Question are video card prices headed down yet?

[Heartbreaker]

as mentioned all big 3 supposedly have cut orders from TSMC by paying a fine.

If true, It isn't very indicative of massive margins on these cards that most seem to assume here.

Why would all the big tech companies just burn money for nothing instead of selling more volume at a lower price, like armchair experts on this forum say they should do?

 

[igor_kavinski]

Why would all the big tech companies just burn money for nothing instead of selling more volume at a lower price, like armchair experts on this forum say they should do?

Why do you defend the interests of tech companies all the time? Must own a lot of shares in them.

 

[biostud]

ok fair enough I always forget the taxes. Still the 4070 Ti should be available for like $850 or $100 more confirm my point it is not that badly priced for the current market. albeit they will not sell a boat load at that price, that is clear

@amenex

as mentioned all big 3 supposedly have cut orders from TSMC by paying a fine.

The cheapest 4070Ti is $1055 here in Denmark, so $844 w/o taxes, so it is ~20% faster than a RX 6800 in raster but costs 40% more.

 

[blckgrffn]

If true, It isn't very indicative of massive margins on these cards that most seem to assume here.

Why would all the big tech companies just burn money for nothing instead of selling more volume at a lower price, like armchair experts on this forum say they should do?

To be fair, they are more worried about their quarterly performance than literally anything else once the bean counters have their say. I don't think any move they make needs to be rationalized further than that.

If there was long term benefit to increasing market share, it's easy to see how it my be trumped by "what have you done for me lately?" from the leeches rent seekers shareholders.

It's not a rational system and we don't need to pretend that it is.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Please do! Give it your best shot!

It's not the translation that's the problem. It's cultural context, the Danish way of thinking and Danish humour.

Our form of humour is subtle, relying on virtually untranslatable language puns, double (even triple) meanings, a good deal of irony and sarcasm. Let me put it this way. During 5 years worth of occupation, the Germans never figured out they were ruthlessly mocked and made fun of. Good thing too. Might not have gone down well.

 

[Heartbreaker]

To be fair, they are more worried about their quarterly performance than literally anything else once the bean counters have their say. I don't think any move they make needs to be rationalized further than that.

If there was long term benefit to increasing market share, it's easy to see how it my be trumped by "what have you done for me lately?" from the leeches rent seekers shareholders.

It's not a rational system and we don't need to pretend that it is.

Hard to see how we paid a foundry all this money for nothing, looks better than, we paid for wafers we sold at a profit.

 

[Stuka87]

Fk me, the 6700 XT I got in November started blackscreening while web browsing of all things. Now I'm ready to send it back to Amazon for a refund and just slap my 1660 Super back in the system and wait for whatever $500 card Nvidia puts out this summer. Though could be the PSU too, just installed a Corsair RM750x about a week ago. Ugh and I was really enjoying this card too. Ugh that's going to fun stress testing, pulling out the RM750x and installing my Bitfenix Formula 450 Gold and stress testing with that again.

EDIT: Maybe it's just a driver problem, because I have been playing Elden Ring at 1800p fine pulling 205W for the last hour and the game is running as well as ever.

Does the machine lock up? Or is it still up and running, just with no display output?

 

[SteveGrabowski]

Does the machine lock up? Or is it still up and running, just with no display output?

Seems like it was no display output. I read it could be a Multi-Pane Overlay problem perhaps so disabled that in the registry and I guess I'll see if I have the problem again in the next 3 weeks while I can still return the card for a refund. Love this card for gaming but it's kind of a pain just for web browsing (also have the driver time out and relaunch every other day or so in Chrome).

Have never had a single problem with this card while gaming and Elden Ring was running awesome while pulling 205W last night for two hours straight right after that. But just web browsing has been a pain on this card.

 

[beginner99]

Why would all the big tech companies just burn money for nothing instead of selling more volume at a lower price, like armchair experts on this forum say they should do?

because that will set the price bar lower after they were able to raise prices and will make raising the prices more difficult in the future without backlash. hence why a duopoly is usually a monopoly. neither has much to gain from a price war. We need intel to deliver to get back to saner prices.

 

[beginner99]

The cheapest 4070Ti is $1055 here in Denmark, so $844 w/o taxes, so it is ~20% faster than a RX 6800 in raster but costs 40% more.

ouch. I saw some models for $850 here which was pleasantly surprising, cheapest 7900xt is $950.

 

[coercitiv]

Hard to see how we paid a foundry all this money for nothing, looks better than, we paid for wafers we sold at a profit.

We live in an era where a big corporation canceled a finished movie to get a tax cut. The truth is often stranger than forum speculation.

 

[Heartbreaker]

We live in an era where a big corporation canceled a finished movie to get a tax cut. The truth is often stranger than forum speculation.

If it were one company sure, when it's all of them...

Or you know it could just be another BS rumor.

 

[igor_kavinski]

The cheapest 4070Ti is $1055 here in Denmark, so $844 w/o taxes, so it is ~20% faster than a RX 6800 in raster but costs 40% more.

The extra 20% covers the bonuses for the hero engineers for shipping the card out despite being stuck with buggy silicon that badly needed a respin

 

[gdansk]

If true, It isn't very indicative of massive margins on these cards that most seem to assume here.

Why would all the big tech companies just burn money for nothing instead of selling more volume at a lower price, like armchair experts on this forum say they should do?

Because paying a small fee to cancel is simply cheaper than fulfilling the contract. It doesn't say anything about the cost of manufacture a single unit but rather the size of the contract. Which, given the demand they saw years ago when signing the contract, are surely large.

