Are some races just genetically more intelligent than others?

[Amused]

Originally posted by: WinkOsmosis

Originally posted by: Amused

Originally posted by: Slammy1

Originally posted by: WinkOsmosis
I remember in Anthropology class, learning that there is no genetic intelligence difference between races, and that it's a nurture thing. Also, there is more genetic variability within a race than between races. Not sure what that means.

It means at we're all 99.999% the same, but people tend to focus on the 0.001% difference in an effort to show superiority.

We're 98.7 % the same as chimpanzees. Yet we focus on the 1.3% difference in an effort to show superiority.

And we are like 90% the same as.. some much lower level creatures. I don't think genetic percentages mean much.

I think that was my point.

 

[Slammy1]

My point was not a genetic argument per se. All mammals have the same basic metabolic pathways, but the extent they are expressed varies from species to species. The real differences between races are minor, especially compared to the genetic diversity of what's being described as subspeciation. More of a population genetics question than any real difference.

 

[Gyrene]

Originally posted by: vman

Originally posted by: LAUST

Originally posted by: Slammy1
Is the question:
Asians are gentically superior to caucasions?

I'd be willing to accept that... I'd also be willing to accept that their culture values education strongly and, as a result, they tend to study more and make a serious commitment to education. More than the lazy caucasions.

lol... so take Japan vs the UK then... please someone fill out this list for me who has the superior

Government
Economy
University's
Military

just start off with a light appetizer

Japan has a superior economy.

Governments are about the same.

UK has better known universities, and spends more on military.

Japan's economic structure was also set up by the United States.

 

[CubicZirconia]

Originally posted by: ViRGE

Originally posted by: naddicott
What DNA says about human ancestry.

The Nazis, as everyone knows, justified the death camps on the grounds that Jews and Gypsies were genetically inferior?but what is less known is that the Nazis took their cue from eugenics legislation passed in the United States. Here, race is defined primarily by skin color. Since that's a genetic trait, the logic goes, race itself must be genetic, and there must be differences that are more than skin deep.

But that's not what modern genetics reveals. Quite the contrary, it shows that race is truly skin deep. Indeed, genetics undermines the whole concept that humanity is composed of ''races''?pure and static groups that are significantly different from one another. Genetics has proven otherwise by tracing human ancestry, as it is inscribed on DNA.
....
''white people'' do not share a common genetic heritage; instead, they come from different lineages that migrated from Africa and Asia. Such mixing is true for every race. ''All living humans go back to one common ancestor in Africa,'' explains Paabo. ''But if you look at any history subsequent to that,'' then every group is a blend of shallower pedigrees. So, he says, ''I might be closer in my DNA to an African than to another European in the street.'' Genetics, he concludes, ''should be the last nail in the coffin for racism.''
...
Over time, ''genetics will help beat down racist arguments,'' says Eric Lander, a world-renowned geneticist at M.I.T. ''But they will need to be beaten down, because they will keep coming up.''

If you really want the answer to this question, try google (like the above) and you'll find that from a genetic standpoint, the whole concept of race is a soundly debunked myth. Interesting to see how many AT'ers are still ignorant racists though!


I think it would be fair to say that some cultures are better than others at raising their children intelligently (hence the preponderance of stupid people among the "white trash" subspecies, which more accurately could be labeled as "trailer trash").

Humm, interesting point. But still, if there's no such thing as "race" there would still have to be something similar. Otherwise, how does one explain things like sickle cell amnemia, a condition far more common in blacks than other population segments?

PS phatj, take a chill pill man; it's not worth getting worked up over

It's really a question of semantics. "Race" is purely fiction, likely invented by Christopher Columbus and company when they first discovered "Indians." The idea of "Race" was created to help one group of people dominate and control another (ie the European Christians controlling the Indians). Ethnic groups, however, are not fiction. And while most people here are using the term race, I think they are really referring to ethnic backgrounds.

 

[Ameesh]

Originally posted by: dighn
i think it's more cultural/socioeconomical than genetic.

 

[przero]

NASCAR races are!

 

[SuperTool]

North asians seem to be smarter than south asians.

 

[incallisto]

Originally posted by: tcsenter

Are some races just genetically more intelligent than others?

Possibly.

Richard Herrnstein and Charles Murray, previously very respected in their fields, all but ruined their careers by asking this question in The Bell Curve and concluded more study was required.

