Are you disgusted by cheaters (Academic) *(Kinda long)

[DDCSpeed]

I like this following part from cattlegod:


cheaters win. and they win often, they hardly every lose. they will not die in the workplace. if you think the cheaters are going to get what is coming to them then you are mistaken.

what makes it in the workplace is hard work and personality. you could have never cheated in college, but if you are up against someone who cheated every day and is more personable than you are, he will get that raise, not you.

just a little advice & info for you. sad but true.

 

[ddwbi0]

Originally posted by: z0mb13
I'm a 4th year CS major at UCB

(btw I'm not talking about whole asians, usually those who are international students, ie FOB)

what are 'whole asians'? wouldnt fobs be more of a wholesome asian than abc's? And today my chem prof called out about 20 ppl who he said copied off each other on their take home test.

 

[Garet Jax]

When I was in University the prof in one of my CS classes caught a couple of students cheating and embarrased them in front of every one.

The two students knew that the professor handed the mid-terms back to the class to go over the correct answers. These two guys (when writing the exam) put a half crossed T for answers to True and False. When they got them back, if the answer was False (and they had put True), they would put another horizontal line to make the T look like an F.

At the end of the class, the students took their mid-terms back to the prof complaining about the mistakes in marking. Well the prof outsmarted them and photocopied all exams before handing them back. He compared the before and after exams, found the differences and made a public spectacle of these two guys next class

I do not know what happened to them in the end.

 

[Jfur]

I am BEYOND disgusted. There was a single dickhead who really caused trouble for all of us -- they were so scared he'd sue the University they basically gave him a Ph.D. even though he is completely unqualified and consitently cheated. A number of us almost left over it
:disgust: No one wants to interview at places he did -- we're all too embarrassed.

huh??

[/quote]

I guess you cheated your way through reading classes? Here is a summary of the above paragraph for easy digestion...

1) There was a cheater in the program
2) We all suffered because of him
3) The program did nothing because he threated to sue them
4) A lot of people were so pissed they almost left
5) None of us want him to be associated with our otherwise strong program because he is such a joke, so we don't want to interview (for jobs, not with the vampire) at the same places he did

 

[Braves]

yeah i've cheated before, and I still do. I have no qualms about that because I know that I do the work when it counts. I'm lazy, I was brought up in a wealthy family and I look for fun and games everyday. I wasn't brought up with a strong work ethic and now it's starting to hurt me. I breezed through middle school with close to perfect grades, then high school came and I was doomed. My grades are nowhere near the famed "athletes mark" of 2.0, but it's a little far from the scholership 4.8 that some in my school have managed to achieve. Do I think cheaters win? I know they do because i've been victimized by cheaters many times, before i started myself. Do I feel bad about cheating? Yeah, a little bit, although i'd rather have a good life with a guilty conscience then a guilt-free "poor" life. Yes, i'm materialistic, i'm judgemental, and i'm lazy. I'm a true American (i'm actually asian but I was born in america and i think that's why i am like this)

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: Jfur

I guess you cheated your way through reading classes? Here is a summary of the above paragraph for easy digestion...

1) There was a cheater in the program
2) We all suffered because of him
3) The program did nothing because he threated to sue them
4) A lot of people were so pissed they almost left
5) None of us want him to be associated with our otherwise strong program because he is such a joke, so we don't want to interview (for jobs, not with the vampire) at the same places he did

Ah, the #3 was the thing. I wasn't what you meant either.

 

[xirtam]

One man's BS course could be another man's liberal arts degree

I've got a four-letter word for that. Nice!

Yes, i'm materialistic, i'm judgemental, and i'm lazy. I'm a true American (i'm actually asian but I was born in america and i think that's why i am like this)

I've got another 4-letter word for that. ROFL!

 

[J0hnny]

Originally posted by: Cattlegod
let me give you a few words.

cheaters win. and they win often, they hardly every lose. they will not die in the workplace. if you think the cheaters are going to get what is coming to them then you are mistaken.

what makes it in the workplace is hard work and personality. you could have never cheated in college, but if you are up against someone who cheated every day and is more personable than you are, he will get that raise, not you.

just a little advice & info for you. sad but true.

I have to agree with Cattlegod here. I think of school, work, and life as a game. No matter what you do, you have to play the game. You do what is necessary to get ahead. I've seen a lot of people get ahead because they've found loopholes around rules and take advantage of the system. There are consequences to all your actions, but you can also strive to circumvent these consequences. At the end, the person who just sits and whines and does nothing loses. Just play the game and you'll get ahead in life.

 

[JellyBaby]

When you cheat you're being dishonest. Most people are drawn to honesty and for good reason: it's the best policy.

I've always thought academic cheating was lame. You usually deprive yourself of learning the material and that's the reason you're earning an education, right? Habitual cheaters make me sick but I think most of us can rationalize it once in a while.

