Architect offering "Vintage construction" option for home

[NetWareHead]

I've been consulting with an architect about building a new home and he is surprisingly offering a "vintage construction" package when designing homes.

Some of the upgrade items are:

-Cast iron sewer pipes and copper water pipes instead of using PVC. (Cast iron pipes have excellent sound deadening qualities and you won't hear water flow when flushing a toilet)
-True measurement wood framing and beams. E.g. a 2x4 is no longer really 2 inches by 4 inches. This would use real measurements and permit heavy items (cast iron bathtubs, cast iron heating stoves, pool table, gun safes etc... on any level of the house)
-Horsehair plaster and lathe for walls instead of drywalll and sound insulation between rooms.

There are a few more other options available but in total, going with these vintage options would raise the price of the house construction by roughly 25%

Anybody have any experience with this? Is some of this stuff worth it?

 

[SpatiallyAware]

I know about it, and overall they are a pain. There's a reason we don't use cast iron pipes anymore. IMO you're better off overbuilding with modern 'quality' materials.

I also would be very VERY surprised if it were only a 25% markup. This is one of those things where every window, door, truss, on and on have to be designed with that in mind.

 

[Meghan54]

I've been consulting with an architect about building a new home and he is surprisingly offering a "vintage construction" package when designing homes.

Some of the upgrade items are:

-Cast iron sewer pipes and copper water pipes instead of using PVC. (Cast iron pipes have excellent sound deadening qualities and you won't hear water flow when flushing a toilet)

Bullshit. Sound transmits quite easily through cast iron pipes. The copper water pipes, on the other hand, are something worthwhile to investigate. While higher cost, they won't require a total redo of the architecture to install instead of PVC.

-True measurement wood framing and beams. E.g. a 2x4 is no longer really 2 inches by 4 inches. This would use real measurements and permit heavy items (cast iron bathtubs, cast iron heating stoves, pool table, gun safes etc... on any level of the house)

Don't know where the heck he's going to source the boards then, unless he's planning on getting them specially milled, an unnecessary expense that I doubt would serve any beneficial purpose. I've seen cast iron tubs, etc. on second floor rooms with the "not true" measurement wood framing, whatever that is. PS.....all the framing is actually true measured. The architect talking with you is making it sound like if you don't use "true" 2x4's, you're guessing at measurements......what a crock.

-Horsehair plaster and lathe for walls instead of drywalll and sound insulation between rooms.

You ever live with and work with that crap? There are reasons drywall left plaster and lathe behind, besides the obvious cost differential. The plaster walls are more fragile as they age, cracks are very much more difficult to repair vs. holes in the drywall. And heaven help you if the plaster gets wet.

There are a few more other options available but in total, going with these vintage options would raise the price of the house construction by roughly 25%

Anybody have any experience with this? Is some of this stuff worth it?

 

[highland145]

Net, hell no.


Most plumbers couldn't lead a cast iron joint.
PVC is cheap and easy.
I have some plaster, the rest I ripped out. PITA.
True lumber isn't going to allow significantly heavier stuff.
+25%....lol

 

[K1052]

All of those goals can be easily met with modern materials that will long outlive/outlast their predecessors at less cost.

I would be very wary of someone trying to sell this line of bullshit.

 

[darkxshade]

Do they offer construction at "vintage" prices? I wouldn't mind getting one built for oh $100k

 

[Anubis]

no none of it is worth it, just over build using modern stuff if you need to for really heavy items

there is very little 4x4s and 2x6s wont support that end up in normal houses and then they just use the glue laminated wooden beams

we had 2 in the house i grew up in that were 10x20s that held up the entire house (not a single interior load bearing wall) all of it was held by the glue lams

 

[highland145]

Do they offer construction at "vintage" prices? I wouldn't mind getting one built for oh $100k

Whole house from Sears for $12K.

 

[bonkers325]

if your home costs $100,000 to construct, then that means it will cost an extra $25,000 in material and labor costs to use "vintage" materials.

"true measurement" is just rough sewn lumber and isn't really special. you're just essentially paying for a larger piece of wood.

PVC is not allowed in piping in NYC due to fire codes, so pipes here are typically iron or copper anyway. but seriously, when is the sound of rushing water going to annoy you to the point of saying "i wish i spent $25k to rid myself of that sound!"?



if you design your house correctly using modern materials you can put heavy bathtubs wherever you want. i designed a home using steel joists and the owner installed a 4,000 lb bath tub.

 

[slag]

Might be worthwhile if he throws knob and tube wiring in also, preferrably with cloth insulation.

