Army combat brigade deployed on American soil

[scttgrd]

It seems the government has a plan to keep us all under control when the next emergency happens. The army will be deployed to keep us obedient, at least they aren't sicking Blackwater on us, yet.

By Gina Cavallaro - Staff writer
Posted : Monday Sep 8, 2008 6:15:06 EDT

The 3rd Infantry Division?s 1st Brigade Combat Team has spent 35 of the last 60 months in Iraq patrolling in full battle rattle, helping restore essential services and escorting supply convoys. Now they?re training for the same mission ? with a twist ? at home.

Beginning Oct. 1 for 12 months, the 1st BCT will be under the day-to-day control of U.S. Army North, the Army service component of Northern Command, as an on-call federal response force for natural or manmade emergencies and disasters, including terrorist

<snip>

...They may be called upon to help with civil unrest and crowd control or to deal with potentially horrific scenarios such as massive poisoning and chaos in response to a chemical, biological, radiological, nuclear or high-yield explosive, or CBRNE, attack.

...The 1st BCT?s soldiers also will learn how to use ?the first ever nonlethal package that the Army has fielded,? 1st BCT commander Col. Roger Cloutier said, referring to crowd and traffic control equipment and nonlethal weapons designed to subdue unruly or dangerous individuals without killing them.

?It?s a new modular package of nonlethal capabilities that they?re fielding. They?ve been using pieces of it in Iraq, but this is the first time that these modules were consolidated and this package fielded, and because of this mission we?re undertaking we were the first to get it.?

The package includes equipment to stand up a hasty road block; spike strips for slowing, stopping or controlling traffic; shields and batons; and, beanbag bullets.

I might be crazy but I thought this was against the law, is there anything the current administration wont do to have it there way. I never thought I would live to see the day that the financial system is in danger of collapse, and the army being used against American citizens. Unbelieveable.

 

[sonambulo]

Source?

 

[ProfJohn]

The source is a mainstream newspaper. Read it myself last week.

He snipped out the main reason for this though. The main reason is to have some troops ready for any natural disasters.

Let's say there is a major earthquake in Cali next week. This unit could quickly be moved into the area to assist with security and food distribution etc. Under the old system there were no units sitting at the ready in case of emergency.

BTW active duty military units were used in NO after Katrina so this is not without precedence.

 

[scttgrd]

Besides the fact that it illegal to deploy federal troops on US soil, those things are the job of the national guard.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

The source is a mainstream newspaper. Read it myself last week.

He snipped out the main reason for this though. The main reason is to have some troops ready for any natural disasters.

Source = Army Times. Full text:

Brigade homeland tours start Oct. 1

3rd Infantry?s 1st BCT trains for a new dwell-time mission. Helping ?people at home? may become a permanent part of the active Army
By Gina Cavallaro - Staff writer
Posted : Monday Sep 8, 2008 6:15:06 EDT

The 3rd Infantry Division?s 1st Brigade Combat Team has spent 35 of the last 60 months in Iraq patrolling in full battle rattle, helping restore essential services and escorting supply convoys.

Now they?re training for the same mission ? with a twist ? at home.

Beginning Oct. 1 for 12 months, the 1st BCT will be under the day-to-day control of U.S. Army North, the Army service component of Northern Command, as an on-call federal response force for natural or manmade emergencies and disasters, including terrorist attacks.

It is not the first time an active-duty unit has been tapped to help at home. In August 2005, for example, when Hurricane Katrina unleashed hell in Mississippi and Louisiana, several active-duty units were pulled from various posts and mobilized to those areas.

But this new mission marks the first time an active unit has been given a dedicated assignment to NorthCom, a joint command established in 2002 to provide command and control for federal homeland defense efforts and coordinate defense support of civil authorities.

After 1st BCT finishes its dwell-time mission, expectations are that another, as yet unnamed, active-duty brigade will take over and that the mission will be a permanent one.

?Right now, the response force requirement will be an enduring mission. How the [Defense Department] chooses to source that and whether or not they continue to assign them to NorthCom, that could change in the future,? said Army Col. Louis Vogler, chief of NorthCom future operations. ?Now, the plan is to assign a force every year.?

The command is at Peterson Air Force Base in Colorado Springs, Colo., but the soldiers with 1st BCT, who returned in April after 15 months in Iraq, will operate out of their home post at Fort Stewart, Ga., where they?ll be able to go to school, spend time with their families and train for their new homeland mission as well as the counterinsurgency mission in the war zones.

Stop-loss will not be in effect, so soldiers will be able to leave the Army or move to new assignments during the mission, and the operational tempo will be variable.

Don?t look for any extra time off, though. The at-home mission does not take the place of scheduled combat-zone deployments and will take place during the so-called dwell time a unit gets to reset and regenerate after a deployment.