In spite of The Bell Curve containing more than ample cautionary statements that should have precluded or blunted ad hominem attacks, in addition to their impeccable credentials and complete absence of any previous history that might suggest bigotry, the authors were accused of everything from being advocates of modern Nazi Eugenics to closet members of the KKK. The race was on to discredit Herrnstein, Murray, the Bell Curve, and to silence anyone who dared ask such a question, but no effort has been made to answer the questions they raised.

The Bell Curve adequately proved there are real patterns that seem to defy all explanation under the 'socioeconomic' hypothesis. In addition, there is other evidence revealing that middle-class black students consistently lag behind even poor white students whom could not be said to have the same socioeconomic advantages (see William Raspberry, John Ogbu, Shelby Steele, Signithia Fordham, et. al.).

But don't expect there to be any further serious scholarship on the matter by anyone but those with some kind of professional death wish.

 

[DainBramaged]

Originally posted by: dighn
i think it's more cultural/socioeconomical than genetic.

 

[LAUST]

Are you sure about their economy?

 

[StormRider]

It's generally acknowledged by authorities that the StormRider race is the most intelligent....

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: Spencer278
If one race is smarter then the adavatage would be gone with in a few generations smarter people bread less then stupid people gring down the average. I don't think the reason you see asains at the top the class alot is because they are smart they just haven't figured out that doing all the homework assigned in class is pointless.

are you trying to prove a point with your poor spelling?

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: dtyn

Originally posted by: vman

Originally posted by: LAUST

Originally posted by: Slammy1
Is the question:
Asians are gentically superior to caucasions?

I'd be willing to accept that... I'd also be willing to accept that their culture values education strongly and, as a result, they tend to study more and make a serious commitment to education. More than the lazy caucasions.

lol... so take Japan vs the UK then... please someone fill out this list for me who has the superior

Government
Economy
University's
Military

just start off with a light appetizer

Japan has a superior economy.

Governments are about the same.

UK has better known universities, and spends more on military.

Japan's economic structure was also set up by the United States.

HAHAHAHAHAHA

Ignorance floats to the top.

do you have ANY idea what the japanese economy is really like?? what the infrastructure is, how business is done?? NONE Of that changed JUST because the US "won" the war.

what the US did was FORCE the japanese to put together a semblence of a democracy and a capitalistic economy. the japanese only did enough to put up a show, but there was no real change of substance.

the Japanese economy is still one of warlords that control their individual "provinces".

 

[SuperTool]

Say all you want about the Japanese, but they ended up being nuked because the Americans and Jews at Los Alamos outsmarted them

 

[PunDogg]

Originally posted by: DurocShark

Originally posted by: dighn
i think it's more cultural/socioeconomical than genetic.

 

[Sust]

cool
super flame war
It would be hard to make comparisons of intelligence across "races"
We would then hafta sequence every earthling's DNA and see which people have the most similar DNA and then come up with a neuropsych exam capable of crossing over their cultural differences.
Pretty tough if you ask me.
And then what would we have as a result?
Well, we probably couldnt achieve an accurate representation of the normal population's IQ because of the fact that we had to find people who had the fewest genetic differences.
This is why genetics studies are such a PITA IMO.
Most only do genetic research on caucasians, because theyve been studied the most and avoid the painful "race" comparison.

Speaking of differences, did you know that we have different activation levels in the amygdala when we look at faces?
There was a paper that stated white people looking at white expressionless faces had no differential amygdala activation, but when they looked at the expressionless faces of african americans, there was significant amygdala activation.
This amygdala activation could be interpretted multiple ways:
1: white people scared of black people
2: something about black faces is salient for white people
There are probably more ways of looking at it, but Im no PhD in neuroscience.

Heh, and dont even get me started on Asians and their wacky Serotonin transporter gene.

Flame on.

 

[ed21x]

Originally posted by: yellowperil
It's disturbing how many people are willing to believe that one race is genetically superior to another, when the confounding variables are so complex. In addition the 'tests' for intelligence are already biased towards Anglo culture. Really, I think it's just an excuse for peoples' prejudice and racism. There is not enough evidence to be conclusive about anything, yet people are willing to reach the most prejudicial conclusions. Why? How about waiting until the results are finally in (which may never happen), and giving the benefit of the doubt to equality in the meantime?