 

[highland145]

Might be worthwhile if he throws knob and tube wiring in also, preferrably with cloth insulation.

And a 6 gallon flush toilet.

 

[skyking]

Cast iron pipe is still the standard in commercial plumbing. ABS/PVC is cheaper, easier, but not necessarily better.

 

[K1052]

PVC is not allowed in piping in NYC due to fire codes, so pipes here are typically iron or copper anyway.

There is concern that PVC pipe will provide pathways for fires to spread in multi unit residential and commercial buildings, still allowable in residental uses under a certain amount of stories It's not a signifigant concern in a single or two story house since the whole structure will be fully involved well before the PVC burn through creates any problems.

 

[lxskllr]

Whole house from Sears for $12K.

One of the offices I was in was a Sears house. Chestnut throughout, including pocket doors. Very nice place.

I'd be willing to deal with vintage hassles on an old place, but I wouldn't want to build that way new. I'd use modern materials, but upgrade stuff like trim, interior doors, and things like that.

 

[jaedaliu]

no none of it is worth it, just over build using modern stuff if you need to for really heavy items

there is very little 4x4s and 2x6s wont support that end up in normal houses and then they just use the glue laminated wooden beams

we had 2 in the house i grew up in that were 10x20s that held up the entire house (not a single interior load bearing wall) all of it was held by the glue lams

The glue laminated wooden beams are ridiculous. You would think a plywood-like construction is weaker, but those things are true, won't warp, and handle incredible stress.

There's a reason why modern construction materials have appeared. They're either good enough for the job at a lower price, or better.

 

[highland145]

Cast iron pipe is still the standard in commercial plumbing. ABS/PVC is cheaper, easier, but not necessarily better.

Did not know that. Assume some type of threaded joint, not the old lead joints.

 

[highland145]

One of the offices I was in was a Sears house. Chestnut throughout, including pocket doors. Very nice place.

I'd be willing to deal with vintage hassles on an old place, but I wouldn't want to build that way new. I'd use modern materials, but upgrade stuff like trim, interior doors, and things like that.

Hate to ask what any door would cost if it's comparable to the ones in my 1937 house.

 

[skyking]

Did not know that. Assume some type of threaded joint, not the old lead joints.

cast iron no hub bands
http://www.fernco.com/plumbing/shielded-couplings/no-hub-couplings
all the pipes and fittings are straight, and connected with these.

 

[Markbnj]

You ever live with and work with that crap? There are reasons drywall left plaster and lathe behind, besides the obvious cost differential. The plaster walls are more fragile as they age, cracks are very much more difficult to repair vs. holes in the drywall. And heaven help you if the plaster gets wet.

This. Some of the stuff on the list is worth considering (copper vs. pvc, heavy duty framing), but there is no way I'd go back to plaster... especially not if you have kids, or ever want kids.

 

[lxskllr]

Hate to ask what any door would cost if it's comparable to the ones in my 1937 house.

Yea, no kidding. That's what I think would be worth paying extra for though. Real wood doors gain character over time instead of just wearing out. They aren't always the most convenient things, but they still look good after 70 years of use.

 

[highland145]

cast iron no hub bands
http://www.fernco.com/plumbing/shielded-couplings/no-hub-couplings
all the pipes and fittings are straight, and connected with these.

I've seen those used on small sections where a piece has been replaced. I'll trust you that they'd work on the whole job.

Yea, no kidding. That's what I think would be worth paying extra for though. Real wood doors gain character over time instead of just wearing out. They aren't always the most convenient things, but they still look good after 70 years of use.

Unless they have 14 coats of paint on them....like the one I'm trying to strip now.

 

[skyking]

My brother and his wife are "addicted" to craftsman architecture for these reasons. They are selling a 1940's craftsman with tons of beautiful built ins, wood details, etc. Moving into a 1920 craftsman
He made a big addition and has paid the price for keeping it consistent. He matched the siding, gable end knees, you name it. Solid brass doorknobs and fittings, all of it looks consistent as you travel from old to new.
This is the place I helped install geothermal heat on, so it is not all old

 

[lxskllr]

Unless they have 14 coats of paint on them....like the one I'm trying to strip now.

I've been helping a friend on his 200 year old house. Stripping paint in no fun. I've done a lot of it with my Leatherman, going through all the beading and joints. On the flip side, it's gone this long without stripping. Just hope when you buy it isn't "that time" :^D

 

[skyking]

My brother has spent the last 6 weeks stripping old paint on trim.

 

[highland145]

My brother has spent the last 6 weeks stripping old paint on trim.

The old lead paint is defying my heat gun.

Hope he's wearing a mask.