Moreover, I don't believe for a second that they cancelled much in 5nm. AMD and Nvidia have other products they would gladly mass produce in the server/dc market.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Fk me, the 6700 XT I got in November started blackscreening while web browsing of all things. Now I'm ready to send it back to Amazon for a refund

I don't think it's fair to punish the card when it's doing the job well.

Make sure that you are on a WHQL driver and try using a different browser like Edge Chrome or Firefox for testing because they also have GPU acceleration. Could be it's just a Chrome issue.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Because paying a small fee to cancel is simply cheaper than fulfilling the contract.

Only if fulfilling the contract isn't profitable. Again armchair experts here are claiming they can sell the cards at 50% off and still make a profit. The should have no problem clearing the excess capacity at 50% off.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

I don't think it's fair to punish the card when it's doing the job well.

Make sure that you are on a WHQL driver and try using a different browser like Edge Chrome or Firefox for testing because they also have GPU acceleration. Could be it's just a Chrome issue.

Sounds like it might be a Multi-Plane Overlay problem in Windows, so I disabled it via the registry. Hopefully that will fix it.

 

[coercitiv]

If it were one company sure, when it's all of them...

Or you know it could just be another BS rumor.

If the economic scenario is bad, it makes sense for all of them to do the same thing. Whether the rumor is BS or not I do not know, we have no clear proof one way or the other.

Again armchair experts here are claiming

Can you dial this down, please? In case you haven't realized yet, you are an armchair expert just like the rest of us here, unless you do financial and/or sales work for a big electronics corporation.

The sarcasm may help you feel better while you write, but it does nothing to help your arguments and credibility.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Only if fulfilling the contract isn't profitable. Again armchair experts here are claiming they can sell the cards at 50% off and still make a profit. The should have no problem clearing the excess capacity at 50% off.

And you are not an armchair expert?

 

[gdansk]

Only if fulfilling the contract isn't profitable. Again armchair experts here are claiming they can sell the cards at 50% off and still make a profit. The should have no problem clearing the excess capacity at 50% off.

It does not say much of anything about manufacturing prices. All it reveals is their demand forecast. If the expected sales for AD102 went from 2 million to 1 million units, of course you cancel the contract even if it you *could* discount AD102 enough to sell 2 million units. If you discount AD102 you would have to discount your whole line up. ASP suffers. Total profit suffers. And sure you could replace it with more AD104 but only if you think the Ampere inventory problems are solved (it seems that way to me) or it will cause the same problem.

Of course, as is they're selling all AD102 without price cuts so I discount rumors they are cancelling large 5nm orders. But I object to the idea that such a cancellation would say much of anything about their manufacturing costs of consumer parts.

GH100 would be their most wafer constrained part and trickle down of its limited sales opportunity to China, if anything, is what would cause contract cancellation.

 

[Aapje]

Why would all the big tech companies just burn money for nothing instead of selling more volume at a lower price, like armchair experts on this forum say they should do?

I think that AMD think that they can significantly improve the quality of their product, either through drivers or a respin. It makes sense to not discount a product to what it is currently worth when it will become much better, since it's hard to then raise up prices again. I also think that AMD are delusional about the demand, like they already provably showed with Ryzen that they had to discount really quickly.

I think that Nvidia is just delusional. The industry insiders are supposedly saying that demand will recover in 2023, but Jensen might confuse normal demand with mining demand. I also have my doubts whether those experts are right.

 

[gdansk]

I think that AMD think that they can significantly improve the quality of their product, either through drivers or a respin. It makes sense to not discount a product to what it is currently worth when it will become much better, since it's hard to then raise up prices again. I also think that AMD are delusional about the demand, like they already provably showed with Ryzen that they had to discount really quickly.

I think that Nvidia is just delusional. The industry insiders are saying that demand will recover, but Jensen might confuse normal demand with mining demand.

Nvidia is definitely miffed about the rates that TSMC charges that's why they went to Samsung during Ampere and partially Pascal. But RDNA2 forced them back to TSMC as they want their A game on the consumer side too.

So of course Jensen will say Moore's Law is all day while really the only expensive product to make in the line up has the smallest absolute MSRP increase.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Can you dial this down, please? In case you haven't realized yet, you are an armchair expert just like the rest of us here, unless you do financial and/or sales work for a big electronics corporation.

The difference is, I'm not claiming I know better than the companies operating in their area of expertise.

 

[blckgrffn]

Nvidia is definitely miffed about the rates that TSMC charges that's why they went to Samsung during Ampere and partially Pascal. But RDNA2 forced them back to TSMC as they want their A game on the consumer side too.

So of course Jensen will say Moore's Law is all day while really the only expensive product to make in the line up has the smallest absolute MSRP increase.

I've been wondering if pressed if Nvidia will simply do a rebrand on lower tier Ampere cards. 3050 --> 4050, etc. They seem to have such a sweet deal with Samsung that it seems like competitive pressure on price might just see them lop say $50 off of 40xx Ampere based cards and call it a day. The "4050" (3050+ tweaks) at $199 and the "4050 Ti" at $249 (3060 8GB + tweaks) would probably buy them a lot of time, and laughably some "good will" in making affordable options available again or some such spin. Seeing the 1050 and 2060 12GB come back makes me think this could be possible, maybe not even bothering to rebrand, I suppose.

First RTX card under $200. Etc.

Then they can reserve their expensive, shiny silicon for HPC/high margin efforts, it's not like these little mainstream cards would chew into their allocation that effectively anyway.

 

[VirtualLarry]

and the "4050 Ti" at $249 (3060 8GB + tweaks) would probably buy them a lot of time, and laughably some "good will" in making affordable options available again or some such spin.

I'm calling it right now. If NVidia follows through and does that (and I think it's a great idea!), then *that* card in particular will be an all-time best-seller, destined to top the Steam HW Survey charts.