 

[z0mb13]

Originally posted by: diskop

Originally posted by: z0mb13
I'm a 4th year CS major at UCB

yes I have cheated in the past, and I know regret it...

the problem is other people cheating off me..... especially my friends and relative, they expect me to give them the answers because I used to also cheat in the past......
I'm not quite sure about this, but asians usually feel that cheating is OK, and they expect other asians to cheat also, when a guy doesn't want to cheat (ie give answers) they brand him "uncool"
(btw I'm not talking about whole asians, usually those who are international students, ie FOB)



hell I almost got into big trouble when someone copied my program....

Haha yeah fobs cheat so much in my cs courses. (I am EECS btw). I've seen them do the stupidest things to cheat.

hey do I know u??
what classes did u take last sem??
I took cs 162 and 170

 

[diskop]

Originally posted by: z0mb13

Originally posted by: diskop

Originally posted by: z0mb13
I'm a 4th year CS major at UCB

yes I have cheated in the past, and I know regret it...

the problem is other people cheating off me..... especially my friends and relative, they expect me to give them the answers because I used to also cheat in the past......
I'm not quite sure about this, but asians usually feel that cheating is OK, and they expect other asians to cheat also, when a guy doesn't want to cheat (ie give answers) they brand him "uncool"
(btw I'm not talking about whole asians, usually those who are international students, ie FOB)



hell I almost got into big trouble when someone copied my program....

Haha yeah fobs cheat so much in my cs courses. (I am EECS btw). I've seen them do the stupidest things to cheat.

hey do I know u??
what classes did u take last sem??
I took cs 162 and 170

I took 162 fall of 2001 and I was in 170 last semester for a few days before I dropped it for some other stuff the dean made me take cause him and my advisor are both arses.

 

[quirky]

Originally posted by: Jfur

I am BEYOND disgusted. There was a single dickhead who really caused trouble for all of us -- they were so scared he'd sue the University they basically gave him a Ph.D. even though he is completely unqualified and consitently cheated. A number of us almost left over it
:disgust: No one wants to interview at places he did -- we're all too embarrassed.

huh??

I guess you cheated your way through reading classes? Here is a summary of the above paragraph for easy digestion...

1) There was a cheater in the program
2) We all suffered because of him
3) The program did nothing because he threated to sue them
4) A lot of people were so pissed they almost left
5) None of us want him to be associated with our otherwise strong program because he is such a joke, so we don't want to interview (for jobs, not with the vampire) at the same places he did[/quote]

he threatened to sue them for what?

you cant create "reasoning gaps" and expect ppl to be able to understand it like you do. that clause is really messy. i suggest you brush up in your critical thinking skills.

 

[Jfur]

Originally posted by: quirky

Originally posted by: Jfur

I am BEYOND disgusted. There was a single dickhead who really caused trouble for all of us -- they were so scared he'd sue the University they basically gave him a Ph.D. even though he is completely unqualified and consitently cheated. A number of us almost left over it
:disgust: No one wants to interview at places he did -- we're all too embarrassed.

huh??

I guess you cheated your way through reading classes? Here is a summary of the above paragraph for easy digestion...

1) There was a cheater in the program
2) We all suffered because of him
3) The program did nothing because he threated to sue them
4) A lot of people were so pissed they almost left
5) None of us want him to be associated with our otherwise strong program because he is such a joke, so we don't want to interview (for jobs, not with the vampire) at the same places he did

he threatened to sue them for what?



you cant create "reasoning gaps" and expect ppl to be able to understand it like you do. that clause is really messy. i suggest you brush up in your critical thinking skills.[/quote]

My critical thinking skills are just fine. I thought you were criticizing me communication skills with your eloquent "huh?? " To answer your question -- He threatend to sue them for taking disciplinary action. Apparently the person who made the decision to let it go felt they did not have enough evidence (which is bs). That's why "the program did nothing because he threatened to sue them" [if they did something]. Given the context I can't see too many other interpretations. The bottom line is he should of been speared alive and expelled early on but the program chair at the time was easily cowed by his idle threats.

 

[Alphathree33]

While I don't care if other people cheat (as they are usually poor students and not a challenge to me anyway) I have a huuuuuge problem whem someone either tries to copy from me, tries to ask me to help them cheat or make a cheat sheet or otherwise scams a teacher.

Actually, let me rephrase, in math/physics/chem I don't care if people cheat because they can't and won't beat me no matter how hard they try (at cheating).

But in English, lots and lots of people copy things off the net and get reasonable marks. I just absolutely hate it when I spend three or four hours writing an essay and some jerk spends ten seconds clicking "print". It does make me laugh, though, if I still get higher marks than them when their essay could very well have been written by a double PhD in English for all we know.