There's also a radical "By Any Means Necessary" group on my campus that seems to chant the same thing about how tests like the SAT's hold a 'bias' towards white people. What he didn't know was that I was a Princeton Review teacher for Meritt HS here in Berkeley and I had around 5 sample tests in my bag, and I took them out and asked him to identify a 'racist' question. He flipped through it, looked at all the math problems, and failed to come up with any

 

[Dragnov]

lol... so take Japan vs the UK then... please someone fill out this list for me who has the superior

Government
Economy
University's
Military

just start off with a light appetizer

Er, even though Japan is in a very deep depression, they are still the 2nd largest economy of the world. (Currently possibly rebounding, but time will tell.)

Governments are just about the same. Most modern governments all have their good points and bad points. I can name plenty of problems inherit in both sides.

UK unly has better known universites because Western countries, primarily only know Western countries. Japans top schools produce highly competent beuracrats who are pretty much guaranteed spots in big businesses and government that keep the country going. Well known among all of Asia. I'd say they are pretty much equal.

Military spending denotes how good a country is? Damn, North Korea must be the best of all countries then.

You don't have much knowledge of Japan do you?


And lol at the dumb@ss elitist asians, and dumb@ss angry caucasians in this post arguing about this dumb@ss question.

Paraphrasing from Locke... Everybody thinks they are smarter/stronger than everybody else. Just proves that everyone is fvckin stupid.

 

[0roo0roo]

japan is the 4rth largest spender military wise and thats under their no war allowed bit.

 

[Tom]

it's impossible to define intelligence, let alone measure it and then pick one group over another.

 

[Gyrene]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: dtyn

Originally posted by: vman

Originally posted by: LAUST

Originally posted by: Slammy1
Is the question:
Asians are gentically superior to caucasions?

I'd be willing to accept that... I'd also be willing to accept that their culture values education strongly and, as a result, they tend to study more and make a serious commitment to education. More than the lazy caucasions.

lol... so take Japan vs the UK then... please someone fill out this list for me who has the superior

Government
Economy
University's
Military

just start off with a light appetizer

Japan has a superior economy.

Governments are about the same.

UK has better known universities, and spends more on military.

Japan's economic structure was also set up by the United States.

HAHAHAHAHAHA

Ignorance floats to the top.

do you have ANY idea what the japanese economy is really like?? what the infrastructure is, how business is done?? NONE Of that changed JUST because the US "won" the war.

what the US did was FORCE the japanese to put together a semblence of a democracy and a capitalistic economy. the japanese only did enough to put up a show, but there was no real change of substance.

the Japanese economy is still one of warlords that control their individual "provinces".

Argue what you will, but its historical fact that the US worked with Japan to set up their current economical structure. I'm not going to argue that, because it's in plain text in a textbook right in front of me. You are free to believe what you will, but I do not appreciate being called ignorant. I am not ignorant, and you have no qualifications to declare me as such. You can simply state your opinion, there's no need to attack someone else. That just shows your integrity. Congratualations, you have shown that you do not possess much.

EDIT: And for another matter, if it wasn't for the "strong arm tactics" of Matthew Perry (from the US mind you), Japan might still be an isolationistic country today. They might be nearing the bottom on all social-economic scales.

 

[LAUST]

Without knowing it Gr1mL0ck makes my point for me... ignorance must be bliss

 

[Konigin]

Originally posted by: dighn
i think it's more cultural/socioeconomical than genetic.

 

[SilentZero]

Originally posted by: dighn
i think it's more cultural/socioeconomical than genetic.

I agree 100%

 

[SilentZero]

Originally posted by: Slammy1
Is the question:
Asians are gentically superior to caucasions?

I'd be willing to accept that... I'd also be willing to accept that their culture values education strongly and, as a result, they tend to study more and make a serious commitment to education. More than the lazy caucasions.

On a completely unrelated note, do you think the Simpsons would have survived if they were a family of black people?

LOL genetically superior? I don't think any race is "genetically superior" over another. Even having that concept is ignorant. Good thing President Bush didn't read this thread because it might have given him another reason to invade iraq.

I do believe that cultural/social values do play a role in learning.

And the Simpson question....Id also agree that the ACLU and NAACP would sue faster than you could say Johnny Cockren.