner and fire, the lase the corner and add a foot, it flies past the corner and explodes. You hide behind a car, you get the idea. The game had a targeting system so you could aim the arc well but it was fast enough that it wasn't like lobbing a grenade. Not sure how it works in real life.

It's rather awesome and awfully smart to use a video game to do your strategy and scenario testing.
 

techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
28,559
4
0
I thought the number one threat was from terrorists?
Will it stop a shoe bomber from bringing down a plane?
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,935
3,914
136
did the army change requirements to favor h&k's weapon at the end of the bidding process?

So you think it's OK to spend our tax dollars on foreign socialist European companies when there are many perfectly good domestic options? Why do you hate America?

:p
 

dud

Diamond Member
Feb 18, 2001
7,635
73
91
"... the Army plans to push them out to the field for testing beginning in March 2009."

OP, where have you been? This story was released LONG ago ... as in this is old news.


The latest (from PEO Soldier) is The program is fully funded and currently in testing and development with limited production expected in 2012. Currently, the gun can fire high explosive (air bursting), armor piercing and trainng rounds. Future ammunition will include less-than-lethal (blunt round), less-than-lethal (ariburst) and door breaching.
 

BladeVenom

Lifer
Jun 2, 2005
13,365
16
0
The weapon costs about $25,000 each, but experts were quick to point out that a fully-loaded M4 for optics and pointers costs pretty close to $30,000.
WTF? The military is paying $30k for their M4s? How does that add up? Good holographic sites are only a few hundred bucks.
 

scott916

Platinum Member
Mar 2, 2005
2,906
0
71
WTF? The military is paying $30k for their M4s? How does that add up? Good holographic sites are only a few hundred bucks.

It's either the 500 dollar hammer theory or just that the level of optics/nv on a weapon like that could be extremely sophisticated and expensive. :hmm:
 

Gibsons

Lifer
Aug 14, 2001
12,530
35
91
A little more recent
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/10/15/xm25_and_exacto/

It's all go in the world of futuristic Judge Dredd style guns today. Reports suggest that a battalion of US airmobile* troops in Afghanistan are to be equipped with the XM-25 computing smart-rifle, able to strike enemies hiding round corners or in trenches. A successful "proof of concept" of a guided homing bullet for use in sniper rifles has also been announced.

First up is the XM-25, which we've covered on these pages before. The Soldier Systems blog quotes Colonel Doug Tamilio of the US Army's personal-kit office as stating that a battalion of the 101st Airborne* will receive the new weapon starting next month.

etc etc
 

Turin39789

Lifer
Nov 21, 2000
12,218
8
81
And setting the detonator to 1µs after launch wouldn't be a BAD thing? Seriously! Common sense... use it.

I think the point is that the gun doesn't wirelessly communicate with the round. I can't think of any other reason for the gun to have wireless capabilities, so how are your hackers going to be able to
wirelessly "hack" your infidel oppressor's weapons and make all their rounds explode in their face before they can shoot you.
?
 
Feb 24, 2001
14,513
4
81
WTF? The military is paying $30k for their M4s? How does that add up? Good holographic sites are only a few hundred bucks.

That has to include every possible kit add on.

A Colt M4 with case, cleaning kit and mags is just under $700 contract price. Even adding thermals and PVS gear would only be $15k.
 

Kadarin

Lifer
Nov 23, 2001
44,296
16
81
It's rather awesome and awfully smart to use a video game to do your strategy and scenario testing.

It certainly can be. If the scenarios and physics are accurate enough, at some point it ceases to be a video game and becomes more a full combat simulator.
 

SunnyD

Belgian Waffler
Jan 2, 2001
32,675
146
106
www.neftastic.com
I think the point is that the gun doesn't wirelessly communicate with the round. I can't think of any other reason for the gun to have wireless capabilities, so how are your hackers going to be able to

?

Read much?

Brains are what really makes this Buck Rogers gun work -- it has them. The weapon combines a thermal optic, day-sight, laser range finder, compass and IR illuminator with a fire-control system that wirelessly transmits the exact range of the target into the 25mm round's fuse before firing.
 

qliveur

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2007
4,090
74
91
SunnyD has a point. If that shit could be hacked, and, honestly, what can't, the enemy could set the round to go off as soon as it exited the barrel.