The 1st of the 3rd is still scheduled to deploy to either Iraq or Afghanistan in early 2010, which means the soldiers will have been home a minimum of 20 months by the time they ship out.

In the meantime, they?ll learn new skills, use some of the ones they acquired in the war zone and more than likely will not be shot at while doing any of it.

They may be called upon to help with civil unrest and crowd control or to deal with potentially horrific scenarios such as massive poisoning and chaos in response to a chemical, biological, radiological, nuclear or high-yield explosive, or CBRNE, attack.

Training for homeland scenarios has already begun at Fort Stewart and includes specialty tasks such as knowing how to use the ?jaws of life? to extract a person from a mangled vehicle; extra medical training for a CBRNE incident; and working with U.S. Forestry Service experts on how to go in with chainsaws and cut and clear trees to clear a road or area.

The 1st BCT?s soldiers also will learn how to use ?the first ever nonlethal package that the Army has fielded,? 1st BCT commander Col. Roger Cloutier said, referring to crowd and traffic control equipment and nonlethal weapons designed to subdue unruly or dangerous individuals without killing them.

?It?s a new modular package of nonlethal capabilities that they?re fielding. They?ve been using pieces of it in Iraq, but this is the first time that these modules were consolidated and this package fielded, and because of this mission we?re undertaking we were the first to get it.?

The package includes equipment to stand up a hasty road block; spike strips for slowing, stopping or controlling traffic; shields and batons; and, beanbag bullets.

?I was the first guy in the brigade to get Tasered,? said Cloutier, describing the experience as ?your worst muscle cramp ever ? times 10 throughout your whole body.

?I?m not a small guy, I weigh 230 pounds ... it put me on my knees in seconds.?

The brigade will not change its name, but the force will be known for the next year as a CBRNE Consequence Management Response Force, or CCMRF (pronounced ?sea-smurf?).

?I can?t think of a more noble mission than this,? said Cloutier, who took command in July. ?We?ve been all over the world during this time of conflict, but now our mission is to take care of citizens at home ... and depending on where an event occurred, you?re going home to take care of your home town, your loved ones.?

While soldiers? combat training is applicable, he said, some nuances don?t apply.

?If we go in, we?re going in to help American citizens on American soil, to save lives, provide critical life support, help clear debris, restore normalcy and support whatever local agencies need us to do, so it?s kind of a different role,? said Cloutier, who, as the division operations officer on the last rotation, learned of the homeland mission a few months ago while they were still in Iraq.

Some brigade elements will be on call around the clock, during which time they?ll do their regular marksmanship, gunnery and other deployment training. That?s because the unit will continue to train and reset for the next deployment, even as it serves in its CCMRF mission.

Should personnel be needed at an earthquake in California, for example, all or part of the brigade could be scrambled there, depending on the extent of the need and the specialties involved.
Other branches included

The active Army?s new dwell-time mission is part of a NorthCom and DOD response package.

Active-duty soldiers will be part of a force that includes elements from other military branches and dedicated National Guard Weapons of Mass Destruction-Civil Support Teams.

A final mission rehearsal exercise is scheduled for mid-September at Fort Stewart and will be run by Joint Task Force Civil Support, a unit based out of Fort Monroe, Va., that will coordinate and evaluate the interservice event.

In addition to 1st BCT, other Army units will take part in the two-week training exercise, including elements of the 1st Medical Brigade out of Fort Hood, Texas, and the 82nd Combat Aviation Brigade from Fort Bragg, N.C.

There also will be Air Force engineer and medical units, the Marine Corps Chemical, Biological Initial Reaction Force, a Navy weather team and members of the Defense Logistics Agency and the Defense Threat Reduction Agency.

One of the things Vogler said they?ll be looking at is communications capabilities between the services.

?It is a concern, and we?re trying to check that and one of the ways we do that is by having these sorts of exercises. Leading up to this, we are going to rehearse and set up some of the communications systems to make sure we have interoperability,? he said.

?I don?t know what America?s overall plan is ? I just know that 24 hours a day, seven days a week, there are soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines that are standing by to come and help if they?re called,? Cloutier said. ?It makes me feel good as an American to know that my country has dedicated a force to come in and help the people at home.?

It still may be unconsititutional.

 

[Budmantom]

Too bad they aren't going to SF.

 

[ProfJohn]

Harvey, if it is 'unconstitutional' you would be able to find me the part of the constitution that says so right??

Perhaps it is there, but I don't remember reading anything that would disallow this.

It may be against other laws though, but being against the law and being 'unconstitutional' are VERY different things.