 

[eakers]

Originally posted by: diskop

Originally posted by: quirky
i cheat only in the BS courses

One man's BS course could be another man's liberal arts degree

BUWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA NICE! NICE! NICE! AS A REAL STUDENT I APPLAUD YOU.

<-- MATH GRRRRRRRL.

 

[Rakkis]

Originally posted by: SpongeBob


I don't really have a problem with it because the only person you are hurting is yourself by not learning the material.

While I agree that you hurt yourself by cheating, I do not agree when you say that cheating does not hurt others. This happens whether a class is curved or not.


Let's say that in a class (curved grading) person A makes matches the mean score of the class, but person B cheated enough to get him one standard deviation higher than person A. Let's also say that in a second class (straigh-scale) person A earns an 88/B+ and person B cheated his way to a 91/A- instead of an 84/B

How are the non-cheaters not being hurt? In the first class, the cheater gets a higher grade than a lot of people that did not cheat even though he did not earn it. In fact, in a curved class, he "took away" a B-grade slot from someone that would have earned one had the cheater not been there.

In the second class, you can argue that the cheater did not have an impact in anyone else's grade. While that is true, you have to step back and look at the situation from another point of view. The non-cheaters are still being hurt. Why? Because the cheater and others like him end up getting degrees and getting jobs with their diplomas. These people are not as qualified as others that actually worked during school and are consequently found to be a waste of resources by the places that employ them. Employers then think "Oh.. it looks like University X does not prepare people as much as University Y does" and they decide to not even consider capable people from our original university. Now the non-cheaters have had their job opportunities reduced due to the actions and misrepresentation caused by cheating.

Get my drift?

 

[Fulcrum]

The problem of rampant cheating lies with the way most classes are taught, as well as the morals (or lack thereof) of the students. Having a good Prof. who knows how to challenge his/her students on what they actually learn from the class can go along way towards preventing cheating. Too many Profs. use a system that relies too much on getting points for busywork and such rather than finding ways to make a student show how much he has learned over the course of the class. Getting points from busywork is for high school, not college. Yet too many Profs. are not willing to take a more one on one approach because they either can't (too large class size, for example) or simply won't (they really want to conduct research, not teach). The problem with how most classes are graded is that they rely on the assumption that anyone who earns enough points to get a high grade must have done so because they learned what they were supposed to. This is more often than not false. If the tests are simply glorified dittos with a few generic essays thrown in and the class work consists of all busywork (tedious and pointless) or is otherwise generic in nature, it's easy for many students to "do what it takes" (such as cheating) to earn those points and not learn much of anything that will be remembered after the student is done with the class. A Prof. who encourages discussions where they can observe first hand how much you know and put some thought into their tests are better able to tell who knows what ard grade accordingly. You know, a Prof. can make several versions of the same test if they are willing to take the time to do so. My point is a good Prof. who cares can go along way twords solving this problem. The classes where the Prof. doesn't really care will always be full of students who cheat to get the grade. If you make something easy enough to exploit, people will. It's human nature. Just my convoluted opinion.

 

[quirky]

Originally posted by: Jfur

Originally posted by: quirky

Originally posted by: Jfur

I am BEYOND disgusted. There was a single dickhead who really caused trouble for all of us -- they were so scared he'd sue the University they basically gave him a Ph.D. even though he is completely unqualified and consitently cheated. A number of us almost left over it
:disgust: No one wants to interview at places he did -- we're all too embarrassed.

huh??

I guess you cheated your way through reading classes? Here is a summary of the above paragraph for easy digestion...

1) There was a cheater in the program
2) We all suffered because of him
3) The program did nothing because he threated to sue them
4) A lot of people were so pissed they almost left
5) None of us want him to be associated with our otherwise strong program because he is such a joke, so we don't want to interview (for jobs, not with the vampire) at the same places he did

he threatened to sue them for what?



you cant create "reasoning gaps" and expect ppl to be able to understand it like you do. that clause is really messy. i suggest you brush up in your critical thinking skills.

My critical thinking skills are just fine. I thought you were criticizing me communication skills with your eloquent "huh?? " To answer your question -- He threatend to sue them for taking disciplinary action. Apparently the person who made the decision to let it go felt they did not have enough evidence (which is bs). That's why "the program did nothing because he threatened to sue them" [if they did something]. Given the context I can't see too many other interpretations. The bottom line is he should of been speared alive and expelled early on but the program chair at the time was easily cowed by his idle threats.[/quote]

"Apparently the person who made the decision to let it go felt they did not have enough evidence (which is bs)"

that was the critical piece of information you left out. its still hard to understand that everyone else is so sure he cheated except him.

what, you've never went "huh" before in your life? that usually happens when something is so baffling you cant htink of anything mroe eloquent to say but "huh?"