 

[scttgrd]

Posse Comitatus Act, this makes it illegal to post federal soldiers for law enforcement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

 

[CallMeJoe]

Originally posted by: scttgrd
Posse Comitatus Act, this makes it illegal to post federal soldiers for law enforcement.

Who are you calling a pussy communist?

edit: emphasis

 

[EagleKeeper]

Nothing in the article states anything about law enforcment.

They are training in what would supplimental a National guard unit in handling disasters/emergencies.

 

[Lemon law]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Harvey, if it is 'unconstitutional' you would be able to find me the part of the constitution that says so right??

Perhaps it is there, but I don't remember reading anything that would disallow this.

It may be against other laws though, but being against the law and being 'unconstitutional' are VERY different things.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Try posse comataus, maybe not in the constitution, but still a law.

But point taken, since all the national Guard's of the various States are now deployed to various quagmires, we need to rely on Federal troops under the command of GWB in case the locals yokels get outraged at GWB.

 

[Pliablemoose]

A Brigade is what 1,500-3,000 strong?

Not enough to stop a civil insurrection by a long shot...

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Harvey, if it is 'unconstitutional' you would be able to find me the part of the constitution that says so right??

I was posting quickly, trying to get out for dinner, and I said it MAY be unconstitutional. I misspoke. However, it is illegal under the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878.

The Posse Comitatus Act is a United States federal law (18 U.S.C. § 1385) passed on June 16, 1878 after the end of Reconstruction. The Act prohibits most members of the federal uniformed services (the Army, Air Force, and State National Guard forces when such are called into federal service) from exercising nominally state law enforcement police or peace officer powers that maintain "law and order" on non-federal property (states, their counties and municipal divisions) in the former Confederate states.

The statute generally prohibits federal military personnel and units of the United States National Guard under federal authority from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the United States, except where expressly authorized by the Constitution or Congress. The Coast Guard is exempt from the Posse Comitatus Act.

The Posse Comitatus Act and the Insurrection Act substantially limit the powers of the federal government to use the military for law enforcement.

Some parts of the act were recently revised. I don't have time to follow it deeper, right now. I'll leave that to some other diligent poster to clarify.

 

[shiner]

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy
Nothing in the article states anything about law enforcment.

They are training in what would supplimental a National guard unit in handling disasters/emergencies.

Stop trying to confuse them with the facts!

 

[OCGuy]

FEMA is the most powerful agency in the US. If you read thier "crysis time" powers, it is truly scary. I fear them more than a general going maverick.....

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: shinerburke

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy
Nothing in the article states anything about law enforcment.

They are training in what would supplimental a National guard unit in handling disasters/emergencies.

Stop trying to confuse them with the facts!

Crow taste better with facts.

But those that are so blind do not know how to even cook crow.

 

[eleison]

Originally posted by: scttgrd
Posse Comitatus Act, this makes it illegal to post federal soldiers for law enforcement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

Yea, just get the national guard. I don't feel comfortable with the army doing this..

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31
FEMA is the most powerful agency in the US. If you read thier "crysis time" powers, it is truly scary. I fear them more than a general going maverick.....

Cool!! I really enjoyed the game crysis, but I never saw any 'crysis time' powers, is that something I missed?? Or a MOD perhaps?

 

[cwjerome]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31
FEMA is the most powerful agency in the US. If you read thier "crysis time" powers, it is truly scary. I fear them more than a general going maverick.....

Too much tv for you...

 

[manowar821]

Originally posted by: eleison

Originally posted by: scttgrd
Posse Comitatus Act, this makes it illegal to post federal soldiers for law enforcement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

Yea, just get the national guard. I don't feel comfortable with the army doing this..

Didn't you know? It doesn't matter what we're comfortable with, or what "makes sense", the pigs in office know better than us.

Edit: It's cute how the same people who are naysayers in this thread are the people who ate up all the horse-shit of the past 8 years.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31
FEMA is the most powerful agency in the US. If you read thier "crysis time" powers, it is truly scary. I fear them more than a general going maverick.....

heh some examples

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 10990 allows the government to take over all modes of transportation and control of highways and seaports.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 10995 allows the government to seize and control the communication media.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 10997 allows the government to take over all electrical power, gas, petroleum, fuels and minerals.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 10998 allows the government to take over all food resources and farms.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11000 allows the government to mobilize civilians into work brigades under government supervision.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11001 allows the government to take over all health, education and welfare functions.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11002 designates the Postmaster General to operate a national registration of all persons.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11003 allows the government to take over all airports and aircraft, including commercial aircraft.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11004 allows the Housing and Finance Authority to relocate communities, build new housing with public funds, designate areas to be abandoned, and establish new locations for populations.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11005 allows the government to take over railroads, inland waterways and public storage facilities.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11051 specifies the responsibility of the Office of Emergency Planning and gives authorization to put all Executive Orders into effect in times of increased international tensions and economic or financial crisis.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11310 grants authority to the Department of Justice to enforce the plans set out in Executive Orders, to institute industrial support, to establish judicial and legislative liaison, to control all aliens, to operate penal and correctional institutions, and to advise and assist the President.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11049 assigns emergency preparedness function to federal departments and agencies, consolidating 21 operative Executive Orders issued over a fifteen year period.

# EXECUTIVE ORDER 11921 allows the Federal Emergency Preparedness Agency to develop plans to establish control over the mechanisms of production and distribution, of energy sources, wages, salaries, credit and the flow of money in U.S. financial institution in any undefined national emergency. It also provides that when a state of emergency is declared by the President, Congress cannot review the action for six months.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

None of the missions described in that article would run afoul of posse comitatus. Military troops can be used for quasi-law enforcement activities that involve public safety, like quelling civil unrest, just not for actual law enforcement duties. BTW, I don't see posse comitatus as even bordering on true Constitutional territory. If memory serves the body of law originated during the Reconstruction, and was certainly not something contemplated by the drafters of the Constitution.

As for why it makes sense to use an active-duty Army unit for this, that is another question entirely. I gather it is to fill in for beleaguered, deployed Guard units. I certainly don't see it as some preplanned conspiracy to crack down on domestic civil rights or anything of the kind.

 

[Brovane]

Here are the exclusions when the Posse Comitatus Act.


Exclusions and limitations

There are a number of situations in which the Act does not apply. These include:

* National Guard units while under the authority of the governor of a state;
* Troops used under the order of the President of the United States pursuant to the Insurrection Act, as was the case during the 1992 Los Angeles Riots.
* Under 18 U.S.C. § 831, the Attorney General may request that the Secretary of Defense provide emergency assistance if civilian law enforcement is inadequate to address certain types of threat involving the release of nuclear materials, such as potential use of a nuclear or radiological weapon. Such assistance may be by any personnel under the authority of the Department of Defense, provided such assistance does not adversely affect U.S. military preparedness.


Looks like more was given but was then repealed. This looks like how US Military troops where used post Katrina.

Homeland security

In early 2006, the 109th Congress passed a bill containing controversial provisions that granted the President additional rights to use federal or state National Guard Troops inside the United States in emergency situations. These changes were included in the John Warner Defense Appropriation Act for Fiscal Year 2007 (H.R. 5122.ENR).

These changes were repealed in their entirety in 2008.

[edit] Natural disasters

On September 26, 2006, President Bush urged Congress to consider revising federal laws so that the U.S. military could seize control immediately in the aftermath of a natural disaster, in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.

These changes were repealed in their entirety in 2008.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Northcom's own website already answers the question about the Posse Comitus Act:

http://www.northcom.mil/About/index.html

USNORTHCOM?s civil support mission includes domestic disaster relief operations that occur during fires, hurricanes, floods and earthquakes. Support also includes counter-drug operations and managing the consequences of a terrorist event employing a weapon of mass destruction. The command provides assistance to a Lead Agency when tasked by DoD. Per the Posse Comitatus Act, military forces can provide civil support, but cannot become directly involved in law enforcement.

As to why the need Army troops, NORTHCOM currently has few permanent troops assigned. Having a core group that is already trained would assist in the missions they are tasked to do. It's simple preparedness, something this admin is not famous for. Yet when they actually do try to prepare they still get dinged.

That attitude won't change when Obama becomes President either. It'll just be a new batch of posters making the lame accusations. I can't wait for the major forum upheaval that's to come.

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Northcom's own website already answers the question about the Posse Comitus Act:

http://www.northcom.mil/About/index.html

USNORTHCOM?s civil support mission includes domestic disaster relief operations that occur during fires, hurricanes, floods and earthquakes. Support also includes counter-drug operations and managing the consequences of a terrorist event employing a weapon of mass destruction. The command provides assistance to a Lead Agency when tasked by DoD. Per the Posse Comitatus Act, military forces can provide civil support, but cannot become directly involved in law enforcement.

As to why the need Army troops, NORTHCOM currently has few permanent troops assigned. Having a core group that is already trained would assist in the missions they are tasked to do. It's simple preparedness, something this admin is not famous for. Yet when they actually do try to prepare they still get dinged.

That attitude won't change when Obama becomes President either. It'll just be a new batch of posters making the lame accusations. I can't wait for the major forum upheaval that's to come.

We get to replace Bush bashing with Obama bashing. But Clinton becomes But Bush! What's old becomes new again! It will be entertaining to have 7 years of searchable history. I expect much turnover.